V8 cam, intake and carb swap +Random pics of 8600/1406/3731 going in...almost there!

[newtojeeps]

Did you not install a valley pan in this rebuild?

[peej07]

?

[shiner2001]

Sorry about that, never saw that question on the thread. For no other reason other than that I forgot, no, I did not reinstall the valley pan. From what I gather, the problem that could arise would be oil getting sucked in the PCV valve. I haven't had time to get back to the project, but we'll see how it goes without it. Fingers crossed.

[shiner2001]

Couple more pics...couple more questions...

OK, here are a few more of what are probably quite elementary questions, but I am gonna ask them anyway...everyone's always so helpful!

First here is a picture of the way the PCV will look after you use the HELP! #42059 grommet and the Purolator #PV229 PCV valve (just a random one I picked off the shelf beacause it looked like it would fit in the grommet). I used an 11/16" deep socket placed over the PCV and to tap it down into the grommet as it was a tight fit. There is a shoulder around the OD of the valve that the socket sat perfectly against, allowing it to be tapped inwithout damaging the nipple on the top of it.



Here is a picture of the one exhaust manifold bolt that I broke off when removing my AIR tubes and the JB weld that was used to plug it.



Here is the plug and fitting used (earlier referenced as B and C in another photo). The hose barb out of the back of the carb is hooked to the brake booster with some new 3/8" tubing.




And now for a couple more of my "what goes here?" questions...

This one's pretty straightforward. What goes in G? Or does it just get plugged like B did?



Here is a picture that shows the new hose running from the PCV to the front nipple on the carb. My question is, what happens to the old hose that ran from the stock carb to the canister on the passenger fender? In this picture that is designated as H1 to H2. If that is pulled from the canister and removed, does that port on the canister just get a plug? If so, what about the smaller tube that Y's off it on the H1 side of the blue filter(?) (which is not very evident in this photo, sorry).



Finally, everyone's favorite, a timing/distributor vacuum question. Similar to the last one, in theory. If I run a new vacuum hose from new carb directly to the distributor, replacing the old one that is still hooked up in this picture and labeled J1 to J2, do I plug the port left where J1 hooks up on the CTO that is threaded on the back of the thermostat housing?





I seriously need to stop taking a month off before getting back to work on this thing. Thanks as always for everyone's help!

[Chris P.]

The hole you labeled G is a manifold vacuum port. The brake booster hose commonly hooks there as it does on the stock manifold, but where you have it hooked should be fine.

For the CTO on the thermostat housing, you can either leave it there unhooked or you can remove and plug the hole. If you leave the CTO there you don't need to plug any of the nipples as they are not connected to anything.

You can run the disttributor vacuum from either a ported vacuum port on the carb or the hole labeled G for manifold vacuum. The factory setup was ported, but manifold vacuum will give you cooler and smoother idling, and better throttle response.

[shiner2001]

For the CTO on the thermostat housing, you can either leave it there unhooked or you can remove and plug the hole. If you leave the CTO there you don't need to plug any of the nipples as they are not connected to anything.

Do you mean remove the entire CTO from the thermostat hosing and just plug that hole? If so, then what about the other ends of all the other hoses that were connected to the CTO? I haven't heard of totally removing this, so that's where the questions are coming from. As far as removing any portion of the vacuum system, that is generally where my questions are coming from...kind of a "then what with the other end?" thing.

Are there any downsides to removing the entire CTO? Anyone?

[Chris P.]

I didn't realize you have a later wag so there will be more stuff hooked to that CTO. Do you have to worry about emissions or anything like that? If not, your vacuum system can be greatly simplified.

[shaolinsifu]

I don't have emmissions to worry about here,I yanked all that out and plugged the holes where both CTO's were,I was getting fuel in some of those vac lines,slow drip on the motor and some worked into the brake booster line(pulled it off one day and fuel dripped out) bypassed all of it... went from vac advance to carb (pass side front nipple) and set up the brake line like you have and pcv like you have...only issue really since removing canister-n-stuff was venting the gas tank...until I get around to that,I am just filling to half a tank...

[shiner2001]

I didn't realize you have a later wag so there will be more stuff hooked to that CTO. Do you have to worry about emissions or anything like that? If not, your vacuum system can be greatly simplified.

I don't have to pass a sniffer test since it's over 25 years old now. I would prefer to delete as much as possible of the the vacuum and emissions stuff...

[shiner2001]

Can you post some pics of how you're set up?

I don't have emmissions to worry about here,I yanked all that out and plugged the holes where both CTO's were,I was getting fuel in some of those vac lines,slow drip on the motor and some worked into the brake booster line(pulled it off one day and fuel dripped out) bypassed all of it... went from vac advance to carb (pass side front nipple) and set up the brake line like you have and pcv like you have...only issue really since removing canister-n-stuff was venting the gas tank...until I get around to that,I am just filling to half a tank...

[FSK1460]

"Here is a picture that shows the new hose running from the PCV to the front nipple on the carb. My question is, what happens to the old hose that ran from the stock carb to the canister on the passenger fender? In this picture that is designated as H1 to H2. If that is pulled from the canister and removed, does that port on the canister just get a plug? If so, what about the smaller tube that Y's off it on the H1 side of the blue filter(?) (which is not very evident in this photo, sorry)."




The vacuum hose lable "H1" is for the carb bowl vent which the Edelbrock 1406 doesn't use. On mine, I disconnected the other end of the hose and put a cap on it. The other port on the vapor filter (the one that looks like a fuel filter) ties into a hose that goes inline with the PVC and the other side of the filter stays conneced to the charcoal canister. Whether its absolutely neccessary I'm not sure, but I chose to leave it in place.




"Finally, everyone's favorite, a timing/distributor vacuum question. Similar to the last one, in theory. If I run a new vacuum hose from new carb directly to the distributor, replacing the old one that is still hooked up in this picture and labeled J1 to J2, do I plug the port left where J1 hooks up on the CTO that is threaded on the back of the thermostat housing?"






The red "J1" you have listed is the temp cto for changing the vac advance from ported to manifold. The middle connector goes to your vac advance on the distributor. The top port is ported or timed, and the bottom port is manifold vac. I believe factory setup, it switches over to manifold vac whenever the temp gets to 220 degrees.

Here a vac diagram from the IFSJA website that might help if you don't already have one. I believe this is for an 1984/85 model.

http://www.ifsja.org/tech/fuel/pictures/8cylvac.gif

[shiner2001]

The vacuum hose lable "H1" is for the carb bowl vent which the Edelbrock 1406 doesn't use. On mine, I disconnected the other end of the hose and put a cap on it. The other port on the vapor filter (the one that looks like a fuel filter) ties into a hose that goes inline with the PVC and the other side of the filter stays conneced to the charcoal canister. Whether its absolutely neccessary I'm not sure, but I chose to leave it in place.

When you say you put a cap on it, do you mean on the engine side of the vapor filter, after removing the larger hose (the labeled one in the picture), and left it in place so that the smaller hose still runs inline with the PCV? Which raises another question, the way that seems to be the accepted way to set up the PCV on the Edelbrock set up is to run straight from the PCV to the front port on the carb, with nothing T'ing into it. Therefore, can the vapor filter (the blue part that looks like the fuel filter) and the hose from it to the charcoal canister be completely removed and that port on the charcoal canister capped off?

I am also curious about the ramifications of completely removing both CTO's as shaolinsifu mentioned in the above post. Without having to pass emissions, in my opinion the simpler the better.

[FSK1460]

The hose you have labeled as "H1" goes from the carb bowl vent (no longer there with the 1406) to one of the two ports on the vapor separater (fuel filter looking device). I removed vac hose "H1" and put a cap on the vapor separater end (the side with two ports). The short hose labeled "H2" going from the charcoal canister to the vapor separater, I left in place. Again, I'm not certain whether it needs to still be there, but I don't see it causing any problems and left it in just to be safe.

If you decide to go ahead and remove the vapor separater, You'll want to cap off the port on the charcoal canister (marked bowl vent) and then cap the second hose from the vapor separater which tees into the line betwee the pcv and charcoal canister (port is marked "purge line"). Might make more sense looking at the vac diagram.

But I wouldn't disconnect the line from the pvc to the charcoal canister. That's what sucks up the vapors that vent out from the gas tank. Your garage will smell like gas fumes otherwise.

Also I think the pvc is metered to allow for vacuum coming from the charcoal canister. Not sure if its enough to make a difference or not. Perhaps some others can chime in.

[Chris P.]

To simply the entire system all you need is the PVC, brake booster, vacuum for the heater controls, and distributor advance vacuum. It looks like you already have the first three hooked up, so all you need to do is run a line from manifold vac to the distributor. The rest of the hoses can be removed.

I've never smelled any gas with the charcoal canister unhooked, but I remember others having that problem so YMMV.

[shiner2001]

T

But I wouldn't disconnect the line from the pvc to the charcoal canister. That's what sucks up the vapors that vent out from the gas tank. Your garage will smell like gas fumes otherwise.

Based on that, do I need to install a T into my new hose running directly from the new PCV (pictured earlier) to the front port on the carb, and have that T run to the smaller inlet on the backside of the vapor separator (and thusly through the vapor separator into the charcoal canister via H2)?? I don't recall having seen anyone do this on their 3731/1406 installs is the only reason I ask, this is the first I have heard of someone T'ing off of the PCV line. It is hooked up that way from the factory with the original setup, so I could see if it was the case that it needed to be done. It's also a Jeep, so "from the factory" is tossed out the window as often as it is not.