International Full Size Jeep Association
Home Forums Reader's Rigs Tech Library Trail Stories FSJ-List
International Full Size Jeep Association  

Go Back   International Full Size Jeep Association > Tech Archives > Body

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #181  
Old 06-10-2004, 09:52 AM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

Oh yea to let you all know. We still have to clear the Chero. Ill have a really good post on that.

Then I have taken another 45 pics totally explaining wetsanding dust nibs in the clear coat, then using a buffer to make a show car shine.

I also will have a set of posts on fixing runs, sags and drips in the paint, with a method that will remove them so knowone ever knows.

I will also explain some plastic light lens restoration, that really works..

Thats my advertisement for the day.... Thats all the time I have for the moment..

Ive got to get off to downloading more pics.

Stay Tuned All!!!

Carey
__________________
80 Cherokee S W/T 360/727/208 Daily Driver to Work Everyday driver. Really nice original Interior. My own Cool black paint job, with an AMC theme. Custom manual rear window. Painted Razor grille. 4 inch BJ's lift with Rancho shocks, custom fabbed bumpers, steel Levi rally wheels with 32 BFG at's. TFI upgrade, '98 S10 Blazer power steering box.
Reply With Quote
  #182  
Old 06-11-2004, 07:46 AM
TexasJ10's Avatar
TexasJ10 TexasJ10 is offline
FSJ Maniac
 
Join Date: Jan 03, 2002
Location: Houston, Texas
Posts: 2,725
Post

dagnabit, The last few pics are coming up little boxes with X's for me.
__________________
* 1981 stepside, 360, 727, 208, almost stock daily driver.
* 1982 Laredo j-10, 360, 727, in rough shape and in the process of being rebuilt with 401, NV4500, Klune,
. NP205,d60 front, d70 rear, fender work and minimal lift. It will probably take 10 years
* 1973 jcab mounted on 1983 j20 frame. 360/t18/208 d44/d60. Almost completed
Reply With Quote
  #183  
Old 06-11-2004, 10:19 AM
tgreese's Avatar
tgreese tgreese is offline
 
Join Date: May 29, 2003
Location: Medford MA USA
Posts: 10,519
Post

It's a problem with www.fullsizejeeps.com - I expect the site will come back soon.
__________________
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Reply With Quote
  #184  
Old 06-16-2004, 11:27 AM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

Ok onto clearcoat.

I got some needed sleep after all the stripping. I started at about 1pm.. I tacked the rig well, mixed some clear, and started spraying.. I was finished by 230pm.

I used PPG Omni MC161 clear with MH168 hardner. This product doesnt use a reducer. If you do use a reducer with this product you may see major flow causing nasty runs, and you may see solvent popping. Solvent popping is when reducer leaves the product after the product has skinned off causing little eruptions in the surface looking like many little holes or also looking like small fisheyes. Pretty much the job is ruined when this happens. This is a good reason to stay with MFR specs and directions. I had no solvent popping.

It is mixed 2 parts clear to one part hardner. I bought a gallon of clear, and two quarts of hardner. After applying two full coats I had about 8 ounces of clear left. That was pushin things a bit close. It didnt leave much room for error if I needed more.

The Hardner has isocyanates in it, so please use a resperator, latex gloves, a paint suit, and a hair covering when spraying.. The clear overspray is very sticky, it will take several hair washings to get it out. It is not safe to breath without a resperator for about 4-6 hours after spraying, so just be carefull!!

This clear is made to be used as a clear for a complete. For doing smaller jobs use MC260 quick clear. It uses the same hardner. It will flash much quicker which will prevent runs and will dry much quicker. The reason for slow and fast clears are the slower clears allow you to get all the way around the vehicle before flashing off, if youve used the correct hardner for the temp. This way you wont have a dry edge when returning to the point you started clearing. The faster clears are not meant to be rejoined to your starting point. Lets say you are doing a front clip with fast clear. Youll start on one side and end up stopping on the other. Basically a good guide is if you have to clear back to the starting point joining the two together use slower clear. If you can start and stop without rejoing the clear, use fast clear. Also when just clearcoating pieces and parts, youll get better results with a quick clear. Hope that makes any since, if not let me know!

On the hardner. PPG Omni MC161 uses MH167 fast for 70* and under, MH168 slow for70-85* and, and MH169 for 85-100*. Anything above 100* use some MR189 retarder starting with adding 10% to your ready to spray quart of mixed clear(clear mixed with hardner)

The info sheets call for a 1.5-1.7mm tip on your gun. The warmer it is, youll be able to get away with a bigger tip. I used my DeVillbiss GTI with a 1.6mm tip. I could have gotten away with a 1.4mm tip. The 1.6 was nice but you really need to play close attention not to double coat when your clearcoating. I used 3 and 1/4 turns out on the fluid control adjustment on the spray gun on the first coat, and 3 and 1/2 turns out on the second coat. When spraying the clear, I held my gun 6-8 inches from the surface, using 25-30lbs air pressure at the gun. Be sure and use a 50% overlap. this will be your finished look, as this will be the final stage everyone will see.. If your new to this get a practice panel to make adjustments on before spraying your rig.

As your spraying watch the clear going on. If you are getting a small bit of puddling or movement as the clear lays on the rig, back off a bit. Most clears will need to be sprayed just as you want them to look. If your seeing the clear moveing a bit as its sprayed, you may see runs, but there again a very small amount of movement as your spraying is good. We are trying to achieve that lil fine line of perfection. lol It takes practice to get that sweet smooth look, and it will come to ya with some patience and practice!!! I swear anyone can paint with patience and practice!! Getting the clear to lay totally slick is about impossible. Take a look at any new car and youll see lots of peel in the clear on most. To get clear looking totally slick will take wetsanding and buffing. Or sanding the clear with 1000 then laying down 1 nice flow coat. If your spraying and notice lots of peel or a dry look, then you will need to make adjustments. If your seeing heavy peel, try backing off on the fluid adjustment first, then possibly adding more air presure. Peel is caused by spraying too big of a droplet of paint, or poor atomization. The smaller droplet you can make will get the clear looking smoother. If your seeing a dry or flat look as your spraying, but the peel is ok, just slow down till you see it looking nice as your spraying.

It was around 78* when I cleared the Chero. It was just a bit cool so I had to be pretty carefull not to push things too hard.

The info sheets spec just two coats. You could use more, but two coats is plenty to give your job many years of protection. Again using more clear will affect mill thickness, and too much mill thickness will not be chip resistant.

My mill thickness guage is reading 10 mills after getting the job done. That includes the etch, primer, sealer, basecoat, and clearcoat. That is right in spec. The info sheets call for 1.2 mills per coat of clear.

I wish I could have takin pics as I was spraying but clear overspray is sticky and hard to remove. I have a nice digi-cam and I didnt want to ruin it... Sorry.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g.../paint0001.jpg

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g.../paint0002.jpg

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g.../paint0003.jpg
There was just a bit of dirt in the hood. I will be making a post on wetsanding and buffing soon. That will remove any dust nibs I had in the hood.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g.../paint0004.jpg

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g.../paint0005.jpg

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g.../paint0006.jpg

Till Later... Carey

[ June 16, 2004, 04:36 PM: Message edited by: 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado ]
__________________
80 Cherokee S W/T 360/727/208 Daily Driver to Work Everyday driver. Really nice original Interior. My own Cool black paint job, with an AMC theme. Custom manual rear window. Painted Razor grille. 4 inch BJ's lift with Rancho shocks, custom fabbed bumpers, steel Levi rally wheels with 32 BFG at's. TFI upgrade, '98 S10 Blazer power steering box.
Reply With Quote
  #185  
Old 06-16-2004, 03:05 PM
Justin Kerns's Avatar
Justin Kerns Justin Kerns is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Feb 24, 2004
Location: Denver, CO
Posts: 975
Post

Man that is looking very nice! Once again thanks for all the info and please keep it coming!

Justin
__________________
Justin
79 Cherokee S 360, TH400, QT
Reply With Quote
  #186  
Old 06-22-2004, 12:02 PM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

I went ahead and let the Chero sit in the garage for the rest of the week to allow the paint to dry and cure. The info sheets spec just a 16 hour dry time at 70* till you can polish and put into service. This is a pretty quick curing clear. A week or two cure time should be the max wait time before buffing. The longer it dries the harder it will be to buff.

This will be a pretty big post. Wetsanding and buffing takes some finese and patients, there will be alot of info here on this subject. Anyone can wetsand and buff. It just takes a few tools and be willing to follow MFR's directions to make a showy finish. Even you all that have an older job can benifit from wetsanding and buffing. Only use 2000 grit paper on older paint and nothing corser and youll be fine!

Anytime a vehicle is painted complete, there will be a spot or two the painter is not happy with. Problems can be a run or drip, dirt or dust in the finish, a dry spot that looks a bit dull, excessive orange peel. Any of these problems can be fixed in the buffing process. We are only human and every complete I have ever done has needed a little TLC somewhere after the job was done. But here is where a little spot your not happy with can be fixed so knowone will ever know.

My hood had more dirt than I wanted. Anytime you paint in a garage there will be an excess of dirt in the finish, but even many paint booths will produce a job needing buffing. I will take you thru the entire process of buffing and fixing any little paint problems.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0001.jpg
Here the hood is after painting. It is hard to see the dirt here, there was some dust on the hood, but pay attention to the depth of the reflection in the lights. Youll see a big change here in the reflection as we proceed.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0003.jpg
For my hood I will be using 1500 grit to wetsand the clear coat. I wouldnt reccomend anything corser. You could use 1200 if you have alot of peel then go back over that with 1500, before buffing.. On show cars, I will use 1500, then I'll go back over with 2000.

Use a half sheet folded into thirds over a soft block. On show rigs I only use a block, on a daily driver I will use my hand. You can cause little ripples in the surface if your not carefull. So just use a soft block and this way you wont make finger mark ripples or waves in the clear when sanding. I like to use a squirt bottle with just a bit of Meguires carwash soap. This will lube the surface and make it easier to sand. I only use Meguires buffing products. There are other brands that work well, but for me its Meguires or nothin.

Try to sand in one direction if possible. It will be easier to buff that way. Stay away from any sharp edges or body lines. You can sand right thru edges and corners easilly. Try not to sand your panel to the very edge. Again it will be hard to buff the edge of a panel without problems. Just sand within 1/4 inch of the edge unless its a show job. I will not go into buffing for shows here as that is a entirely different process.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0004.jpg
Here I have started wetsanding and am checking my progress. I use a small squeege, 3M #05517 to dry the area quickly. I need to see my sanded area dry to see my progress.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0005.jpg
If you will look close you can see lil pock marks still in the clear, these were the dust nibs. We are sanding them flat. We also see a bit of peel left here. I will sand till I see no more pock marks or peel.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0006.jpg
A beter pic of my progress. Again I see that I need more sanding.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0007.jpg
Here you can see the little bit of peel I had is now gone as are the little pock marks, or dust nibs... This is now ready to buff.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0009.jpg
If you will mask/tape off any areas prior to buffing, it will make your cleanup much easier. Buffing tends to be very messy.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0008.jpg
I'm using a Makita Buffer #9227C It is a variable speed buffer. It turns from 1000-3000 rpm. I will be buffing with around 2100 rpm here that the clear is pretty hard. If your clear is fresher and softer use a slower speed, like 1500 rpm to start. If its older still stay with 2100-2300rpms I'm using Meguires Diamond Cut Compound to start with. You can apply it to the pad, which I generally do. But for demonstation I will apply it to the rig first before buffing. Either way will work. Try and buff small sections at a time like 12inches x 18inches. If you get too big of an area going, the product will dry prematurely, and youll have to start the buff over.

[ June 22, 2004, 07:04 PM: Message edited by: 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado ]
Reply With Quote
  #187  
Old 06-22-2004, 12:46 PM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0010.jpg
You will want to buff the compound back to a shine. Meguires uses a rouge in the formula that will polish as it dusts out(starts to dry). Buff till its dry and then buff a lil more to allow the rouge to polish the clear. This is only the first step, we have a ways to go here!

Meguires recommends a dust mask because of silica in the product. And use saftey glasses! This stuff will burn your eyes. I never have used a dust mask and thats probably why I have breathing problems. I'm a dumb a**!

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0011.jpg
Here I am cleaning my Meguires #W-4000 cutting pad. Only use a buffer pad cleaner to clean the wool. If you use a sharp object such as a screw driver your pad will wear out much quicker. This lil buffing cleaner tool was like 7-8 bucks from the Snap-On truck, so just get one! Paint stores will have them in stock!

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0012.jpg
After cleaning my buffing pad using the Diamond Cut, I will use Meguires Dual Action Polish with my W4000 pad spinning again at 2100rpm. Here the product is on the surface. The Dual Action will remove the Diamond cut scratches. You can see the swirl scratches in the clear in this pic from the Diamond Cut.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0013.jpg
You will want to buff the Dual Action out to a shine again letting the rouge do the polishing.

In this pic you can see the depth definition we are starting to achieve.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0014.jpg
Another pic. You can see that the swirl scratches are finer using the Dual Action. We need to continue to use finer products to get a nice swirl free smooth finish.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0015.jpg
Here after the Dual Action wool stage we are now ready for a softer pad. I will use a Meguires W-9006 soft buff pad to finish the rig out. You can see the depth we are starting to see in the finish before using the final products.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0016.jpg
I'm using Meguires Dual Action with the soft buff pad. Do not take it to a shine. It is about impossible to get the product to dust out using this foam pad. Buff it out till the product begins to dry smear and stop.

[ June 23, 2004, 02:52 PM: Message edited by: 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado ]
Reply With Quote
  #188  
Old 06-22-2004, 01:20 PM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0017.jpg
After the Dual Action stage using the foam we are getting more depth. Here I'm showing my homemade wiring job on the ceiling for my lights....... oops!!! lol.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0018.jpg
Another pic. You can still see just a bit of scratches after foam pad. These are now very minor and will come out easilly at this point.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0019.jpg
This is after using the Dual action with foam. You will have quite a bit of compound let over on the panel. Get a wet terry towel and wipe down the surface, removing the Dual Action so youll be ready for the next stage.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0020.jpg
Here is a reflection of the next product stage. I will be using Meguires Machine Glaze with the W9006 soft buff pad. I will wash out the pad before using the glaze, getting the dual action out of the pad. Just use warm water with foam pad under the sink and flush till its clean.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0021.jpg
Again buff the glaze till it dry smears.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0022.jpg
I like to use the machine glaze liberally. This is the final stage. I like to buff this in a short moving pattern to reduce seeing any swirl marks after the job is done.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0024.jpg
Here the hood is done using Machine Glaze. It now needs wiped down with a terry cloth(dry)
You can use Meguires Final Inspection after to remove any unwanted residue.

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0025.jpg
And the satisfying shine after the buff job on the hood.

[ June 22, 2004, 06:29 PM: Message edited by: 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado ]
Reply With Quote
  #189  
Old 06-22-2004, 01:41 PM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/jeeps/g...s/buff0026.jpg
Heres the reason for the masking before buffing. The mask will catch the buffing slag making the cleanup 100 times easier!!!

I only buffed my hood. You can do the whole rig. My rig looks just fine for a daily driver so I decided not to buff any more than the hood. When doing a show car I will often buff for 15-20 hours doing the whole car. This will win ya many trophies at the shows. On some of my jobs you could easilly shave in the reflection. Buffing takes alot of work, you will feel it in your back. If your back is a bit weak like mine, use a kidney belt, this helps alot!! I like to mask off each panel, making cleanup a snap!!

I guess my fingers have about had it for the night, so I'll quit here...

I will have another cool post showing how to remove any runs or drips from your finish later...

For now, Good Night!!

Carey
__________________
80 Cherokee S W/T 360/727/208 Daily Driver to Work Everyday driver. Really nice original Interior. My own Cool black paint job, with an AMC theme. Custom manual rear window. Painted Razor grille. 4 inch BJ's lift with Rancho shocks, custom fabbed bumpers, steel Levi rally wheels with 32 BFG at's. TFI upgrade, '98 S10 Blazer power steering box.
Reply With Quote
  #190  
Old 08-06-2004, 07:21 PM
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado's Avatar
4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado 4x4n In A Cherokee In Colorado is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Oct 29, 2003
Location: Canon City, Colorado
Posts: 757
Post

Hi, I have about 1 more page, and I'll be done with this post.. I'm gonna try to get it done real soon.. Its just my life goes into high gear in summer.. I'm making time to finish this up though, its been buggin me..

Carey
__________________
80 Cherokee S W/T 360/727/208 Daily Driver to Work Everyday driver. Really nice original Interior. My own Cool black paint job, with an AMC theme. Custom manual rear window. Painted Razor grille. 4 inch BJ's lift with Rancho shocks, custom fabbed bumpers, steel Levi rally wheels with 32 BFG at's. TFI upgrade, '98 S10 Blazer power steering box.
Reply With Quote
  #191  
Old 08-07-2004, 02:50 AM
roadgrime roadgrime is offline
Master Mechanic
 
Join Date: Apr 17, 2003
Location: boise ID
Posts: 1,438
Post

Hey 4x4 dont forget to post pics of how you fixed the dent in the hood from breaking your motor mount in ouray just after you put that nice new paint job on the rig

i am re reading this all again since im gonna be doing another one here soon.

chris
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
corner corner