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Old 06-05-2020, 08:09 PM
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Kaiserjeeps Kaiserjeeps is offline
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Making inner quarter panels with a hammer form

I just made a set of wagoneer inner quarter panels for member miracleed. I thought I would post how it was done to help others possibly get theirs done. I started out knowing absolutely nothing about this. A couple of you tube videos and a general idea on how hammer forms work, I charged ahead.
I have a set of rust free 1979 panels that I was able to make a two part hammer form out of. The OEM panels are great for checking accuracy and making a part that fits with minimal work. A hammer form is two pieces of hardwood clamped or bolted together for a flat sheet. The sheet is then hammered to shape using the wood buck to shape it. I used cabinet grade 3/4 plywood and I'd like to find oak or maple to make another form. This form is tired and you want sharp corners for hammering over. I extracted near perfect rust free factory rear quarters and these inner panels for my 69 X model. They still are not installed. I made this hammer form for the 70 wagoneer I toiled over for years. Some of you know that wagoneer as Sadie. I will make new inners and keep the OEM panels for patterns. I have invested in tools to help me get this done. But they could be made without them. It would just take more work. So here goes...

Using 18 GA sheetmetal I cut the metal to make both sides.



Mark out the panel with the folds you need. Then cut to shape. I used a 36 inch foot stomp shear for the long straight runs and a beverly shear. for the corners.




Then secure it between the forms. I usually use all bolts. But used two bolts and some C clamps. Less to weld shut later The metal can't move at all while you are working the edges over. I prebent the edge that welds to the floor on a 4 foot box and pan brake. I have the Harbor Freight 40 inch straight bender and it would do this just fine.



Using a body hammer and not anything else, start working the edges over. Take your time and work your way around the whole panel. Go around again and again till you have this.



This is where problems arise. You are trying to hammer metal through a corner but there is to much metal trying to go into a smaller space. You end up with this.




That aint gonna work you say.... go slow and yes it will. Keep working the high spots and don't allow a fold to develop. Keep shrinking with hitting each one once and just keep working back and forth. Gather that metal.

Slightly smaller bumps and valleys... Keep going. Be patient. It will flatten out with work.



The lower front corner that would be just behind the wheel is just to tight of a radius to get the metal to cooperate. I had to do two relief cuts to get the corner folded over. I had well over a 1/2 inch overlap on both cuts about an inch apart. Later when the correct shape was formed, I used a mini air sawzall to cut the overlaps out. That left a simple cut to TIG weld up and sand back. There is no other way to make that work that I could find.



So keep working the panel. Drive the metal using any tools that work.



So you get it just about to where you think great! Its working. But what has happened is all the force to gather that metal and shrink it into the corner plays havoc on the straightness of the overall panel. This happens. The fold did not shrink enough to keep the panel straight. This bend would not line up with the outer quarter panel in the right spot.





So this is where a shrinker stretcher just rocks. But for a guy that does not have one, make relief cuts and make that panel straight. Then carefully weld the fold up. Thats one way, and here is is another. Using the shrinker you shrink the edge till it pulls the panel straight. The trick to this is to do just the outer edge first. Then run the metal fold deeper into the jaws. You get very fast results this way. You always have to take your time. Moving metal never happens quickly.

This is nasty.



Lets get rid of that curl. Do only the edge first. It will distort your work. Don't worry about it and fix the contour later.



You can check your progress by putting the form in the part. It shows the correction needed. Keep shaping, shrinking and little by little it will come in.



Now a word on Shrinker stretchers. Never ever buy the ones from Harbor Freight. You will waste your money and be very sorry. The shrinker stretcher unit was invented in 1939 by the Charlie Brown tool company. Or Lancaster. When you try to save a buck, you get import garbage that simply will not do what you wish to accomplish. It will frustrate and waste your time possibly scrapping a part you already have hours into.


I fortunately found this when I was shopping. I have the lancaster units and they work.

So after a day on each panel, I had something that was starting to look like I could send it out. Tail light electrical holes done and drain holes in the same spots as the OEM panels, they were ready to ship.



Some other views.



On the wrapping paper.



I would suggest to anyone that is replacing metal to get it painted and sealed very well. Use body caulk where the factory did. The spray the entire inner panels with 3M cavity wax. Everything 3M makes works exceptionally well.
So make those forms and get some panels made. Keep saving those jeeps.
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Most users ever online was 656, 06-30-2007 at 09:50 PM.
I was there! Still waiting for my Tee shirt...

1969 1414X Wag,
71 project J truck FOR SALE
1970 J truck long bed bed FOR SALE
1970 Wagoneer Not Sadie
1983 FJ60 wagon
CJ-5's
83 CJ-7 excellent shape FOR SALE
And soon... Another M715! echo... echo...

Last edited by babywag : 06-06-2020 at 10:33 AM.
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  #2  
Old 06-05-2020, 08:11 PM
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Kaiserjeeps Kaiserjeeps is offline
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My post was to long for the statement from TM technologies regarding import shrinker stretchers. Here is the reason to avoid import units.


A comment from TM Technologies web page:

Please Note: There are a lot of copies of this machine on the market. Some of these imported machines use smaller diameter pins and lower grade steel. Up until last year, it was almost impossible to tell the difference without actually taking the machine apart and seeing if the dies on the inside were stamped CB which stood for Charlie Brown Tool Company. (See the History tab above) This confusion allowed other retailers to market and sell these imported machines at a premium price to unsuspecting consumers. Although at first these imported machines preformed similarly to their high quality counterpart, it was only a matter of time before the slop of these low-quality assemblies become apparent. After several customers had complained, (some of whom even purchase original Lancaster parts trying to retro-fit their imported machine in a last ditch effort to save their investment) TM Technologies contacted Lancaster and asked them to start engraving their name on the side of the machine. The Lancaster Shrinker & Stretcher is one of the most iconic tools found in a sheet metal shop and it is a shame that these imported versions are being sold at the same and sometimes an even higher price, than the high quality originals. You will notice in the image above and on the image of the Lancaster Stretcher, found under the more photos tab, that these machines are now more easily identifiable with their name proudly engraved along the bottom. If the machine you are looking at does not have this engraving – buyer beware!

So if you want to buy a set, then make sure you avoid the imposters. If you can spring for it. Get the deep throat units. You can do more with them.

EDIT: My images are not showing. Hopefully that will change soon. I heart Photobucket..... Not/
__________________
-----------------------
Am I done yet?

Holy Moly, I am done.....

Most users ever online was 656, 06-30-2007 at 09:50 PM.
I was there! Still waiting for my Tee shirt...

1969 1414X Wag,
71 project J truck FOR SALE
1970 J truck long bed bed FOR SALE
1970 Wagoneer Not Sadie
1983 FJ60 wagon
CJ-5's
83 CJ-7 excellent shape FOR SALE
And soon... Another M715! echo... echo...

Last edited by Kaiserjeeps : 06-05-2020 at 09:05 PM.
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  #3  
Old 06-05-2020, 10:59 PM
Full Size Jeeper's Avatar
Full Size Jeeper Full Size Jeeper is offline
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Join Date: Jul 20, 2014
Location: Mandeville Louisiana
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1.You love fabrication.
2.Nice work.
3.Show off!
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1978 Wagoneer

401/turbo 400 trans. Quadra-Trac BW1339 (with Low) 4" Rusty's lift with 31" Summit Mud Dawgs

Mods:
Fuel Tank, Red Holley Fuel Pump, Razor Grill (profile pic out dated), Rebuilt steering box
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  #4  
Old 06-06-2020, 10:15 AM
Kaiserjeeps's Avatar
Kaiserjeeps Kaiserjeeps is offline
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Join Date: Oct 02, 2002
Location: Mooseville Northern Idaho
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Just showing what a hammer form is. I see a lot of repairs where that could help someone.

I am not sure why PB is not displaying my pictures.
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Am I done yet?

Holy Moly, I am done.....

Most users ever online was 656, 06-30-2007 at 09:50 PM.
I was there! Still waiting for my Tee shirt...

1969 1414X Wag,
71 project J truck FOR SALE
1970 J truck long bed bed FOR SALE
1970 Wagoneer Not Sadie
1983 FJ60 wagon
CJ-5's
83 CJ-7 excellent shape FOR SALE
And soon... Another M715! echo... echo...

Last edited by Kaiserjeeps : 06-12-2020 at 10:58 AM.
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  #5  
Old 06-06-2020, 10:26 AM
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Mikel Mikel is offline
 
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As usual, making the rest of us look bad!


I propose we ban Al !
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Old 06-06-2020, 10:34 AM
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babywag babywag is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiserjeeps

I am not sure why PB is not displaying my pictures.

Fixed for ya...
The "?width=1920&height=1080&fit=bounds" in the pic link(s) was the issue.
Forum did not know what to do with that information.
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Old 06-06-2020, 10:41 AM
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Full Size Jeeper Full Size Jeeper is offline
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I know you are joking about taking the pics down. I would read through a 100 page thread of you building a kite from scratch. We all love what you post!!!
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1978 Wagoneer

401/turbo 400 trans. Quadra-Trac BW1339 (with Low) 4" Rusty's lift with 31" Summit Mud Dawgs

Mods:
Fuel Tank, Red Holley Fuel Pump, Razor Grill (profile pic out dated), Rebuilt steering box
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  #8  
Old 06-06-2020, 10:48 AM
Kaiserjeeps's Avatar
Kaiserjeeps Kaiserjeeps is offline
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Join Date: Oct 02, 2002
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Thank you Darin, and Tony for fixing my pictures... Just trying to help.
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-----------------------
Am I done yet?

Holy Moly, I am done.....

Most users ever online was 656, 06-30-2007 at 09:50 PM.
I was there! Still waiting for my Tee shirt...

1969 1414X Wag,
71 project J truck FOR SALE
1970 J truck long bed bed FOR SALE
1970 Wagoneer Not Sadie
1983 FJ60 wagon
CJ-5's
83 CJ-7 excellent shape FOR SALE
And soon... Another M715! echo... echo...
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  #9  
Old 06-06-2020, 11:43 AM
Kaiserjeeps's Avatar
Kaiserjeeps Kaiserjeeps is offline
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Join Date: Oct 02, 2002
Location: Mooseville Northern Idaho
Posts: 2,471
I had an idea on these inner quarters. One of the most important things here is an accurate pattern for a hammer form. I made my forms from a rust free 1979 panel. If any of you readers wants a paper tracing of the panel, send me a PM with your complete mailing address. I will trace out the profile and send it. Unfold it and trace it on to a stout hardwood to make your own. I intend this for personal use. Not so you can make them and sell them. That would be taking advantage of my offer in a very bad way. An accurate form is the key to success. I will go clean house in my inbox...
__________________
-----------------------
Am I done yet?

Holy Moly, I am done.....

Most users ever online was 656, 06-30-2007 at 09:50 PM.
I was there! Still waiting for my Tee shirt...

1969 1414X Wag,
71 project J truck FOR SALE
1970 J truck long bed bed FOR SALE
1970 Wagoneer Not Sadie
1983 FJ60 wagon
CJ-5's
83 CJ-7 excellent shape FOR SALE
And soon... Another M715! echo... echo...

Last edited by Kaiserjeeps : 06-12-2020 at 10:59 AM.
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  #10  
Old 06-06-2020, 07:17 PM
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miracleed miracleed is offline
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Location: Massachusetts
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikel
As usual, making the rest of us look bad!


I propose we ban Al !


well, he's making me look good...

and a very many thank yous to Al.
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Old 06-06-2020, 08:18 PM
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chubbinius chubbinius is offline
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Thanks for posting another awesome thread, Al.

The pictures help with understanding how you do the great work you do. Great to see!
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  #12  
Old 06-06-2020, 09:06 PM
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Kaiserjeeps Kaiserjeeps is offline
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Join Date: Oct 02, 2002
Location: Mooseville Northern Idaho
Posts: 2,471
The wife said.. What are you reading? Some replies on IFSJA. So I read them to her. She says... Show off.... Uh geez.. She never misses a chance to tease me.
__________________
-----------------------
Am I done yet?

Holy Moly, I am done.....

Most users ever online was 656, 06-30-2007 at 09:50 PM.
I was there! Still waiting for my Tee shirt...

1969 1414X Wag,
71 project J truck FOR SALE
1970 J truck long bed bed FOR SALE
1970 Wagoneer Not Sadie
1983 FJ60 wagon
CJ-5's
83 CJ-7 excellent shape FOR SALE
And soon... Another M715! echo... echo...
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  #13  
Old 06-15-2020, 08:57 AM
Rusty76 Rusty76 is offline
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Kaiserjeeps this is a great post! Thanks again for taking the time to document this.
Huge asset to this form.
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