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  #1  
Old 04-02-2009, 04:26 PM
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TheJeeper TheJeeper is offline
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Location: Cadiz, KY
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What 4-speed will swap into 230 with stock T-90 bellhousing?

I know they offered the T-98 4-speed but they are hard to come by in my area. Did they use the same bell housing for it as the T-90?
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'65 J200: 230ci., T90A-1, built with T90J input shaft, Spicer 18, 2.47:1, D44s: 4.27s. 31x11.50x15 vintage Star M/Ts

Regarding a manual valve-bodied auto... "To me that's like trying to play a fiddle with a sawzall."

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  #2  
Old 04-02-2009, 07:57 PM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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I don't know for absolute certain, but I would bet that the T-90 pattern is way different from the T-98 pattern. The 230 has the same pattern as the old 226 flathead, but is not like any other engine. Not a lot of options.

If you can't find a T-98, I think your best route is to swap in a different engine and its matching 4-speed. For example, you could use a Chevy 250 and a SM465, or a Ford 300 and T-18 or NP435, then adapt the truck 4-speed to your transfer case. A Jeep 258 and T-18 is another possibility, though likely less common than a Ford or Chevy.
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Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
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  #3  
Old 04-02-2009, 08:01 PM
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trellis8 trellis8 is offline
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I have 2 T98s. One is for my Gladiator, I'd sell the other. A bit of a drive for you, though.
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  #4  
Old 04-02-2009, 09:41 PM
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TheJeeper TheJeeper is offline
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With bell housing? how many miles are on it?
Quote:
Originally Posted by trellis8
I have 2 T98s. One is for my Gladiator, I'd sell the other. A bit of a drive for you, though.
__________________
'65 J200: 230ci., T90A-1, built with T90J input shaft, Spicer 18, 2.47:1, D44s: 4.27s. 31x11.50x15 vintage Star M/Ts

Regarding a manual valve-bodied auto... "To me that's like trying to play a fiddle with a sawzall."

Nothing in written by me in ANY post can be used without my written consent.

~Eli's Jeep Supply~
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  #5  
Old 04-03-2009, 05:16 AM
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trellis8 trellis8 is offline
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Yes with the bell, and I don't know the mileage. One was from a driver which worked well, not sure about the other. Both still have shifters and seem to go through the gears.
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1979 Widetrack Cherokee, 1984 Grand Wagoneer, 1985 Grand Wagoneer, 1973 J4000, 1982 Mustang GT, 1999 Chevy C2500 xcab, 2001 Chevy Van, 2000 Ford Expedition, 1989 F250 plow and 1951 Desoto Deluxe
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2009, 04:38 PM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Location: Medford MA USA
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Strap it to a pallet and ship it Forward Air.

The Borg-Warner 4-speeds are very durable, and it's probably ok unless it has very, very high miles. I'd worry more about the 230 than the T-98.

Not to be a wet blanket, but 230s are only realistic for "restoration" hobby cars, IMO. If you get the T-98, and the 230 poops out, you'd either be stuck with an oddball transmission or have to spend a lot of money and time on the engine. Think about how strong your commitment is to this engine...
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Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk

Last edited by tgreese : 04-03-2009 at 04:41 PM.
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  #7  
Old 04-04-2009, 11:38 PM
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TheJeeper TheJeeper is offline
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I'm going to wheel it and drive it. I.E, lift, 35's, 4-speed, 4 to 1 low kit for the D20, other odds and ends. But I'd like to keep the original engine because, well to put it frankly, I think its very cool. Mine runs surprisingly well. Aside from the fact that cyl. #6 is weak. It missed until I got a high spark, spark plug for it. But other than that I really like the mill, it seems pretty tourquey. And I have a very primitive shop setup, so it would be a very time consuming process to swap it to a 258 or something similar. I can rebuild the tornado for anywhere from $500 (head work including only grinding the valve seats and new valve seals, redo the bottom end, just basic, reusing the same pistons) to all out, for $1,000 (all new hand ground stainless valves, new pistons, crankshaft and the like). But I think I can get by with just a basic rebuild when it comes time, but for now, I'll run 'er 'till she dies.
__________________
'65 J200: 230ci., T90A-1, built with T90J input shaft, Spicer 18, 2.47:1, D44s: 4.27s. 31x11.50x15 vintage Star M/Ts

Regarding a manual valve-bodied auto... "To me that's like trying to play a fiddle with a sawzall."

Nothing in written by me in ANY post can be used without my written consent.

~Eli's Jeep Supply~
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  #8  
Old 04-05-2009, 07:43 AM
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tgreese tgreese is offline
 
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Location: Medford MA USA
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Well, if you are committed, more power to you. I'll make a couple comments, if I may.

First, I think your estimates on repair costs for the 230 are not very realistic. Maybe you have an inexpensive source for replacement parts, and maybe shop costs where you live are a lot lower than what I would estimate. I think that basic overhaul parts would easily exceed your $500 estimate, without any machine work. The usual parts source for these engines is Kanter, and they aren't cheap.

If it were mine, I'd look around for a spare engine or two. Fill the bores with oil and put away for a rainy day.

Last, I don't think there's an inexpensive source for 4:1 gears for the Dana 20. They used to exist (and may still), but they were made in very low volume, were very expensive and required case grinding to fit. The widely available Tera gears will give you 3:1, at about $700/set last time I looked. There's also a budget way to upgrade to 2.46:1 using Dana 18 parts and a Bronco 6-cylinder D20 gear. The Bronco gear is available new for around $200 IIRC.

Good luck with your project - I think your best option is to get that T-98 and install it.
__________________
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk
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  #9  
Old 04-05-2009, 04:12 PM
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TheJeeper TheJeeper is offline
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Join Date: Mar 31, 2009
Location: Cadiz, KY
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I need to clarify that I was referring to rebuilding it myself. I found a website a while ago that you could get a rebuild kit for $850 (new everything). If I can remember it I will link it for everyone. I also found a place that I can get a rebuilt 230 for $1200 if I send in my core. Otherwise the core charge is like $350. And yes I have a local machine shop with relatively cheap prices.

I have been looking for a extra 230 locally to no avail. These things are rare as a blue moon where I'm at.

And thanks for the tip about the Bronco D20 gears. I may do that.

I'm attempting to get an estimate for shipping the T-98 right now.
__________________
'65 J200: 230ci., T90A-1, built with T90J input shaft, Spicer 18, 2.47:1, D44s: 4.27s. 31x11.50x15 vintage Star M/Ts

Regarding a manual valve-bodied auto... "To me that's like trying to play a fiddle with a sawzall."

Nothing in written by me in ANY post can be used without my written consent.

~Eli's Jeep Supply~
Reply With Quote
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