International Full Size Jeep Association
Home Forums Reader's Rigs Tech Library Trail Stories FSJ-List
International Full Size Jeep Association  

Go Back   International Full Size Jeep Association > Tire Kickin' > General FSJ Tech

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-11-2013, 01:09 PM
eps_jeeps eps_jeeps is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 07, 2012
Location: Lincon, ne
Posts: 12
Installation of Engine Transmission and Transfer Case?

Hello

I would like to say that I have done this before but I have not. So hopefully someone can give me some advise. I have a jeep pickup truck with a 232 engine a borg warner t-18 transmission and a Dana 20 transfer case. I removed each of these items one at a time first the engine then the transfer case and finally the transmission. They are all ready to go back in and I am planning to install the engine and transmission as one unit and then install the transfer case from below.

Has anybody removed or installed an engine transmission and transfer case as one unit fully assembled. Would that be an easier way to go or would it be easier to install the transfer case after the engine and transmission are installed.

The TSM is a little vague it states in one section that the engine and transmission can be removed as one unit and in another section the TSM recommends removing he transfer case before removing the transmission.

I am looking for real world experience here if any one has done this before any advise would be appreciated.

Thanks
Eps_Jeeps
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-11-2013, 01:50 PM
babywag's Avatar
babywag babywag is online now
out of order
 
Join Date: Jun 08, 2005
Location: Land of froot loops and cukcoo-nuts, CA
Posts: 9,562
It can be done, but make sure your hoist is up to the task.

Pull the front core support/valance/grille off so you don't have to lift it so high.
Air down the tires, or remove the wheels and set truck on stands.
The lower the engine assembly is the easier/safer it is.

It's easier with a helper, and an engine leveler.

Be safe! much easier for the hoist to tip over with that much weight on it.
Use good chains, straps etc.
__________________
Tony
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-11-2013, 01:58 PM
eps_jeeps eps_jeeps is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 07, 2012
Location: Lincon, ne
Posts: 12
Thanks Tony

I had to let the air out of the tires when i pulled the engine and yes it was way up there when it finally cleared the truck. It made me nervous to say the least. I have a engine leveler but will not likely have a helper.

I had not thought about removing the front grill and core support. thanks.

Currently the cross member is out. Do you think I should install the assembly first and then install the cross member or should I install the cross member first.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-11-2013, 02:48 PM
joe joe is offline
 
Join Date: Apr 28, 2000
Location: PNWet, USA
Posts: 22,374
Doable but not recommended. Into a bare frame or at least front clip removed and a proper hoist and extra helper to push/pull not bad. Otherwise plan on smashing/destroying a few bits in the process. If the body is in place and most of the front clip and eng bay components I recommend doing it w/o the trans/tcase attached especially if this is your first install.
__________________
joe
"Don't mind me. I'm just here for the alibi"
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:27 PM
eps_jeeps eps_jeeps is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 07, 2012
Location: Lincon, ne
Posts: 12
Thanks Joe.

It all seemed so straight forward when it came out but not so much going back in. Body and front clip are all in place. I was thinking it would be easier to bolt all the components together and then install but now tnanks to previous advise I may rethink the approach. Start with the engine clutch and bell housing. Then transmission and finally transfer case.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:36 PM
44BZ's Avatar
44BZ 44BZ is offline
304 AMC
 
Join Date: Dec 10, 2009
Location: oregon city, or
Posts: 1,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by eps_jeeps
Thanks Joe.

It all seemed so straight forward when it came out but not so much going back in. Body and front clip are all in place. I was thinking it would be easier to bolt all the components together and then install but now tnanks to previous advise I may rethink the approach. Start with the engine clutch and bell housing. Then transmission and finally transfer case.

I did this last summer and installed each component separately. My truck is on 38s so I pulled the front tires off and sat the frame on jack stands to get it the front low enough. This was my first engine install so I'm not an expert by any means, but I left the bellhousing on the transmission thinking it would be easier to line up the shaft with the pilot that way. I put the flywheel and clutch assembly on the back of the motor after it was in, then the trans went it, and lastly the T/C. I put the crossmember in at the very end and just supported the drivetrain at the rear with a jackstand. I also found it helpful to strap the motor to the frame in several locations to keep it from rocking as we muscled the trans in. Good luck
__________________
Zack - 68 J2000, AMC 327, 4bbl intake, dual exhaust, Pertronix upgrade, Holley 600cfm, T18, dana 20 (twin sticked), 3" body lift w/ 35x12.50 MTRs ~ running AND driving!
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:37 PM
blkwarrior's Avatar
blkwarrior blkwarrior is offline
Gear Head
 
Join Date: Feb 15, 2010
Location: Tucson AZ
Posts: 547
Quote:
Originally Posted by eps_jeeps
Thanks Joe.

It all seemed so straight forward when it came out but not so much going back in. Body and front clip are all in place. I was thinking it would be easier to bolt all the components together and then install but now tnanks to previous advise I may rethink the approach. Start with the engine clutch and bell housing. Then transmission and finally transfer case.

I think I would go the opposite... seeing that you have limited help. It will be easire to do the engine last, getting a tranny to line up from below is not the easiest thing to do alone. I did it with a friend and it was still dangerous. Be careful and good luck.
__________________
1984 GW
360/727/208/ Edl 1406/ Custom exhaust


Future
Something Sweet with mean capabilities .
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-11-2013, 03:58 PM
eps_jeeps eps_jeeps is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 07, 2012
Location: Lincon, ne
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by blkwarrior
I think I would go the opposite... seeing that you have limited help. It will be easire to do the engine last, getting a tranny to line up from below is not the easiest thing to do alone. I did it with a friend and it was still dangerous. Be careful and good luck.
Okay good advice from everyone.

Any thoughts on this approach.

1) install the transmission, bell housing, transfer case and cross member as one assembly.
2) Install engine and clutch assembly.

Thoughts?
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02-11-2013, 05:23 PM
Whtshos's Avatar
Whtshos Whtshos is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 21, 2011
Location: DFW Texas
Posts: 125
That sequence has proven better for me in other vehicles.
__________________
Its only money............
82" J10 Honcho
. .......==,---,
_____l_,\____\,__
l_(--)-l__l---0llllllll0
_(o)_)__(o)_)--o-)_)_
79" Chief W/T 'TANK'

. ,=====,---,
//___/l_,\____\,__
l_-----l__l---0llllllll0
_(o)_)__(o)_)--o-)_)_
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 02-11-2013, 05:31 PM
csuengr's Avatar
csuengr csuengr is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Jan 19, 2011
Location: Loveland, CO
Posts: 748
I have done installations and outstallations with all three pieces together. The hardest part of doing an I6 withe the transfer case attaches is trying to keep the whole assembly from tilting to the passenger side due to the Tcase hanging that way. I6's don't have the best lifting points.
__________________
If at first you don't succeed, use a bigger hammer.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 02-11-2013, 11:20 PM
eps_jeeps eps_jeeps is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 07, 2012
Location: Lincon, ne
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whtshos
That sequence has proven better for me in other vehicles.
Whtshos and 44BZ

Now I am thinking it might be easier if I installed the engine with the bell clutch assembly and bell housing attached because I could install the starter motor before installing the engine.

Does anybody have any red flags with installing the transmission transfer case assembly (on the cross member). Then installing the engine with the clutch bell housing and starter.

44BZ
Having done this once already would you still leave the bell housing on the transmission or put it on the engine so you could install the starter before installing the engine.

Thanks again all for the help.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 02-11-2013, 11:57 PM
REDONE's Avatar
REDONE REDONE is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Aug 19, 2002
Location: Golden, CO
Posts: 1,752
Quote:
Originally Posted by eps_jeeps

Does anybody have any red flags with installing the transmission transfer case assembly (on the cross member). Then installing the engine with the clutch bell housing and starter.


Only that it's an awkward, heavy, somofagun to man-handle around wiggling around on your back no matter what kind of jack you use; and that you have to figure out a way to support it front/back as you raise the vehicle to put those in, and then lower the vehicle to drop the engine in from the top (depending on the height of your particular FSJ).

I much prefer to pull the hood, grill, radiator and valance to drop the engine and trans together through the top/front. Pull the shifter off the T18 and put the t-case adapter on the trans and leave it heavy on the transmission end. Once the oil pan is over the front crossmember you can raise the truck to the engine a bit for clearance to crawl underneath. From there you can attach the trans crossmember to the t-case adapter and use a trolley jack to get that into position (with the help of a hefty deadblow if needed). Once you have one bolt in each side of the trans crossmember you head back up front to wrassle the engine mounts in place and get your nuts on there. Then back underneath to bust your knuckles and cuss until you get the rest of the x-member bolts in, your t-case on and hook up the linkages and driveshafts.

Then you crawl out from under the truck ready to take it for a test drive to remember the whole front end is dissassembled and strewn about the garage and yard and that you still have to hook up fuel, water, carb and ignition to the engine anyways.
__________________
2012 Winner of the Prestigious Ouray Cast Iron Butt Award
79 J-10 - The Money Badger!
304/T18/D20/D44s
What's been did:
Holley 4160/Ede' S.P.2.P.
MSD Streetfire based TFI
Custom-hack gauge cluster
Razor swap
Fancy exhaust (Thrush Muffler)
2 knob tape deck!
3" homebuilt lift
Half a hillbilly paint job
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 02-12-2013, 12:32 AM
eps_jeeps eps_jeeps is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 07, 2012
Location: Lincon, ne
Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by REDONE
I much prefer to pull the hood, grill, radiator and valance to drop the engine and trans together through the top/front.

Thank you very much for the real world experience. I stand and applaud the advice.


I am trying to avoid removing the valance. can the process be done without removing the valance and just working with the front clip in place? with a good hoist/crane I would think so.

Thoughts
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 02-12-2013, 12:52 AM
REDONE's Avatar
REDONE REDONE is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Aug 19, 2002
Location: Golden, CO
Posts: 1,752
totally, if you're working with an overhead gantry or long arm crane, or even better, a forklift, it can be done! But I'm not sure if it can be done with one set of hands. That's uncharted territory for this guy.
__________________
2012 Winner of the Prestigious Ouray Cast Iron Butt Award
79 J-10 - The Money Badger!
304/T18/D20/D44s
What's been did:
Holley 4160/Ede' S.P.2.P.
MSD Streetfire based TFI
Custom-hack gauge cluster
Razor swap
Fancy exhaust (Thrush Muffler)
2 knob tape deck!
3" homebuilt lift
Half a hillbilly paint job
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 02-12-2013, 10:48 AM
billyj7175's Avatar
billyj7175 billyj7175 is offline
Bleedin' Gasoline
 
Join Date: Sep 10, 2001
Location: Sooner State
Posts: 1,511
I used one of those motorcycle/atv jacks with a small square of plywood, then set the trans/transfercase and crossmember on that...wheeled it under, raised it up and bolted it in. However, without the 4" lift and 33's, it would have never have cleared going under.



I would have pulled the front clip for the motor, but I don't have any room to put it once it was off...
__________________
83 J-10 Jeep "Oscar"
360/727/229
4" Rusty's w/33X12.50 BFG AT's

I'll apologize ahead of time...my inner voice has Tourette's...
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 02-12-2013, 11:52 AM
addicted's Avatar
addicted addicted is offline
Big Meanie
 
Join Date: Dec 11, 2004
Location: Byron, MI
Posts: 4,876
THe engine and trans together is very doable. I put a 4.0/AW4 in as one piece with the core support still bolted in. I popped the hood off and pulled the front tires, set it down on the rotors with some plywood under them and slid it in. That was with your typical 2 ton engine hoist. The 4.0/AW4 is longer than any of the factory engine trans combos in the FSJ's.
__________________
Quote:
Originally posted by Ristow
i bet it was Simon....
he's such big meanie that way...
please don't tell him i said that....
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 02-12-2013, 09:46 PM
J20 project's Avatar
J20 project J20 project is offline
304 AMC
 
Join Date: Dec 27, 2000
Location: Nevada
Posts: 2,332
Simple enough.

Install the engine into the bay w/ the clutch and pressure plate on the flywheel...aligned w/ a stub shaft. Put a 2x4 w/ a hydraulic jack under the oil pan.

Hopefully you have removed the trans tunnel cover,,,if not,,do so.

Put 2, 4x4's across the doors w/ windows down..use padding under the ends of the 4x4s'.
Use a come a long,,,smaller and pull the trans up into the tunnel area and swing into and align and stab the trans w/bellhousing up against the engine...bolt up.
Block up under the trans now w/ jack and lift up and install the tcase onto the back or the trans.
Install the trans xmember...
Start putting the rest on.

Actually all of the trans and tcase stuff can be done well w/ a quality trans jack. Most of the suggestions are based off of being by yourself w/ no help.

J20
__________________
BP Drivetrain...........

Driveshafts for all Jeeps, Constant velocity rebuilds, Replacement, Repair
775-537-7918

https://www.facebook.com/BPShafts/
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 02-13-2013, 12:10 AM
44BZ's Avatar
44BZ 44BZ is offline
304 AMC
 
Join Date: Dec 10, 2009
Location: oregon city, or
Posts: 1,567
Quote:
Originally Posted by eps_jeeps
44BZ
Having done this once already would you still leave the bell housing on the transmission or put it on the engine so you could install the starter before installing the engine.

Thanks again all for the help.

For me, it made the most sense to leave the bell on the trans. I had read others experiences with the motor swingin in the engine bay, crushing heater cores and other things, so I was a little anxious about the install and decided to keep it simple. I left the front clip and valance in place, used a common two ton hoist, and installed the motor myself. My brother helped me muscle the trans into place after that. I also installed the T/C myself and I put the crossmember in last. I installed the starter much later. I'm not sure how the I6 is setup though. My only experience is with the 327
__________________
Zack - 68 J2000, AMC 327, 4bbl intake, dual exhaust, Pertronix upgrade, Holley 600cfm, T18, dana 20 (twin sticked), 3" body lift w/ 35x12.50 MTRs ~ running AND driving!
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 02-13-2013, 09:03 AM
blazer3664's Avatar
blazer3664 blazer3664 is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Mar 08, 2009
Location: Fayette county Illinois
Posts: 976
What I normally do on vehicles like ours.....

1) Remove front clip, dont take very long, usually less time than you will spend cussing and fixing things that get smushed going over it.

2) install engine with trans attached

3) install t-case

4)put front clip back on, should be a snap.

Thats how I did mine.

Jim
__________________
modified flares, removable top, OBA w/200psi tank,
LQ4, 4L80e,NWF doubler w/upside down 203
SOA w/ D44s F+R for now
H1 wheels+tires (cut), hydroboost brakes
custom shackle flip
W/F150 springs
-----Coming Soon-----
snorkels,
OX'd D60/14B-FF
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 02-13-2013, 10:17 AM
Mr. Goatman's Avatar
Mr. Goatman Mr. Goatman is offline
Gear Head
 
Join Date: Jan 05, 2006
Location: Alamogordo, NM
Posts: 589
I've done one with the front in place and one with the front removed (360/727/208) It can be done either way. Be sure to have stands/jacks/blocks under to move and prop. The last couple I just did the engine/tranny and it is much easier that way. The T-case is pretty easy to bolt on from the underside.
__________________
Remember; When it comes to tools and toys forgiveness is ALWAYS easier than permission!
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Transmission or Transfer case? gorehound General FSJ Discussion 9 07-01-2010 05:13 PM
Transfer Case Questions Thomas792 General FSJ Tech 10 12-20-2007 05:27 PM
Transmission, Transfer Case, and engine rebuild...New England Area...Argghh! jgarcia2 General FSJ Tech 4 04-12-2004 04:16 PM
AMC/Jeep Manual Transmission Info James 007 General FSJ Tech 0 09-02-2002 07:40 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
corner corner