Carburetor

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • J10blues
    258 I6
    • Mar 21, 2014
    • 395

    Carburetor

    I've been working on my Edelbrock 1406 again cause the old "hard start" after engine is warm seems to be getting worse.
    I've decided that this issue has nothing to do with fuel percolating because after driving it all day and then parking it for the rest of the night till the morning the Jeep will always crank up without a hitch, very quickly, if fuel had evaporated overnight, it will not start right up like that. This is what I've done so far because the Edelbrock techs have told me that it's a fuel boil issue compounded with the fuel these days that are engineered for the FI cars. Changed the base insulator from a 1/2 inch thick to 1 inch thick phenolic, adjusted my choke to specifications according to their website, made sure there are no leaks at the base of the carburetor, checked and rechecked all vacuum lines(all lines are new), set my idle mixture with a vacuum gauge and a portable tach, insulated all the fuel lines within the engine compartment, installed a new electric fuel pump and regulator, adjusted the regulator to 5.5 psi, new fuel filters both before the fuel pump and after, and still the problem persists. In the morning on the initial start up, it starts up every time, I depress my accelerator once to close the choke plate and then crank and it starts up quickly, then after idling at 1k rpm a couple of minutes I nudge my accelerator and the idle comes down to 700 rpm, put it in drive and the idle drops to 500 rpm, drive it about 10 miles and park. Within 10-15 mins. when I return to crank her up, it won't start until I pump the accelerator pedal 3 or 4 times while cranking, then it runs rough for a few seconds, probably from flooding, then smooths out and it's back to normal. I've even tried leaving the hood propped hoping it will cool when I return but still won't start right away. I've been told by many to toss the Eddy and get a Holley and I might just do that but I have to say that this carburetor is fairly new and I dread forking out another 300+ bucks for a Holley if there is a possibility that there is a solution and a simple one at that. I've already considered that it might be an ignition issue but I've gone over just about everything that might be overheating like the starter solenoid, TFI coil, etc. Also had an old alternator shop downtown go over my electrical system and all checked out fine.
    Last edited by J10blues; 04-01-2016, 11:08 PM.

    Ben
    77 J10
    360 complete rebuild
    TH400
    Eddy Performer intake/Non EGR/CompCams 268 H
    Eddy 1406
    MSD 4AL/MSD 8519Dist/TFI coil
    Holley fuel pump
    MagnaFlow exhaust

    02 Jeep Wrangler TJ
    _________________________________________
    "Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final, You Need To Be Slow..In a Hurry!" Wyatt Earp.
  • wiley-moeracing
    350 Buick
    • Feb 15, 2010
    • 1430

    #2
    so your idle in gear is to low(500), but when normal what is it when in gear? after sitting and when starting are you getting spark (3-4 pumps of accelerator)?

    Comment

    • Ristow
      • Jan 20, 2006
      • 17292

      #3
      tech's will spend a whole lot of someone elses money,won't they?

      the electric fuel pump alone would take care of the empty fuel bowls in the morning.

      wanna be sure,and do it for free? next time it sits for the amount of time it takes to cause problems....remove the top of the carb and look with your eyeballs how much fuel is in the bowls.

      if there is fuel,look elsewhere. if there is not,next time wait a few second so that electric pump can refill them before you crank.

      if an edelbrock tech told me tires were black and round i'd go verify it first. those clowns don't design or build carburetors. they bought the rights to one designed and by someone else,and made elsewhere.
      Originally posted by Hankrod
      Ristows right.................again,


      Originally posted by Fasts79Chief
      ... like the little 'you know what's' that you are.


      Originally posted by Fasts79Chief
      I LOVE how Ristow has stolen my comment about him ... "Quoted" it ... and made himself famous for being an ***hole to people. Hahahahahahahahahha!

      It's like you're unraveling a big cable-knit sweater that someone keeps knitting...and knitting...and knitting...and knitting...

      Comment

      • serehill
        Gone,Never Forgotten.
        • Nov 22, 2009
        • 8619

        #4
        This

        Try this instead of throwing money at it. Both carburetors most likely will have the same issues.
        When warm. Turn the key on let the pump run for 4 to 6 seconds pump the gas pedal one time BEFORE you try to start it. I believe your assessment of it not having anything to do with percolation is incorrect.
        I'm not a fan of the regulators but whatever floats your boat.

        80 Cherokee
        360 ci 727 with
        Comp cams 270 h
        NP208
        Edlebrock performer intake
        Holley 4180
        Msd total multi spark.
        4" rusty's springs
        Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association

        If you can't make it better why waste your time. No use repeating the orignal mistakes. I'm to old to push it that's why.

        Comment

        • J10blues
          258 I6
          • Mar 21, 2014
          • 395

          #5
          Thanks for the help guys! Ristow, I agree about the tech guys! LOL! Guess they gotta make their money somehow!
          Serehill, I'm trying a JEG's 555-15913 electric fuel pump that's supposed to be factory set to put out 6.5 psi but my pressure gauge was reading 9 psi so I decided to install a regulator and adjusted it down to 5.5 psi as what's specified for the Ededbrock carb. I know it'll run with a lot lower psi but thinking it might make a difference with the hard start I thought I'd just throw it in there but still that didn't help. Oh well, I'll keep trying but like someone here said, these are 30+ year old cars......yada...yada!

          Ben
          77 J10
          360 complete rebuild
          TH400
          Eddy Performer intake/Non EGR/CompCams 268 H
          Eddy 1406
          MSD 4AL/MSD 8519Dist/TFI coil
          Holley fuel pump
          MagnaFlow exhaust

          02 Jeep Wrangler TJ
          _________________________________________
          "Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final, You Need To Be Slow..In a Hurry!" Wyatt Earp.

          Comment

          • KilroyJC
            232 I6
            • Feb 08, 2016
            • 151

            #6
            At this point, I would find someone close by who has the same carb on the same engine, who is NOT having these problems, and beg/plead/cajole/promise them a case of beer/cry that they let you swap their working carb onto your rig, and your PITA carb onto theirs, and see if the issues transfer between vehicles. If they do, GREAT! If they do not . . .
            1963 1414 Armstrong Power Steering & Windows, no radio/reverse lights/hazards/seatbelts

            1993 Chevy Caprice Wagon -1971 Honda CL175 - 1978 Honda CX500 - Bobcat 610

            Gone but not forgotten:
            1975 Chevy Impala Sport Coupe; 1933 Chrysler CQ coupe; 1970 AMC Ambassador Wagon; 1985 Chevy Caprice Wagon; 1975 Starcraft Holiday18 w/1976 Evinrude 70hp

            Comment

            • J10blues
              258 I6
              • Mar 21, 2014
              • 395

              #7
              Originally posted by KilroyJC
              At this point, I would find someone close by who has the same carb on the same engine, who is NOT having these problems, and beg/plead/cajole/promise them a case of beer/cry that they let you swap their working carb onto your rig, and your PITA carb onto theirs, and see if the issues transfer between vehicles. If they do, GREAT! If they do not . . .

              LOL KilroyJC!! I just wish it was that simple but the fact is that everyone I know this side of the Cascades drive modern cars.......I know, it sucks but what can I say, us FSJ owners are a rare breed! Good idea though, if you weren't on the other side of the country perhaps you and I would be buds, even if you don't run an Edelbrock carb!LOL!!

              Ben
              77 J10
              360 complete rebuild
              TH400
              Eddy Performer intake/Non EGR/CompCams 268 H
              Eddy 1406
              MSD 4AL/MSD 8519Dist/TFI coil
              Holley fuel pump
              MagnaFlow exhaust

              02 Jeep Wrangler TJ
              _________________________________________
              "Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final, You Need To Be Slow..In a Hurry!" Wyatt Earp.

              Comment

              • serehill
                Gone,Never Forgotten.
                • Nov 22, 2009
                • 8619

                #8
                LOl

                Simply try my recommendation before you do anything it won't cost you a dime.

                80 Cherokee
                360 ci 727 with
                Comp cams 270 h
                NP208
                Edlebrock performer intake
                Holley 4180
                Msd total multi spark.
                4" rusty's springs
                Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association

                If you can't make it better why waste your time. No use repeating the orignal mistakes. I'm to old to push it that's why.

                Comment

                • Marineviper
                  232 I6
                  • Jul 10, 2015
                  • 115

                  #9
                  I'll be following this cause I'm having the same issues, the only thing I haven't done that you have is using the 1" spacer, regulator, or called the techs. Yours will start just fine if it's hot and you start it up within a couple minutes but acts up when it sits for 10-20 minutes right? Have you removed the exhaust dampner like I have?

                  I noticed if my coolant temp is still within 160-150 degree range that it will do it before starting.

                  It seems to me that my issue started after replacing the exhaust and getting rid of the dampner. I would think that should of been keeping the intake cooler.
                  76 j10 short, 360 nailhead th400 D20, 3.54, 4" lift, 31" bfg ko2

                  HEI
                  CS130 105amp
                  Comp cam sk10-200-4
                  Edelbrock performer w/1406

                  Comment

                  • J10blues
                    258 I6
                    • Mar 21, 2014
                    • 395

                    #10
                    Rick, I did try out what you recommended but no-bueno, it just cranks and cranks. Thanks.

                    Marineviper, it does not start up after sitting for 15-20 mins., I have to wait till it significantly cools off. Not sure about the exhaust damper as I've just replaced that a few months ago when the muffler shop upgraded my exhaust to a 3" single pipe. I've tried Ristow's and Serehill's advise and removed the air horn to check the fuel in the bowls and yes it still had enough fuel in there to start right up but just won't At this point I'm gonna keep trying to figure this out, I mean it will start eventually when it cools a while so at least I can still drive it. EDIT: it started way after the exhaust pipe was replaced so it may not have caused it.

                    Ben
                    77 J10
                    360 complete rebuild
                    TH400
                    Eddy Performer intake/Non EGR/CompCams 268 H
                    Eddy 1406
                    MSD 4AL/MSD 8519Dist/TFI coil
                    Holley fuel pump
                    MagnaFlow exhaust

                    02 Jeep Wrangler TJ
                    _________________________________________
                    "Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final, You Need To Be Slow..In a Hurry!" Wyatt Earp.

                    Comment

                    • DarkMonohue
                      Shakes hands with danger
                      • Jul 01, 2012
                      • 1145

                      #11
                      Your idle speed is too low. Try raising it to about 650 RPM in gear, and re-adjust the idle mixture after upping the idle speed. Make sure the engine is fully warmed up before you adjust anything. A good ten minute drive should do it.

                      The low idle speed might not be the cause of the hard starting issue, but it isn't helping.

                      If that does not correct the issue, try just barely cracking the throttle open while cranking. I have to do that with my Motorcraft carb, and it is the recommended hot start procedure in my owner's manual. It starts instantly.
                      '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                      Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                      High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                      Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                      Comment

                      • Marineviper
                        232 I6
                        • Jul 10, 2015
                        • 115

                        #12
                        I removed the dampner all together, I guess mine started a couple weeks after I did it, but that's just cause I noticed it than. It didn't really start till the weather got warm out for me, and I am wondering if switching to non ethanol fuel will help.
                        76 j10 short, 360 nailhead th400 D20, 3.54, 4" lift, 31" bfg ko2

                        HEI
                        CS130 105amp
                        Comp cam sk10-200-4
                        Edelbrock performer w/1406

                        Comment

                        • DarkMonohue
                          Shakes hands with danger
                          • Jul 01, 2012
                          • 1145

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Marineviper
                          ...and I am wondering if switching to non ethanol fuel will help.
                          Doing that will really only be a workaround that ties to you to expensive, hard-to-find fuel. Get it working right, and you two can burn fuel from any station. E10 is not the devil fuel people make it out to be.

                          You guys can fix this. Just take a methodical approach. Learn what the correct starting procedure is for an AFB/Edelbrock, and use it. You should not be pumping the pedal on a hot start. Get the idle speed and idle mixture correct, find any problems that need fixing, and fix the problems you know you have. Don't disable or re-engineer things just because they're unfamiliar - people do that sometimes, and it makes a real mess.
                          '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                          Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                          High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                          Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                          Comment

                          • J10blues
                            258 I6
                            • Mar 21, 2014
                            • 395

                            #14
                            DarkMonohue, Thanks a bunch for the inputs, I'll try tinkling with my idle screws again and bring that idle up a bit and see it that helps. Thanks again, always good to get good sound advise.

                            Ben
                            77 J10
                            360 complete rebuild
                            TH400
                            Eddy Performer intake/Non EGR/CompCams 268 H
                            Eddy 1406
                            MSD 4AL/MSD 8519Dist/TFI coil
                            Holley fuel pump
                            MagnaFlow exhaust

                            02 Jeep Wrangler TJ
                            _________________________________________
                            "Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final, You Need To Be Slow..In a Hurry!" Wyatt Earp.

                            Comment

                            • DarkMonohue
                              Shakes hands with danger
                              • Jul 01, 2012
                              • 1145

                              #15
                              Originally posted by J10blues
                              DarkMonohue, Thanks a bunch for the inputs, I'll try tinkling with my idle screws again and bring that idle up a bit and see it that helps. Thanks again, always good to get good sound advise.
                              You are very welcome. Let us know how you get on!
                              '85 J20 Old Man Truck, bought @ 65K miles - not great, but better than walking.
                              Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association
                              High quality junk here: intro thread and slow build thread

                              Did you know? Willys is just Willis spelled differently, but pronounced the same. Neither Willy nor his apostrophe are involved.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X