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  #1  
Old 10-21-2012, 08:54 AM
pratty85 pratty85 is offline
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64 Kaiser Wagoneer 2dr, Factory Manual, Cummins 3.9l 4bta conversion

Hello all!
I am the proud owner of a 64 Kaiser Wagoneer 2dr Factory manual, factory 4wd. And I am going to stuff a Cummins 4bta in it!!

I bought the vehicle from Minneapolis, MN.....Rust bucket!!! The front floor was completely destroyed along with seat mounts. But the rear floor, front clip, hood, dash were in great shape and it has all the original glass too!

I had my doubts whether to take on this rusty of a project, but I love the 2 doors! And this one is a crown jewel. Someone needed to save it! So I am completely taking everything apart.



One thing about this vehicle that intrigued me was the front 4wd setup. First every IFS????? and the steering geometry....wow


I decided that I wasn't going to be able to use this setup for what I wanted...So I decided to do a rolling chassis swap from a 1977 Wagoneer that has factory D44's and leaf springs front and rear. It had a 401 in it but I pulled that out and gave it to the owner as part of the deal since I will be using a 4bt. I am also going to be using the floor out of the 77 because its in amazing shape!! as well as all the factory steering and brakes etc.

I have already pulled the 64 body(I welded it braces to ensure integrity due to the floor being completely gone), off the rolling 64 chassis and it is complete!!! 1964 factory 4wd IFS wagoneer chassis so if anyone is interested shoot me a pm. I will have more pics coming soon, this is going to be a huge project with a lot of fabrication and I am looking forward to it!

Final plans:
Go anywhere Expeditionary rig
6" spring-over lift
35" tires
custom made bumpers w/front and rear winches
Intercooled 4bt swap with NV5600 and NP205 Tcase
Roof rack

Last edited by pratty85 : 10-21-2012 at 09:14 AM.
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  #2  
Old 10-21-2012, 09:25 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Great-looking project. I did a body swap recently so I may be able to help if you get stuck. When first looking at the pictures it piqued my interest because I haven't seen anyone working on an IFS chassis.

I hope you have someplace warm and covered to work on it! I know New-braska winters aren't easy.

You might want to cross-post this on fsjnetwork.com too (if you haven't already).

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  #3  
Old 10-21-2012, 11:29 AM
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Resbum Resbum is offline
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VERY NICE. Subscribed
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Resbum
"What year is my truck?... Which part?" Build thread- http://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/view...p=18290#p18290
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  #4  
Old 10-21-2012, 11:40 AM
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FSJunkie FSJunkie is offline
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The early FSJ IFS setup was very interesting. It used torsion bars just like Chryslers did, and they were reported to handle great. Too bad the IFS setup used the screwy belcrank steering system instead of a saginaw box. Jeep did design that IFS to be used offroad, es evidenced by the steering stabilizer and loads of suspension travel. A Motortrend test drive of a Wagoneer with IFS praised the way it soaked up bumps on rough roads.

If it was me, I would keep the IFS and fabricate in a Saginaw power steering box.
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  #5  
Old 10-21-2012, 01:18 PM
pratty85 pratty85 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FSJunkie
If it was me, I would keep the IFS and fabricate in a Saginaw power steering box.

I have gone back and fourth with that idea, but I know that 77 chassis with D44's will support the 4bta just fine. And I don't want to work around that huge cross-member while making custom motor mounts for a 900lb motor. I also plan on moving the rear spring hangers back a few inches and trimming just the back part of my fenders by 4 inch (approx). Then getting longer custom leaf springs to recenter the axle in the widened wheel well.

Yeah Midwest winters are rough, I do have a heated shop, but as you can tell with the pictures I share the space. So please be patient guys, this is going to take awhile. It has taken a year to get to this point since I bought the Kaiser
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  #6  
Old 10-21-2012, 01:33 PM
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Cecil14 Cecil14 is offline
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That IFS could be the greatest thing since sliced bread...but I would guess parts are even less than unavailable. It was only used for what...2-3 years? I'd bet nearly everything would be custom made, even simple maintenance items.

For a good reliable driver, standard available parts are the way to go. I know it seems boring, and I'm all for unique, but something like that belongs on a factory resto. It's just too oddball and expensive for the average joe.


aa
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  #7  
Old 10-21-2012, 11:57 PM
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mud89 mud89 is offline
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Jeep was definitely a forerunner with IFS and 4WD as soon as 1962..
IIRC they drop IFS in 65, because it was not reliable enough for offroad and also because demand was low
IFS was only available for the models with the Tornado engine
Do you have the serial number of this rare bird ?
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Last edited by mud89 : 10-22-2012 at 12:04 AM.
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  #8  
Old 10-22-2012, 04:49 AM
pratty85 pratty85 is offline
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I have the Kaiser identification plate with serial number. Ile post it later. as far as I know it was a tornado, 3 on the tree, 4wd IFS with manual hubs, and a 2 door.
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  #9  
Old 10-22-2012, 07:01 AM
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mud89 mud89 is offline
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Ok, thanks, should be 1412 something
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  #10  
Old 10-22-2012, 08:07 AM
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The PIG Smith The PIG Smith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FSJunkie
If it was me, I would keep the IFS and fabricate in a Saginaw power steering box.
I second this idea.

...only IF the IFS parts are in good shape.
As has been mentioned already, these IFS are made from unobtainium.

There was a post here some years about these IFS being cross referenced with other front parts parts from other manufacturer
As I recall, someone put some time and effort into digging out that information.

I cannot find it now.
The search here stinks and my searching with Google against this site has resulted in nothing.
Am I dreaming or does anyone else remember this?

If far as I know, there are no members here that own a IFS equipped rig that is a running, driving vehicle.
(Oh please, I hope I am wrong!)
So, if I had a chance to be one of those with a working IFS rig (or maybe the only one) then I would all over that.

The sad unfortunate fact, that once you started driving it, these unobtainium begin to wear.
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1982 J10: Replacement engine now sitting in the truck! No Cab Brow! Future DD
1981 J20: Commercial flat bed. Long term Project: RUST! No Cab Brow!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayrodoh
...but if it works, I wouldn't touch it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindel
Best laid plans, yada yada yada...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ristow
because Ristow sez so
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  #11  
Old 10-22-2012, 08:42 AM
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Resbum Resbum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pratty85


Final plans:
Go anywhere Expeditionary rig
6" spring-over lift
35" tires
custom made bumpers w/front and rear winches
Intercooled 4bt swap with NV5600 and NP205 Tcase
Roof rack

I notice in the first picture the cool 4X4 van w/ roof rack in the background. Between that and your "
Go anywhere Expeditionary rig" comment I wondered if this was what you're interested in doing:

http://www.expeditionportal.com/

If so, we may have to stay in touch. Although I've never mentioned it in my thread, one of the things I've been really interested in doing with my truck is a figure 8 lap around N & S America's. I've done some things during my build with just that thought in mind.

Also, converting over to a Dana front axle makes even more sense. You definitely don't want to be stuck in boondocks S. America with an exotic IFS front end.

With a 4BT and Dana front end your Kaiser Wagoneer would be a perfect expedition rig.
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"What year is my truck?... Which part?" Build thread- http://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/view...p=18290#p18290
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  #12  
Old 10-22-2012, 09:54 AM
pratty85 pratty85 is offline
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Yeah exactly Resbum! Actually, this is my other build thread at the Expo:http://www.expeditionportal.com/foru...Build-Overview

I wanted to build a pure mechanical vehicle as an expeditionary rig and something that has a shorter turn radius.

That diesel 4x4 van is my daily driver.

Last edited by pratty85 : 10-22-2012 at 10:07 AM.
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  #13  
Old 10-23-2012, 04:33 AM
pratty85 pratty85 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mud89
Jeep was definitely a forerunner with IFS and 4WD as soon as 1962..
IIRC they drop IFS in 65, because it was not reliable enough for offroad and also because demand was low
IFS was only available for the models with the Tornado engine
Do you have the serial number of this rare bird ?


Kaiser Serial # 1412-11590
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  #14  
Old 10-23-2012, 07:30 AM
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Resbum Resbum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pratty85
Yeah exactly Resbum! Actually, this is my other build thread at the Expo:http://www.expeditionportal.com/foru...Build-Overview

I wanted to build a pure mechanical vehicle as an expeditionary rig and something that has a shorter turn radius.

That diesel 4x4 van is my daily driver.
Cool beans! I'll check your other thread.
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Originally Posted by Resbum
"What year is my truck?... Which part?" Build thread- http://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/view...p=18290#p18290
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  #15  
Old 10-23-2012, 08:05 AM
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fulsizjeep fulsizjeep is offline
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I would have removed the grille assembly and crushed it just so I could share pictures on this forum.
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  #16  
Old 10-23-2012, 08:20 AM
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Wow! I just visited your Yeti thread. Now I can't wait to see what you have in mind for this build.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Resbum
"What year is my truck?... Which part?" Build thread- http://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/view...p=18290#p18290
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  #17  
Old 10-23-2012, 08:20 AM
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The PIG Smith The PIG Smith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fulsizjeep
I would have removed the grille assembly and crushed it just so I could share pictures on this forum.
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Bryan Smith
1982 J10: Replacement engine now sitting in the truck! No Cab Brow! Future DD
1981 J20: Commercial flat bed. Long term Project: RUST! No Cab Brow!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayrodoh
...but if it works, I wouldn't touch it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindel
Best laid plans, yada yada yada...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ristow
because Ristow sez so
When the IFSJA forum has a problem go here:
www.fsjnetwork.com

Last edited by The PIG Smith : 10-23-2012 at 08:28 AM.
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  #18  
Old 10-23-2012, 10:09 AM
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Gambler68 Gambler68 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Resbum

With a 4BT and Dana front end your Kaiser Wagoneer would be a perfect expedition rig.

With a lot of frame re-enforcing. I've cut up enough 60's FSJs..the frame steel is like butter. Spring over later D44s will require SUF conversion..take a peek at my build link in my sig. A dodge Dana 60 rear should be a nice upgrade for the rear in the Wag.
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Old 10-23-2012, 01:07 PM
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The PIG Smith The PIG Smith is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gambler68
With a lot of frame re-enforcing. I've cut up enough 60's FSJs..the frame steel is like butter.
Are you saying that newer (let's say late 70's to the end) model FSJ have better steel in their frames?
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Bryan Smith
1982 J10: Replacement engine now sitting in the truck! No Cab Brow! Future DD
1981 J20: Commercial flat bed. Long term Project: RUST! No Cab Brow!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayrodoh
...but if it works, I wouldn't touch it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindel
Best laid plans, yada yada yada...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ristow
because Ristow sez so
When the IFSJA forum has a problem go here:
www.fsjnetwork.com
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  #20  
Old 10-23-2012, 01:17 PM
pratty85 pratty85 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gambler68
With a lot of frame re-enforcing. I've cut up enough 60's FSJs..the frame steel is like butter. Spring over later D44s will require SUF conversion..take a peek at my build link in my sig. A dodge Dana 60 rear should be a nice upgrade for the rear in the Wag.


That iss why I am using everything from the frame down from the 77 Wagoneer that had the 401 in it. its essentially a 64 body on a 77 frame and chassis. With some good motor mounts it will be just fine.

Last edited by pratty85 : 10-23-2012 at 02:19 PM.
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