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  #21  
Old 08-01-2021, 09:34 AM
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what's the 5th digit of VIN?
looks like an "X" model, very few made compared to regular models and very desirable.
Very nice find for what you paid!
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  #22  
Old 08-01-2021, 09:40 AM
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Well, since you can weld, cutting and patching would be the way to go. Put whatever degree of roll into the patch needed to match the area. The wagoneer roof is pretty flat so you shouldnt need any convex shape to the patch, but if so, you could hammer the patch on a hard surface as needed to put in a little roundness. Further down the road you could cut out the patch and do it better if it didn't come out right. How familiar with body work are you? The real quickie hack way would be fiberglass patch or mesh and tigerhair bondo.
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  #23  
Old 08-01-2021, 10:42 AM
FarmWagoneer FarmWagoneer is offline
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Yep 1414X19 302745. When I was looking at the reader's rig page people made note of 1414X vin numbers and didn't understand why and still don't. I can weld a little but it ain't pretty, maybe fiberglass or something is the way to go for now. It's just too good for my welding ability and I don't want to take out the leather headliner and screw it up. Also if I cut and patch it right that means it needs to be painted which ill never get to match the original color or the rest of the rust patina. Apparently I have to make a decision since it needs to be fixed. Maybe just lift it enough so no one notices the fresh painted roof lol
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  #24  
Old 08-01-2021, 11:16 AM
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if you do a search for 1414x Wagoneer it'll bring up some info...

they were low production
very cool interiors with buckets/floor console w/ shifter

You scored BIG time imho.
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  #25  
Old 08-01-2021, 03:56 PM
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As to the roof repair, if you have a wire feed, not too hard. At the body shop, we would cut a slightly oversized patch after we got back to solid metal, slip it's under hold snug without a lot of tension to avoid pushing the roof up higher. Taking plenty of time to avoid beat buildup, weld it in solid by using single tacks spaced well apart and allow to cool between each go around. Sheet metal on these warps if you look at it crosseyed.

Grind flat with light pressure and cool down time. Don't let the color change as you're grinding, indicates your too hot. I will wire wheel to get the loose weld spatter and clean the residue off. Fill with filler, sand and prime/finish.

As an aside, Buick shrouds are made of platinum, fossilized rooster teeth, and unobtainium.... Hard to come by. A few years ago, someone was thinking about repoping some, but don't know if it ever happened.
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"Beast" - 81 "S" W/T, 85-360, T-18, Lock-rite,wag alloys, 31-10.50 Pro Comp MT's, Warn 8274 in a fabbed bumper/deer strainer(tested and approved)

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  #26  
Old 08-02-2021, 07:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backroadin'
...
Tranny should have a BOP (buick/olds/pontiac) bolt pattern/ bellhousing and you can get adapter plates to swap in GM, jeep, ford engines. I would think another buick 350 would bolt in without issue, but I'm not 100% on that. ...
Yes, another Buick will bolt in. Other GM engines with the BOP pattern will too.

It's a BOP pattern, but not a BOP transmission. From 1965 on, Jeep used the "nailhead" aka "universal" TH400 exclusively prior to 1974ish when they commissioned the AMC-pattern TH400 from GM. This 1970 Jeep transmission has a shorter case than the same-year Buick BOP transmission, and is fitted with an adapter ring to make the BOP pattern. Look under the Jeep and you can see the adapter ring easily.

At some point you might need a replacement torque convertor, and that could be an issue. Each of the adapted Jeep engines (AMC 327 and 232, Buick 225 and 350, and the '71-on AMC engines) had a combination of an adapter ring and sometimes a spacer between the convertor and engine. Check the parts book on the Tom Collins site for details.

Otherwise it's a Buick passenger car engine and TH400, both purchased as commodity components by Jeep from GM.

The 350 is the true Buick small block, and shares exterior dimensions with the 300, 340 and 350 variants. Any of those will drop in. I think the 225/231 V6s will also drop in, but seems impractical.

A big GM V8 has been a "popular" swap into these Jeeps prior to modern times. I recall the big-block Buicks (400, 430, 455) and Cadillacs (472, 500) have been done more than once or twice. IIRC these will bolt up at the back but don't match the existing mounts. Old threads here will cover it.
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Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
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Last edited by tgreese : 08-02-2021 at 08:32 AM.
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  #27  
Old 08-02-2021, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldhammer
... weld it in solid by using single tacks spaced well apart and allow to cool between each go around. Sheet metal on these warps if you look at it crosseyed.
...
MC&P (McCartney Paint & Custom) has (what looks like) an excellent coverage of this on the Garage Journal site. His approach is the same but he planishes each dot to remove local shrinkage, and grinds each dot in turn with a cutoff disk. Looks time consuming, but the claim is no warping.

https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/...ojects.182565/

No personal experience, but it mirrors what Art says and looks reasonable.
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Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
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  #28  
Old 08-02-2021, 08:05 AM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FarmWagoneer
Yep 1414X19 302745. When I was looking at the reader's rig page people made note of 1414X vin numbers and didn't understand why and still don't. I can weld a little but it ain't pretty, maybe fiberglass or something is the way to go for now. It's just too good for my welding ability and I don't want to take out the leather headliner and screw it up. Also if I cut and patch it right that means it needs to be painted which ill never get to match the original color or the rest of the rust patina. Apparently I have to make a decision since it needs to be fixed. Maybe just lift it enough so no one notices the fresh painted roof lol
Suggest you post up a picture of the damage. It's no sin to glue a temporary patch over the hole to keep the weather out, until such point as you can repair it right. Use something like this to 'stabilize' the rust, then near-matching enamel over the patch and rust.

https://www.amazon.com/Permatex-8177.../dp/B000HBNX38

"1414X" is an up-market trim package with bucket seats, center console and wood trim. http://www.ifsja.org/tech/figures/vin68-70.html
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Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk

Last edited by tgreese : 08-02-2021 at 08:11 AM.
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  #29  
Old 08-02-2021, 10:45 AM
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babywag babywag is offline
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You may want to check this one out for parts???

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=190130
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  #30  
Old 08-02-2021, 11:15 AM
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rang-a-stang rang-a-stang is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by backroadin'
...Pretty much all ...were the same throughout the entire wagoneer lifespan. Glass too - including windshields...
The glass is all shaped the same but the 78 and earlier had thicker glass. If you put 79 and later glass into a 78 or earlier, it is mostly OK. But if you put 78 and earlier into a 79 or later it is VERY hard to roll windows up/down. Also, the tailgate window reproduction rubber parts are set for 79 and later so sometimes the scrapers and stuff roll under as the tailgate window goes down.
Picture comparing a 78 and 79 driver door window
Quote:
Originally Posted by babywag
...You scored BIG time imho.
AGREED!! SCOREEEEE!!!!!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by FarmWagoneer
... I can weld a little but it ain't pretty, maybe fiberglass or something is the way to go for now. It's just too good for my welding ability and I don't want to take out the leather headliner and screw it up. Also if I cut and patch it right that means it needs to be painted which ill never get to match the original color or the rest of the rust patina. Apparently I have to make a decision since it needs to be fixed. Maybe just lift it enough so no one notices the fresh painted roof lol
pppllleeeaasse do not use fiberglass. I cannot tell you the horrors I have seen of what fiberglass does when it is used as a patch. I think you would be better off leaving it as is, than sticking fiberglass over it. If you are good with cutting/trimming, maybe you make the patch panel and take it to a shop and pay them to weld it in.

This is going to sound stupid, but you could probably find a good roof and swap the whole thing at some point, too. iapexl8r did it a couple years ago and it was not that big of a deal.
Read this thread and watch his videos. There are clean roofs available.
http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=186044
Of just find someone parting out a rig and ask them to cut you out a roof chunk that is much bigger than you need and use that for your panel.
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  #31  
Old 08-04-2021, 09:55 AM
FarmWagoneer FarmWagoneer is offline
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Thanks everyone for the input, I really appreciate it. I'm going to try and get out to it tonight and see if I can get some tires to hold air for when they pick it up on Friday. I just realized I might have another problem though. There is no key so does that mean I can't get it into neutral? He told me the brakes are locked up anyway so in a way I guess it doesn't matter
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  #32  
Old 08-04-2021, 10:50 AM
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nuetral isn't an issue...
just put the xfer case in nuetral
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  #33  
Old 08-04-2021, 07:45 PM
FarmWagoneer FarmWagoneer is offline
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Duh thanks Babywag. Well I got a couple tires free before my sledgehammer broke, still one left. Trying to make it easier on the tow guys since nobody wants to do it with seized brakes even if I tell them ill bring it down with a tractor. Anyway here's a picture of the roof rot for you helpful guys.
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  #34  
Old 08-04-2021, 07:47 PM
FarmWagoneer FarmWagoneer is offline
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https://flic.kr/p/2mfqbPz
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  #35  
Old 08-04-2021, 07:49 PM
FarmWagoneer FarmWagoneer is offline
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Also some cool stuff in the jeep

https://flic.kr/p/2mfganw


https://flic.kr/p/2mfoKnP
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  #36  
Old 08-06-2021, 09:00 PM
Rusty76 Rusty76 is offline
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Just too cool
I also just picked up a 70 Wagoneer
I just finished painting my 76 which was a rusty mess
So need to update my build
You might be my brother from another mother
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  #37  
Old 08-07-2021, 08:50 AM
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Wow, that's a bigger section than I was picturing, with all the surrounding scaley rust. Nothing impossible however. Looks like you can use whatever you feel comfortable with to patch it up and get it going since it'll take a pretty large patch to replace all that when you do it right, and you'll be cutting out any temporary patch you put on. I like the chrome roof rack

What's with the (80's?) wagoneer in your flicker pics?
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"When this baby reaches 88 miles per hour, you're gonna to see some serious sht!"

73 Wagoneer - 4.6L Stroker (yeah baby!!) t176/d300, 3.73's, 33" muds, 4"spring lift, 2" body. Offy dualport w/ Quadrajet, pertronix, flowmaster.
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  #38  
Old 08-07-2021, 05:08 PM
FarmWagoneer FarmWagoneer is offline
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Yeah it's not great but ill take it because it's the best New York has to offer in my cheap price range. I don't think I put up the wrong picture but I'm guessing you seen the 81 from my Flickr account which I had no idea those links were connected to my whole account. Anyway the 81 is the disaster I bought last year and started this wagoneer obsession. I'll have to put up some pics of what was left of the floors and frame.. I spent way too much and it needed way more work than I thought. Thats when I learned to mig weld a bit and thanks to you guys eventually it came back to life. My coworkers think I'm out of my mind for buying another old wagoneer and maybe I am but I'm having fun
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  #39  
Old 08-07-2021, 05:55 PM
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Those heavy rust spots are paper thin and ready to go through. The bigger ones you could probably poke through with an unbent paper clip. Would be a lot better and easier to replace the whole roof skin if you can locate one. Don't know what years will direct interchange.
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"Beast" - 81 "S" W/T, 85-360, T-18, Lock-rite,wag alloys, 31-10.50 Pro Comp MT's, Warn 8274 in a fabbed bumper/deer strainer(tested and approved)

88 XJ, 3" lift, 31-10.50's, custom bumpers and winch/tow bar mounts, Warn 9500HS, custom sliders/steps, camo paint, & headliner

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  #40  
Old 08-09-2021, 02:22 AM
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You should join the Buick V8 forum if you plan to rebuild that 350, or any other Buick V8.

Buick V8s have some rather unique things about them that you must get right when you build them, or else they eat themselves alive.

They are good engines but they are not tolerant of careless machine shops that build them like a Chevrolet. The result is an oil burner with low oil pressure that destroys itself in short order. I've been there and done that on my Buick.
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