SOA question

[firedriver]

I'm ordering parts on Monday for My '83 Wag. One qiestion that I can't seen to find an answer to is; when installing the new SOA perches by TT's is there any welding that needs to be done on the differential itself? I know the perches need to be welded to the axle tube but I can't tell in any pics that I look at if it gets weldeed to the diff. The reason I ask is that it is my understanding that it is not recommended to weld to cast metal, which is what the diff is, I think.
Thanks in advance.

[Chief Gunner]

I am not sure for all Jeeps, but I did have to weld a little on my diff. I ground it down a little to make the perch fit. A friend of mine did the welding, so I don't know if there was anythign special that he did. Hopefully, people smarter then me on this subject will chime in.

[oldyellowwagoneer]

Again:

This is the answer I give on all the soa posts I respond to:

If you're going to regear and use bigger tires you would be both time and money, not to mention a better turning radius and wider-safer stance, by buying 3/4 ton running gear out of a chevy or dodge with the gearing you want already in them. The fronts bolt right in and the dodge rears will also with no perch mods needed. I'm not sure if the chevy rears will but its a heck of alot easier to weld perches on the rear axle than the fronts. Now you have 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, or better axles with the gearing you need for a fraction of what it would cost just to regear your existing axles. Also the front is wider so you can turn those bigger tires in a tighter radius without hitting your springs or having to cut grind and weld on your too narrow 1/2 ton stock axles. People are selling chevy 44/14bolt combos all the time for 500 or less and you can sell your stock axles to the baby jeep guys for about that or more. the rear can be lifted either with the rear shackle kit or you can go the junkyard route by welding or bolting on the spring perches from the front of 70's- 90's dodge trucks under the existing spring mounts. you can buy extended brake lines for the front and use either a rear extended line or, if you use a dodge rear out of a 4x4,the factory dodge hose which is plenty long enough even for 11" of suspension lift. You just need to buy a 75 cent brake line adapter to hook it to the jeep hard line.
The steering will need to be addressed the same way whichever way you choose to go.
So, if you figure in the cost of the kit,gears,carriers, and the fabrication time it makes much more sense to buy axles that already have the gears and the perchs where they belong and sell your old axles to recoup your cost. the rear can be lifted with the rear perch kits (which even I admit are good units) for ease and to save junkyard scrounging time, or maybe with the junkyard mounts if you want to save money and have time to do it that way.
The benefit of using other axles is they are wider so they keep the center of gravity down and turn alot sharper than you could with narrowtrack axles with bigger tires on them, you dont have to take a chance with your life on the welded front end, or deal with possible axle seal leaks if you get the seals too hot while welding the perches on.
Dennis

[247pia]

I have welded many cast iron center sections with no problems at all. 110v mig even works.

If you want to be safe either using a mig or stick then pre heat the weld area with a torch then cover with insulation to let it cool down evenly.

Once it is back to room temperature (I usually wait till the next day or evening if I do it in the morning) Heat the welded area and 1/4" around the weld with a torch then cover and let cool again. This gets the molecules in the two different metals flowing in the same direction.

The cast iron center section is nodular and not like most cast that you think of and welds very easy.

My last truck I welded with a 110v mig and no pre or post heating was done. Though it's not in service yet I have no apprehension driving my family around in it.

Edit: As old yellowwagoneer stated above about the axles seals leaking. If you pre and post heat you need to disassemble and remove the seals. If you just weld then your seals will be fine.

[wag4x6]

I just got done doing a SOA on my 89. I used a 220v mig using 75/25 Argon/CO2 mix gas. I turned up the heat to penetrate the diff housing and burned in great.

[Tad]

Originally Posted by wag4x6

I just got done doing a SOA on my 89. I used a 220v mig using 75/25 Argon/CO2 mix gas. I turned up the heat to penetrate the diff housing and burned in great.

Nice Job!

Yep, just weld it.
Bigger axles are always nice but there are hundreds of those perches out there welded to the diff.

[Chief Gunner]

Like I said, smarter people then I have chimed in.

[Mr.Happyface]

Originally Posted by firedriver

I'm ordering parts on Monday for My '83 Wag. One qiestion that I can't seen to find an answer to is; when installing the new SOA perches by TT's is there any welding that needs to be done on the differential itself? I know the perches need to be welded to the axle tube but I can't tell in any pics that I look at if it gets weldeed to the diff. The reason I ask is that it is my understanding that it is not recommended to weld to cast metal, which is what the diff is, I think.
Thanks in advance.

I welded mine with an arc welder and used regular rod on the side with the tube and nickel rod on the side with the pumpkin.

[wag4x6]

Originally Posted by Tad

Nice Job!

Yep, just weld it.
Bigger axles are always nice but there are hundreds of those perches out there welded to the diff.

Thank you sir

[Blake]

Originally Posted by oldyellowwagoneer

Again:

This is the answer I give on all the soa posts I respond to:

If you're going to regear and use bigger tires you would be both time and money, not to mention a better turning radius and wider-safer stance, by buying 3/4 ton running gear out of a chevy or dodge with the gearing you want already in them. The fronts bolt right in and the dodge rears will also with no perch mods needed. I'm not sure if the chevy rears will but its a heck of alot easier to weld perches on the rear axle than the fronts. Now you have 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, or better axles with the gearing you need for a fraction of what it would cost just to regear your existing axles. Also the front is wider so you can turn those bigger tires in a tighter radius without hitting your springs or having to cut grind and weld on your too narrow 1/2 ton stock axles. People are selling chevy 44/14bolt combos all the time for 500 or less and you can sell your stock axles to the baby jeep guys for about that or more. the rear can be lifted either with the rear shackle kit or you can go the junkyard route by welding or bolting on the spring perches from the front of 70's- 90's dodge trucks under the existing spring mounts. you can buy extended brake lines for the front and use either a rear extended line or, if you use a dodge rear out of a 4x4,the factory dodge hose which is plenty long enough even for 11" of suspension lift. You just need to buy a 75 cent brake line adapter to hook it to the jeep hard line.
The steering will need to be addressed the same way whichever way you choose to go.
So, if you figure in the cost of the kit,gears,carriers, and the fabrication time it makes much more sense to buy axles that already have the gears and the perchs where they belong and sell your old axles to recoup your cost. the rear can be lifted with the rear perch kits (which even I admit are good units) for ease and to save junkyard scrounging time, or maybe with the junkyard mounts if you want to save money and have time to do it that way.
The benefit of using other axles is they are wider so they keep the center of gravity down and turn alot sharper than you could with narrowtrack axles with bigger tires on them, you dont have to take a chance with your life on the welded front end, or deal with possible axle seal leaks if you get the seals too hot while welding the perches on.
Dennis

X2

After performing SOA on two FSJ's and a couple of Scouts, and then recently doing the 'bolt in' SOA using a ford 3/4 ton front and dodge 1 ton rear, my vote is definitley the later.

There are soooo many advantages to using 8 lug axles; wider stance, FF rear axle, lower gears, much stronger, better turning, etc.

But yes, if you wanna keep the small axles, have the potential for the stock rear semi-float bearing to break ( and leave you stranded), narrow width, etc, then yes, you can certainly weld to the cast housing and yes it will work.

Check out my Goofy build (link in my sig) before you decide.

[Gambler68]

for the pass drop crowd, remember a 75ish K5 HD44 is bolt in as well..I measured the perch holes at 31 5/8s to 3/4s and that's real close to FSJ perch width at 31.5...but I am spacing my spring mounts out so there's no bend in the springs. 8lug and SOA factory on that axle. Bonus is nice cheap GM disc brake hardware

[Blake]

yup - a GM front D60 is also bolt-in.

The bigger axles have much bigger brakes too.

[firedriver]

As always, y'all have helped me out once again. Thanks for the replies. Maybe one day I can return the favor.

Old Yellow wag- I agree with you, and considered going one ton from the start already. I have decided to go with what I got for now. Thinking that in a year or 2 I will go 1 ton. This way I can get it lifted and trail capable now, and I can concentrate on a few other issues while I look for some Dodge 1 ton axles. I feel like I should still be able to sell my 1/2 ton stuff when I do get the others in place. I do appreciate your input, as it is solid advice. Thanks again.

[oldyellowwagoneer]

It doesn't have to be one ton axles. 3/4 or even 1/2 swap as well.
Dennis

[firedriver]

Well, 3/4 or 1 ton I guess I should say. Talking to a friend of mine today and he tells me he has a corperate 14 bolt with 4.10 gears that he will give me....maybe I will wait a week or 2 and see what I can come up with.

[motion vega]

im now rethinking selling my h1 wheels and tires and putting my ford d60s under the 88 waggy...........

[Tad]

Originally Posted by firedriver

...and I can concentrate on a few other issues while I look for some Dodge 1 ton axles...

Unless you want to venture into transfer case swaps (very doable) you will be looking for Ford axles to match your driver side front output t-case. '78-79 front is a bolt in IIRC.

[firedriver]

Originally Posted by Tad

Unless you want to venture into transfer case swaps (very doable) you will be looking for Ford axles to match your driver side front output t-case. '78-79 front is a bolt in IIRC.

Oh yeah, I forget about the drivers side drop. Hmmm, my brother has a '79 F-350 camper special that is prety rusted out. Maybe I need to see if he is willing to part with that truck.