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  #41  
Old 05-21-2008, 03:30 AM
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wickedwagon767 wickedwagon767 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by budojeepr

I thought this project would be a simpler one than the 454 for Leroy. HOWEVER, that is not the case. I'm (re-)learning the lesson that there is no such thing as a one-component swap.

Anybody heard from user "Brad W" lately (rhetorical - I'll do a search)?

I won't have to worry about the high cost of diesel fuel. I'll be smack out of cash by the time the Jeep's ready to drive!


I'm running into some of my own potholes! Absolutely right. No sucha thing as a one-component swap. I'm swapping Dana60's under Sinjin with 38's. The Quadratrac won't survive...which means T-case swap and driveshafts......oh,wait, forgot the D60 front swap means I get to/have to run crossover steering too.......more power,cooling,cage,bumpers.......bank loan!

you can only hope to retain some sanity by laughing at yourself



Brad W just posted within the last day. Just don't remember where I saw him post
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  #42  
Old 05-21-2008, 08:39 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DieselSJ
How about running a clocking ring? MUCH cheaper than an adapter.
Never heard of such a thing. Got a vendor? How would it work? Would the thickness of the ring affect the strength of the shaft/spline/input gear joint? Would that also affect the drive shaft lengths? The way it's working out now, even with the Novak adapter, I won't have to change the drive shafts at all.

Moot point...I've already ordered an adapter, sans shaft, from Novak.

Here are some pics from last night's welding of engine mounts, and the suspension with the engine weight on (I know, a lot of stuff is still missing that would add a lot of weight). A nice stroke of luck - one of the holes for the welds in the Novak mounts on each side works for the shock mounts. How cool is that?

Also, the front axle/suspension/steering is still WAY dirty. That whole assembly is coming out so I can do spring work and gearing, once I have the engine/trans swap stuff worked out. Then it's clean and paint time!









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  #43  
Old 05-21-2008, 11:27 AM
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DieselSJ DieselSJ is offline
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A clocking ring is just a 3/4" thick ring that bolts between the trans and transfer case. It has multiple patterns so it lets you clock the tcase in 5 or 6 different positions. Advance has them, and I would imagine that Novak has them also. IIRC they were about $100 or so.
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  #44  
Old 05-24-2008, 10:31 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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The Novak adapter came in yesterday. Seriously nice piece of casting/machine work. I'll have some time this weekend to put it in and get the crossmember all set.

Then we're off doing details. Feels like it's coming together!
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  #45  
Old 05-24-2008, 08:40 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Main tasks are done

Got the transfer case mounted up with the Novak adapter today. The foot they supplied bolted right to the same holes the old one used. It's all in the same location; the drive shafts should not need any modifications save new u-joints.





My assistant, Rock Star. Not good at swapping tools or fetching the occasional beverage, but he has a great can-do attitude.
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  #46  
Old 07-02-2008, 11:03 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Turbo!

Well, got the turbo last night. I took pics, will download from the camera later.

It fits! No sheetmetal cutting necessary, and I may be able to use the stock heater box too!

Now I'm going to have to get serious about the dual batteries setup; I'm putting the second one in the back under the seat - got a hole cut out and starting to fab a box.

Then I'll start sticking the body parts back on.

Woot! Maybe I'll have a tow rig for an August Rubicon trip in the J-truck!

(Going off-topic here, but it's just a feeler: Anybody interested in running the Rubicon in August? I did it last year and had a blast.)
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  #47  
Old 08-04-2008, 09:33 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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New radiator and pusher fan

I've put on the front sheet-metal...figured out that the Wagoneer had been in an accident, driver's side bashed a bit and some parts replaced. Anyway, it all fit together, with some persuasion.

Also, because of the crash, things were kind of squished together, so I could not fit the 4-row radiator from the J-4000 truck. I bought an aftermarket aluminum cross-flow - the same one I'm using with Leroy and the 454 - from Summit Racing. Here's the saga about fitting the radiator and fan...

First, I decided to use the fan from the Jeep I-6. It has more blades than the GM fan, steeper pitch, the same blade diameter, and it's also a clutch fan. It's also slightly shorter than the GM fan...so I measured from the water pump pulley and figured out I needed 1-7/8" more space. Moving the engine/trans/transfer case back is out of the question at this point, so I made a cutout so I could move the radiator forward.

I used the scissors jack from the GF's Honda, along with a length of DOM tubing I had in the bin, and jacked the radiator supports apart. This allowed the radiator to fall down into place; once I loosened the jack it tightened up again like the Jaws of Death. On these Jeeps the radiator is offset about 2-3/8" to the driver's side (best I can measure), I guess to allow space for the battery on the passenger's side. I used the shroud from the I-6 (since it already fit and the offset was built-in), with some trimming with the jigsaw. Luckily the whole thing fit fairly nicely and the shroud looks like it covers about 1/2 of the fan blade when viewed from the side.

I did a bit of junkyarding (shoe-shopping, I say) and found a pusher fan out of an upscale Mercedes 450 SEL. Had to remove the Mercedes radiator to get it out, but it's perfect. It fits right in the rhino grille area and should be a nice addition to the cooling system. Pics to follow as soon as I can carve out some time to play on the computer.
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Last edited by budojeepr : 08-04-2008 at 03:48 PM. Reason: Add title
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  #48  
Old 09-01-2008, 09:38 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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More diesel install pics

Well, this being Labor Day I figured I'd Labor At The Computer.

Two days ago I participated in the festive Pick n Pull 1/2 Price Day and scored two fairly nice seats from a '96 Chevy Astro (remember The Jetson's dog? Rasro? ) Van. I removed the pedestal from each and then removed the pedestal (brackets) from the stock Jeep seats. I put the Jeep brackets on the Rasro seats and match-drilled two holes. I reassembled it with hardware found lying on the bench, then cussed a bit and took it apart again and reassembled, this time with all the springs and levers to make it adjust.

The holes fit fairly well with the holes in the floor, and the seats are pretty comfortable (MUCH more comfortable than the stock buckets). The discerning eye will see a couple other interesting details (not necessarily of the seats).




They need to be cleaned up a bit, and I think I'll go find some nice covers.

Next here are some shots of the turbo going in:
As received from eBay seller:


Test fit:


Then I removed the spot welds on the grille support:


Did a basic bondo/fill/sand/paint job to last until I paint the whole thing:


Here it is, assembled and fit with the grille on. That's a battery cable from the second battery (mounted in the back-back) running across the top...I hadn't trimmed it and soldered the terminal on yet.


More assembly pictures...

Turbo oil feed line, 3/8" aluminum:


Assembly showing radiator, hoses, fan, shroud. I'm using the Jeep I-6 fan (same diameter, more blades, hopefully the clutch works for this application) and the Jeep shroud, trimmed to fit. Upper hose is one from my box o'stuff and some Ace Hardware PVC fittings. The lower hose is a stock one, trimmed to fit.


Better shot of the radiator mount modifications. I moved the radiator forward about 1-1/4". You can also see the accelerator cable. I pulled one from a junkyard 6.2L and it fits, just had to trim the little plastic thing that goes through the firewall.


Side shot showing turbo and battery, too:


Final pic for today shows Mercedes pusher fan in front. I used wisdom gained from my recent Rubicon relay-blowing-up trip to wire the fan. It has a 40-amp relay, an inline 30-amp circuit breaker, and 12-gauge wire. I also bought a nice switch to control it. I'm hoping the clutch fan will do most of the work and I only have to switch on the pusher in traffic or other low-rpm applications. We'll see...


I'm currently working on drive shafts (clean and new u-joints), turbo oil return line, heater hoses (stuck plug on the water pump! GRRRR!), fuel tank filler hose, and testing and cleaning up the hurrah's nest of wiring.

Since there's a fairly excellent chance of never getting an intercooler to fit in this space, I'm considering a water-injection system (watch out! pop-ups!). Any opinions?

Also, the Dana 44 rear axle currently has 3.54:1 gears (the front still has the stock 2.72:1). The calculator on Novak's web site says I'll turn about 2500rpm at 75mph (27" tire dia., measured radius from ground to axle center, .76:1 trans overdrive, 1:1 transfer case). If I switch back to the AMC20 with 2.72:1 gears, rpms drop to about 1930.

For a turbocharged diesel that's going to see mostly highway cruising (VERY little 'wheeling - Leroy does the rock crawling) and maybe light towing, which is the better rpm range? Opinions?

Then I should be able to put in the fluids, run the oil pump with a drill motor, and start it! Nothing to it! Clear sailing! What could possibly go wrong?
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  #49  
Old 09-01-2008, 11:42 AM
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DieselSJ DieselSJ is offline
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Where are you going to mount the oil cooler? They are an absolute necessity for these engines.

Looking good so far! Is your stock heater going to work?

What turbo is that? GM-?

Gearing - is that a 700R4? If so, the OD is .70, not .76. I'm running 3.31 gears with the stock 235/75/15 tires and things feel like they would be better with a 3.42 gear. 2.73 will be way too low. I don't have a tach on mine so I don't know what PRMs I'm turning, I just know that a slightly lower gear would be nice. At 55mph with the converter locked I can barely generate any boost (2-3psi) because the revs are so low. Your stock turbo might spool up a little easier though.
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-99 XJ Limited.
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-Member, FSJ Prissy Restoration Association

Last edited by DieselSJ : 09-01-2008 at 11:48 AM.
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  #50  
Old 09-01-2008, 01:14 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DieselSJ
Where are you going to mount the oil cooler? They are an absolute necessity for these engines.
Oil cooler is from a V8 Grand Cherokee, and is mounted next to the driver side headlight. Hopefully the hole that's usually blanked off with rhino grilles will give it enough air flow.

I also have a trans cooler mounted under the passenger side.

Quote:
Looking good so far! Is your stock heater going to work?
Dunno. I took it off in preparation for the turbo install. I'm going to test the fit a bit later. Hopefully I can use it; however, I've had to remove the air conditioning condenser and assoc. junk. Perhaps I'll go with a Vintage Air setup later - having no A/C in Redding, CA in the summer...sucks. For example, we're expected to remain above 100 degrees (daily highs) for the next week. And it's September. Ack.

Quote:
What turbo is that? GM-?
Dunno. How do I tell? There is a raised numeral "5" in two places along with a bunch of other numbers and text. No tag, at least any I can read. It's from a '96 Yukon if that helps.

Quote:
Gearing - is that a 700R4? If so, the OD is .70, not .76.
Yes, stock 700R4. By cracky, you're right. A 30% overdrive?

Quote:
I'm running 3.31 gears with the stock 235/75/15 tires and things feel like they would be better with a 3.42 gear. 2.73 will be way too low. I don't have a tach on mine so I don't know what PRMs I'm turning, I just know that a slightly lower gear would be nice. At 55mph with the converter locked I can barely generate any boost (2-3psi) because the revs are so low. Your stock turbo might spool up a little easier though.
That is good information to have. I'll stick with the Dana until I know more. Looks like I'll be re-gearing the front axle! Thanks!
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  #51  
Old 09-28-2008, 06:25 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Trying to start - issues (long)

Well, I've gotten to the point of trying to start the Diesel Wagoneer! Fuel pump works, glow plugs work, starter works...but I'm not getting fuel out of the IP. I'm getting fuel to it, I'm sure - the filter filled up, and it even pressurized the line into the IP.

I cracked the fittings to all the injectors (at the same time), but even when I turn the engine over for 10 seconds or so, nothing comes out...

So I think I'm having issues with the wiring on the injection pump. None of the wiring diagrams in any of the three manuals I have for the diesel Suburban show the injection pump wiring.

I have a photo I took before I disassembled everything:


There is a connector with three leads on the Throttle Position Sensor. One pink, one tan w/trace, and one yellow. The Haynes Diesel techbook I bought says the pink gets battery voltage, and the yellow is for EGR. However, the same book says the (nonexistent) blue wire is for EPR (Exhaust Pressure Regulator). There are two more leads on a separate connector that are for the transmission (doesn't allow lockup in 4wd). I figure none of these are affecting the fuel feed.

There are also two male spade lugs on the top if the injection pump. The one closest to the front they say is the injection pump solenoid, and should get at least 9 volts. They hint in the text that it's a pink lead...picture shows it's pink, but I don't know where it comes from. The lug lower down and rearward is the cold advance terminal. A picture in the manual shows that it's just a jumper from the IP solenoid, but my donor was rigged with the cold idle solenoid, which makes more sense.

OK, I put 12 volts to both the IP solenoid and the cold advance terminal, and tried again. No luck. Manual says you have to have a good fuel return line (low back pressure), so I simply pointed the detached fuel return line into a cup and tried again. No luck.

What else can I do to try to get fuel out of the injection pump? Please help me get this thing started!



Brad
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Last edited by budojeepr : 09-28-2008 at 06:50 PM.
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  #52  
Old 09-28-2008, 07:46 PM
rowdy235 rowdy235 is offline
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bad injector pump? Sorry don't know a whole lot about diesel but there must be some way to test it.
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  #53  
Old 09-29-2008, 03:10 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rowdy235
bad injector pump? Sorry don't know a whole lot about diesel but there must be some way to test it.
Well, for now I'm hoping one of our local diesel-heads will pipe up with wiring directions.
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  #54  
Old 09-30-2008, 10:28 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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It lives!

Never mind, I got a link to the wiring on another forum. Also a bit of instruction on bleeding the air from the fuel lines helped.

Video clip!
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  #55  
Old 10-01-2008, 07:02 AM
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sweet!! looks like this thing is really comin along well!
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  #56  
Old 10-01-2008, 10:38 AM
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The PIG Smith The PIG Smith is offline
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I am glad you solved that wiring/starting issue.
You are now the default Go-2-Answer man for Diesel Wiring! HAHAHAHA
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...but if it works, I wouldn't touch it.
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  #57  
Old 10-01-2008, 01:25 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The PIG Smith
I am glad you solved that wiring/starting issue.
You are now the default Go-2-Answer man for Diesel Wiring! HAHAHAHA
You'll get what you pay for...I wasn't thinking when I first started it (exulting, actually). Then turned off the key and it still ran...I'd jumpered the wire on the injection pump. Just took off the jumper and it died.

The wiring is deceptively simple - starter, fuel pump, and injector pump solenoid are all that are needed to run. Glow plugs, alternator, oil and water temp, etc. are just extras. Granted, without glow plugs you'll probably burn up your starter, but...
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  #58  
Old 10-07-2008, 10:10 AM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Well, I was nearly ready to back it out of the garage for the first time Sunday, when I remembered to check the lug nuts on the front axle (I'd left 3 off and the other three loose on each wheel while it was up on jack stands).

I shut it off, tightened lug nuts, cleared junk off the fenders and from around the wheels, and went to start it back up. CLICK. No start.

Did some testing and found that the starter solenoid pops out as it should, the starter won't turn. Don't know why, but a 24-year-old starter from Oregon can go bad suddenly.

I checked AutoZone and Kragen, and both have starters available, $179 and up for remanufactured units. !!

Checked eBay, and got a BRAND-NEW one for $84.95. Shipped today already, shipping is $30. Pays to shop around, I guess.
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  #59  
Old 10-07-2008, 12:31 PM
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I am really looking forward to seeing how this does for you. How much clearance do you have between the back of the heads and the firewall?
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  #60  
Old 10-17-2008, 11:52 PM
budojeepr budojeepr is offline
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Maiden voyage 2008-10-17

Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepinPete
I am really looking forward to seeing how this does for you. How much clearance do you have between the back of the heads and the firewall?
Hey JP, sorry, I never saw your reply. I've been waiting for the starter to come in...I moved the engine back as far as I could without clanking the heads into the firewall. I'd say there's about 1/2" clearance now.

Coupla updates...

- I found out for sure that the stock heater core and fan won't fit with the turbo on.

- The new starter works great. Dual battery setup works great (second battery is in a case in the back). Glow plugs work. Electric fuel pump works. Lights, fan, other accessories work. Yaaaaaaay.

- I started it up tonight, backed it out of the garage (for the first time since February?), putted up and down our private road. Sounds good. Yaaaaaaaaay.

- It still needs more ATF?? I've got nearly 3 gallons in there now!

- Leaks a bit of coolant from the bottom hose where it's clamped to the water pump. Gonna see if the clamp needs tightening.

- Leaks a bit of oil where the bulkhead fitting (hose from the turbo oil outlet) goes into the oil pan.

- Power steering and hydroboost brakes work just fine.
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