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  #1  
Old 01-30-2008, 09:29 PM
tgreening tgreening is offline
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Wheel cylinder in closed knuckle d44

I've got a 68 J3000 with a closed knuckle 44 up front. The drivers side has an assumed toasted wheel cylinder since brake fluid pours out about as fast as I pour it in. My question is, and I know it probably sounds dumb, but is there a special trick to getting the drum off? I loosed up the brake pads as much as possible but can't get the thing to budge. I've never worked on a closed knuckle axle before so I'm a little unsure of my footing here. I had just assumed (yeah. I know.) that the drum would slide off over the hub but upon closer inspection I'm not so sure.

Speaking of funky hubs, I've never seen a set like these and I'm wondering if they were par for the course on the older J-trucks. They aren't the standard twist the knob type I'm used to but rather you have two levers that you swing out, give a half turn to, and then swing back in against the face of the hub.

I don't intend to get too deep into these axles as I've got some later model and heavier duty J-truck axles coming that I intend to swap in, but I'd like to at least be able to move this truck about without crashing into something.

You can tell by the post count and past posts that I'm a total newb when it comes to J-trucks but I tend to jump into things with both feet. And all related arms, legs, and other various body parts. Two or so weeks ago I had never laid hands on a jeep truck and now I've got two in the garage, one more yet to pick up, and a couple of rolling chassis along with it. All this in order to piece and part together what I want as a driver. The criteria was Brow, Rhino, heavy axles and V8.

The first truck has the brow and rhino along with a cab that is fairly decent, semi decent bed, and an excellent frame. The drive train is 232/t-14/d20 and d-44 axles, the front being the mentioned closed knuckle unit. All that is coming out. Another plus is it has absolutely brand new rubber on all 4 corners. All the little rubber nubbies are still present all across the tread.

The second truck has a wasted cab and a frame of unknown condition due to the literal half inch of...goo that was sprayed all over it. I'm assuming it is some sort of rustproofing and to me appears to be old old cosmoline or something. It has a 360 with factory a factory barrel/TH-400/Quadratrac/D-44s. The front has a lockout hub conversion which was an unexpected bonus. I bought this one from a junkyard that had been using it as a yard truck until the gas tank strap rotted off and dropped the tank on the ground. I had just finished loading it up when one of the yard workers walks over and kind of whispers to me, "hey, did they tell you about the motor"? Of course I think ah crap the guy already has my money and I'm going to find out the crank busted in half or something equally unpleasant. Yard ape tells me it ran like a champ and he thinks someone had reworked the motor. I hadn't paid too much attention in the yard other than to check fluids and make sure there weren't any holes in the block. I fully expected to have to rebuild the whole drivetrain anyway.

Today I take a closer look-see and can tell the intake had been R&R'd and the paint on the block looked way too fresh to be 30 years old. New-ish water pump, new fuel lines to the carb, etc. Hmmm, I goes. Slap in a battery, run some fuel line into a jerry can, cross my fingers and turn the key. Vroooom goes the motor with a very nice and rather impressive rumble. Hmmm, I goes again and slide under for a look at the semi-newish (read not rusted out) dual exhaust. Another plus (for someone) is the engine bay is complete with every bit of factory smoggity stuff the maker saw fit to provide. It's not my cup of tea so will probably end up on flea-Bay for those interested in doing a total restoration on their truck.

The other truck is J20 with 360/TH400/Q.T./44-60 combo and the rolling chassis are the same combo (I think!). I'm taking my tractor/trailer to pick up that mess on friday.

Add all that to the 2 CJ7s, CJ5, and cherokee that I already have and it isn't hard to see that I should be standing in front of a group of strangers saying my name is Tom....and I'm a Jeepaholic.


Anyway, the point of this long rambling post is....can somebody tell me how the **** drum comes off the **** front axle?
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Old 01-30-2008, 09:50 PM
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Elliott Elliott is offline
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It's been a few years since I messed with the last closed knuckle but if there aren't two screws holding the drum to the hub then soak it with pb blaster around the hub and lugs and smack it good. I have one in the yard I could look at, but it's dark...

My '64 TSM says just remove the wheels, the hubs and then the drums...
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Last edited by Elliott : 01-30-2008 at 09:52 PM.
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  #3  
Old 01-31-2008, 08:46 AM
tgreening tgreening is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott
It's been a few years since I messed with the last closed knuckle but if there aren't two screws holding the drum to the hub then soak it with pb blaster around the hub and lugs and smack it good. I have one in the yard I could look at, but it's dark...

My '64 TSM says just remove the wheels, the hubs and then the drums...


I don't recall seeing any screws but then again I wasn't really looking for any. Sometimes you only see what you are looking for I guess. I'll double check tonight.

I soaked with blaster and beat on it with a sledge until I started to feel guilty and that's when I began to wonder if I had to remove the hub in order to get the drum off.

Btw, you wouldn't know where I could get a line on a service manual for a 68 J-3000 would you? Haven't seen anything so far and it juuust might come in handy.
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Old 01-31-2008, 03:22 PM
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Elliott Elliott is offline
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Those manuals pop up on ebay pretty often.
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  #5  
Old 01-31-2008, 04:11 PM
joe joe is offline
 
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The later Kaiser era manuals are the most common and as Elliott said they're often on Ebay. Just make sure you get the correct one. What you're looking for is Service Manual/Jeep J-Series Vehicles. The part number is SM-1042 and it's in small print bottom center of the front cover. The manual will likely have a print date of 1969 or 1971 which is found at the bottom of the title page.
You could also live with the earlier one SM-1019-R2 printed in 1966. If you go any earlier than that though it won't include the 327 or that later type brakes, steering etc. The 1042 will probably be easier to find.

On your brakes is the adjuster actually working and the shoes are really backing off/away from the drum? The shoes is the only thing I can think of holding the drum on?
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Old 01-31-2008, 04:48 PM
tgreening tgreening is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe
The later Kaiser era manuals are the most common and as Elliott said they're often on Ebay. Just make sure you get the correct one. What you're looking for is Service Manual/Jeep J-Series Vehicles. The part number is SM-1042 and it's in small print bottom center of the front cover. The manual will likely have a print date of 1969 or 1971 which is found at the bottom of the title page.

You could also live with the earlier one SM-1019-R2 printed in 1966. If you go any earlier than that though it won't include the 327 or that later type brakes, steering etc. The 1042 will probably be easier to find.

On your brakes is the adjuster actually working and the shoes are really backing off/away from the drum? The shoes is the only thing I can think of holding the drum on?


Please tell that I for once lucked out! I bought http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=003&sspagename=STRK%3AME WA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=130192476454&rd=1
yesterday hoping it was going to be what I needed. It sounded about right anyway.

Yes, the adjuster does work. I adjusted both directions to make sure. Going one way it locks up the drum and if I adjust it the other way I can freely turn the drum. I didn't get a chance to get at it today because I had to go to work for a change, tomorrow is when I'm going to pick up the rest of the junk, and saturday the wife wants me to entertain her (women). Guess I won't know anything else until sunday. I did discover that my gas tank leaks like the beejeezus if it gets too much fuel in it. I have a funky pneumatic scissor jack that will hoist the front or back of a vehicle about 5 feet in the air and I was using it working on the hub. Another thing to put on the must buy list I guess.
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Old 01-31-2008, 04:57 PM
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That TSM you bought will work.
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***I can set you up with hydroboost for your brakes: http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=106056
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  #8  
Old 01-31-2008, 05:03 PM
joe joe is offline
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott
That TSM you bought will work.
Yup good price too!
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  #9  
Old 01-31-2008, 11:29 PM
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james1414d james1414d is offline
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if your drum won't come loose from the hub, you can pull the hub and drum off as a unit. just pull the lock out and the nuts holding the wheel bearings. if the splines on your wheel studs are too long it makes it almost impossible to get the drum off. and a word of advise, I don't recommend the hammer method on an early fsj. the metal is only as thick as sheet metal and you will probably make the drum out of round. of course sometimes you just need to beat some things
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Old 02-06-2008, 12:25 PM
lgrjeep lgrjeep is offline
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Remove the hub assy which will include the drum, if my memory (or what's left of it) serves me correctly the rears were staked (screwed) the fronts were pressed togeather in to a single assy. The lockouts you have were not all that rare and as I recall were even sold by Sears out of there special Jeep catalogue. They engage when you move the levers that rotate a pin about 3/4 inch in diameter that has a slot on the other side when its in the free position.
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Old 02-06-2008, 06:49 PM
tgreening tgreening is offline
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Thanks for the replys, everyone. I got the hub/drum off and got the wheel cylinder replaced. Of course the hard line got trashed in the process so that had to be replaced as well. Of course when bleeding the brakes I find out the cylinder on the other side is seized up and needs replacing too. On that trip to autodrone I decided to save myself a couple more trips and just ordered wheel cylinders all around.

I just want it to move and stop. I don't intend to pump too much money into these axles as they're coming out to make way for something a bit newer and stronger out of a 70-ish J20.
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Old 02-07-2008, 11:48 AM
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Gambler68 Gambler68 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tgreening

I just want it to move and stop. I don't intend to pump too much money into these axles as they're coming out to make way for something a bit newer and stronger out of a 70-ish J20.

Keep in mind there were no factory SOA open knuckle D44 fronts.
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