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Old 05-19-2015, 06:29 AM
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NJBattleWagon334 NJBattleWagon334 is offline
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Thicker oil question

Hey guys , my 360 is experiencing some low oil pressure about 10 psi which I think is causing my lifters to tick due to lack of pressure. Should I get some 10w 40 to go along with a oil pump rebuild with the mid plate. What do you think
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Old 05-19-2015, 07:23 AM
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Well

I don't think the mid plate will do a lot & probably the pump won't either both can't hurt. This is mostly caused by wear in the engine & mostly rod & cam bearings The heavy oil will help I'm running Valvoline racing oil 50 W in mine. I'm sure that will catch someone's hair on for but it works fine in Texas.
Believe it or not oil filters have something to do with that also. Not that oil pressure produced by the filter will help the motor but a lot of the newer filters have less restriction & are junk reduce pressure. I'm running STP filters & can see a difference on pressure.
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Old 05-19-2015, 07:39 AM
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There are hundreds of old posts about this if you search. I suggest you read as many of them as you can find, and inform yourself.

The TSM has instructions for measuring wear of your oil pump. Measure, measure, measure!

Yes, try a different oil filter, sp. not a Fram. Wix is good, or maybe AC Delco.

I ran the 50W Valvoline racing oil in my worn-out F100 long ago, but that was in California where I did not worry about cold starting. A compromise might be one of the 15W40 diesel oils, Delo or Rotella. I use Rotella in my Jeeps, but I do very little winter driving.

If you change the oil and filter, measure the oil pump and it's in spec, and you still have low oil pressure, likely your cam bearings are coming apart. That seems to be the usual problem, other than the oil pump.

With low oil pressure, you are in more danger of a failing rod bearing. But an actual 10 psi at idle speed should be ok, as long as it goes no lower than that. This is a real 10 psi, measured with a quality aftermarket mechanical oil gauge. Lifter noise is annoying but not fatal - IMO a lifter should not tick at 10 psi unless it's worn out.
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Old 05-19-2015, 05:53 PM
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I run a different kind of 10w40 each oil change and always use a NAPA Gold (Wix) filter. The 10w30 vs 10w40 has barely made a difference other than stopping a lot of my overnight drips but the oil filter is like night and day. Went from using STP filters at 15-20 PSI to Wix at 20-25 or 30 PSI on a good day.

So a quality oil filter is what you need for some boost in pressure. You can put in a really heavy weight oil and get a boost but that's just a bandaid and isn't really "fixing" anything.
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Old 05-21-2015, 12:46 AM
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If your filter is orange, you risk your rods on every start up. Some people run them for years till *POP* one day and motor is dead.
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Old 05-24-2015, 05:17 PM
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But wait...

Low oil pressure is a symptom and warning of increased tolerances due to wear of the pump and/or bearings. If the real problem is bearing wear, thicker oil may increase the pressure a bit, but will not delay by one second finally throwing a rod bearing or wiping a main.


10 lbs is not low enough to cause lifter clatter UNLESS you have worn lifters. An old tired engine will generally have all three going on: worn pump, bearings & lifters.


Usual RX for low pressure is a pump overhaul first. If still low pressure, I wouldn't go any further than you're willing to have it towed home. Time for an engine overhaul.


Been there done that.
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Old 05-24-2015, 10:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rich88
Low oil pressure is a symptom and warning of increased tolerances due to wear of the pump and/or bearings. If the real problem is bearing wear, thicker oil may increase the pressure a bit, but will not delay by one second finally throwing a rod bearing or wiping a main.


10 lbs is not low enough to cause lifter clatter UNLESS you have worn lifters. An old tired engine will generally have all three going on: worn pump, bearings & lifters.


Usual RX for low pressure is a pump overhaul first. If still low pressure, I wouldn't go any further than you're willing to have it towed home. Time for an engine overhaul.


Been there done that.
Yup. Couldn't have said it better myself.

On a worn engine lifters ticking at idle is the least of your worries. They can go tens of thousands of miles with ticking lifters and not have a problem. It's annoying but not really hurtful.

Thicker oil can sometimes help quiet the lifters but never go more than 20W50 unless you never operate the engine in temperatures below 50 degrees.

70% of engine wear occurs at cold start before the oil flows. The quicker it flows the less wear. That is the best argument for thinner oil.

10W30
10W40
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Old 05-25-2015, 07:31 AM
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Great thing here is it's ok to agree to disagree.

Oil change first only make sense. Assuming the pump is bad first is optimistic but not the first assumption. Changing the oil & filter will give you confirmation that the pump or bearings are beyond repair. Any vehicle will run worse with lifter tick period. A lifter tick clearly indicates the valve train system is too loose for whatever reason. Lifer tick can also be from fulcrum wear not just bad lifters. These issues mean the lifers indicate that the If you change your oil & the pressure increases then the oil pump is probably OK as the rest of the worn engine. if the oil pressure doesn't increase then change the pump. You don't have to change the oil to do that.
I agree with the guys 50 weight in cold weather should be changed to multi viscosity but it's May.
These magic solutions won't cure a fatigued engine. Race care drivers & mechanics around the world would argue that the 50 weight doesn't prolong life.
None of this is a long term solution. Or cure.
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80 Cherokee
360 ci 727 with
Comp cams 270 h
NP208
Edlebrock performer intake
Holley 4180
Msd total multi spark.
4" rusty's springs
Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association

If you can't make it better why waste your time. No use repeating the orignal mistakes. I'm to old to push it that's why.

Last edited by serehill : 05-25-2015 at 08:30 AM.
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  #9  
Old 05-28-2015, 08:54 PM
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I have pulled apart Fram filters over the years that were imploded (so far, only PH11 and a couple PH13as) and found lifter clack that was just clogged lifters (like my Comanche that went X miles before I got it at 120,000 with no change and now has 250,000+ miles running Napa 15W50 the last 100,000 miles with clacking every oil change till I add oil detergent to clean it out)
The factory oil pump bypass spring was too weak from the get go. It was rated without accounting for heat/cool cycles and causes many AMC motors to run low pressure, even when in good shape. The mid drive plate kit from Bulltear helps them a lot with this issue.
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