Time to Build - 1969 Wagoneer Arizona

**jaber** · 02-10-2010, 05:58 AM

Cool, this means I get to be the first subscriber to watch....

If you need a hand with anything, just holler, I'll find a way to come assist, and take notes...

**EnigmaticEngineer** · 02-10-2010, 07:38 AM

Thanks

Originally posted by jaber

Cool, this means I get to be the first subscriber to watch....

If you need a hand with anything, just holler, I'll find a way to come assist, and take notes...

I had planned on tearing the new axles down to install the spools, get the knuckles ready to machine, etc but they are still under the donor waggy and its Snowing at the moment at my house (well, sleeting...) and it doesn't look like its going to let me work outside.

But soon...Very soon

Thanks for the offer to help,
Nathan.

**jeeping1974** · 02-10-2010, 07:45 AM

Why a mini spool in the front and POR15 both axles? The POR15 won't hold up that well to being dragged over rocks. Maybe go with a roll in bedliner on teh axles as it is cheaper and easier to fix when it gets scratched.

**orangecherokee** · 02-10-2010, 08:02 AM

if you're focusing on axle housing paint, you've got your head in the wrong place. the weak link is those D44s. just shoot it with the Krylon touch. Glossy black seems to work best and stays on better than the flat. concentrate on how not to blow up the outers.

**EnigmaticEngineer** · 02-10-2010, 08:21 AM

Not a Rock Buggy...

This is a Trail Rig, not a rock buggy...and I am perfectly aware of the strength of Dana 44's. The Mini Spools are cheap traction until I can build a set of fullsize axles. (Already have a 14B rear with 4.11s', still trying to find a Passenger Side Drop D60 front)

As as far as POR15 goes, If I sprayed krylon over the surface rust, it wouldn't last a month. Roll on bedliner would do the same thing...I chose POR15 because I can clean the axle housings well and paint them and forget them...It is a bit more expensive than Krylon, but cheaper than having the housings sandblasted and then hitting them with Krylon/Duplicolor/etc. As far as rocks go, it is just as easy to touch up (as I have a Gallon of POR15). POR15 is much more durable than most anything in a spray can as well.

Always a bunch of Nay-Sayers to tell a man where he's messing up before he's even started

Nathan.

P.S. I purchased my 1969 Wagoneer for $700 and put another $100 in a waterpump and starter. I purchased the 1977 parts donor waggy for $100. I sold the 401 that was in it for $500 and have made over $100 selling misc parts. Still have the Trans/Transfercase up for sale. So as it stands, I have $300 bucks in my jeep and axles. (Not counting Mini Spools and other parts/pieces) I don't think I'm doing to badly considering I will have a completely painted/locked up/built Wagoneer for under $1000...

**orangecherokee** · 02-10-2010, 11:08 AM

Originally posted by EnigmaticEngineer

This is a Trail Rig, not a rock buggy...

Always a bunch of Nay-Sayers to tell a man where he's messing up before he's even started

Nathan.

So? BFD. You're in Arizona and if this is just a "trail rig" then you should have zero worries about scraping the paint off of your axles or rusting. I've never seen an axle tube rust through and I've owned plenty of beater axles.

#2 ...

Originally posted by EnigmaticEngineer

Questions/Comments/Insults/etc all welcome of course as that is what build threads are for.........

if you didn't want comments then maybe you shouldn't have posted this little string of words. I'm not trying to be an Great Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley Moogleyhole but if you'd like me to turn it up a bit I can. You're talking about paint. paint on an axle. does it have anything to do with the performance of the vehicle? no. if you want to make a show truck that can navigate trails just say that and we can move on. I figured you wanted comments/insults/etc on the actual performance of the vehicle.

**Tad** · 02-10-2010, 11:44 AM

Originally posted by EnigmaticEngineer

...Questions/Comments/Insults/etc all welcome of course as that is what build threads are for.........for me to brag a little and for you to tell me where I'm retarded

Does the wink mean you don't want those things?
If so, maybe this is better suited for Gen Tech.
If not, you sort of have to take what comes back, it goes with the territory.

I'll toss my two cents out on building a 63-73 rear post mount wag into a decent DD/Trail Rig.
You got a lot of plans, don't make the same mistake I did.
Dump the shorter front springs and move the front hangers to accommodate something longer now. The shorter front springs don't flex real well and if you break a main spring 300 miles from home your not going to find an easy replacement.

**Murphy** · 02-10-2010, 12:05 PM

Originally posted by EnigmaticEngineer

Questions/Comments/Insults/etc all welcome of course as that is what build threads are for.........for me to brag a little and for you to tell me where I'm retarded

Take it all with a grain of salt mate. And if you hit a hornet's nest with a baseball bat, duck and cover.

**EnigmaticEngineer** · 02-10-2010, 03:50 PM

Lol...its not about being a Show Truck

Originally posted by orangecherokee

So? BFD. You're in Arizona and if this is just a "trail rig" then you should have zero worries about scraping the paint off of your axles or rusting. I've never seen an axle tube rust through and I've owned plenty of beater axles.

#2 ...

if you didn't want comments then maybe you shouldn't have posted this little string of words. I'm not trying to be an Great Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley Moogleyhole but if you'd like me to turn it up a bit I can. You're talking about paint. paint on an axle. does it have anything to do with the performance of the vehicle? no. if you want to make a show truck that can navigate trails just say that and we can move on. I figured you wanted comments/insults/etc on the actual performance of the vehicle.

Well, to be honest, it Does seem like you are trying to be an A-hole, or a Know It All/You should do it 'My Way' type. I want to hit the axles with a coat of something so it has a clean look...Easier to see a leak, damage, etc if the surface is one consistant color. It certainly isn't about Looks alone, our FSJ's very rarely win beauty contests. It isn't because I fear the axle tube is going to rust through either. "but if you'd like me to turn it up a bit I can"!?! How old are you? You sound like the HS bully...'Want me to beat you up again?' lmao

I only mentioned the paint Once in my initial post...that I was going to paint the axles with POR15. You and another gentleman made comments to me about the paint, It was never a Focus...just something thats going to be done when I have the axles apart and cleaned....so No..my head is not in the wrong place.

If you are goint to Pick on someone because they want to paint something, you might want to find a Ricer Honda forum...you'll have a lot more fun with those people than me. You can't get under my skin by being Rude or Insulting regardless of how much you try. (when I said questions/comments/Insults....the Insults part was more of a friendly joke because after all, I thought we were all on the Same Team here...FSJ's...It was not a serious request for people to be Rude or tell me how to build my waggy.) I got my gallon can of of POR15 for 25 bucks...I'm such an IDIOT because I'm going to hit my axles with it, huh? You can hardly buy enough Krylon to hit the axles for that price.

BTW, why do they always paint diffs on new cars/trucks these days? Or frames...why are they painted? Hmmm...Protection? Clean Look? When people build a tube buggy why do they paint the chassis? Do you talk crap to people building full on buggies because they powercoat their diffs?

What you are doing is not Comments...Its just Rude and an attempt to be Insulting. I didn't expect attempts to be intentionally insulted by other lovers of FSJ's. I am not a child and this is by Far not my first build. You might have a ton of respect on this forum, I don't know..haven't been here very long...but I do know you sound like a child trying to insult someone over POR15 vs Rattle can.

Try to have a better day tomorrow so you don't feel the need to make useless and rude comments to another forum member, I've done nothing to you.
Nathan.

EDIT: If you got upset because I posted after you and Jeeping about the Why I chose the POR15 to paint the axles, axle strength and my Blatent Tease about Nay-Sayers, then I understand where the animosity is coming from.....but it isn't very mature. I wasn't being rude in any way and I do appologize if it came across that way.

The D44's Are temporary. And cost me virtually Nothing. Free axles, 108 Shipped for 2 mini spools, 4 balljoints (that I already had from a previous build that went a different direction) some rust preventative (say 5 bucks worth) and 30 bucks worth of seals. Oh...and 80 Shipped for the high steer arms/75 shipped for the 3/4 heims (which are Flat Too Big lol...didn't realize their size till I had them in hand) and 48 shipped for the stud kit for the high steer arms...Thats $346 bucks Total (unless I messed up my math) for fresh, ready to run, locked up Dana 44's. Some toyota guy/sammi guy/Wrangler guy would be glad to have them when I'm done with them for 6-700 so I double my money on the back end also. I don't (and won't) feel like an idiot for Painting them with a quality coating.

Lastly...The more I think about it, I have NO idea why you would be acting this way. I never said it is 'Just' a trail rig, just that that would be its main use. I don't find any shame in wanting something to look decent while performing above average. I sincerely appologize for what EVER I did to you that makes you feel the need to make attempts at insults towards me...I did think we were all on the same team here.

**EnigmaticEngineer** · 02-10-2010, 03:58 PM

Thanks.

Originally posted by Tad

Does the wink mean you don't want those things?
If so, maybe this is better suited for Gen Tech.
If not, you sort of have to take what comes back, it goes with the territory.

I'll toss my two cents out on building a 63-73 rear post mount wag into a decent DD/Trail Rig.
You got a lot of plans, don't make the same mistake I did.
Dump the shorter front springs and move the front hangers to accommodate something longer now. The shorter front springs don't flex real well and if you break a main spring 300 miles from home your not going to find an easy replacement.

I appreciate the Constructive Criticism. I happen to already have a set of 4in lift springs for the front (factory length) so I'll have to run those a for a bit until I find a suitable replacement set. The rears are going inboard (under the frame...hope I'm using that term correctly) and I found a set of 88 chevy truck rear springs that have an almost perfect arc height that I will slap under it as soon as I pick them up.

And about the

.... The wink applied to the Insults part which apparently some people didn't catch. I don't see any need for insults around here considering we all come here for a love of FSJ's. I am very open to Constructive criticism and welcome it when ever I get it (Like your spring advice for example)

And I am confident in my decision to use a paint designed to P.aint O.ver R.ust (POR15). If I put anything else over the rust (rattle can, bed liner, etc)I'm pretty sure it would Fall off before I rubbed it off on rocks. I wasn't trying to be a Jerk if some took it that way, just explained why I was going with the por15 over other coating options.

Thanks Tad...You have been helpful (both directly and from reading your other posts)
Nathan.

**EnigmaticEngineer** · 02-10-2010, 04:00 PM

Always

Originally posted by WaveHunter

Take it all with a grain of salt mate. And if you hit a hornet's nest with a baseball bat, duck and cover.

But I won't run and hide, I'll swing back at the buzzin bazterds.

And to be honest, I have NO IDEA how I hit a hornets by mentioning my intended use of POR15....you just never know with some people I guess.

Nathan.

**jeeping1974** · 02-10-2010, 04:42 PM

Originally posted by EnigmaticEngineer

Questions/Comments/Insults/etc all welcome of course as that is what build threads are for.........for me to brag a little and for you to tell me where I'm retarded

What did you expect when you post this in your thread? I got the same thing in my build thread. you just let it be water under the bridge.

I was only asking a simple question and stating that something along the lines of a brush/roll on bed liner would be cheaper. I didn't know that you already had a gallon of PO15. In that case, yeah, use it. I've used the Herculiner stuff on some of my axles and I never had an issue with it falling off.

As for the spool in the front, turning may be a bit difficult.

**EnigmaticEngineer** · 02-10-2010, 05:02 PM

Gotcha.

Originally posted by jeeping1974

What did you expect when you post this in your thread? I got the same thing in my build thread. you just let it be water under the bridge.

I was only asking a simple question and stating that something along the lines of a brush/roll on bed liner would be cheaper. I didn't know that you already had a gallon of PO15. In that case, yeah, use it. I've used the Herculiner stuff on some of my axles and I never had an issue with it falling off.

As for the spool in the front, turning may be a bit difficult.

I didn't feel like you were insulting, the previous messages are not directed towards you.

I think the POR15 is a good decision considering all the factors of the situation. I didn't think you were rude about the POR15 either...you asked why. The other gentleman made it seem like he thinks I'm being 'retarded' for using it. I have had bad luck in the past taking short cuts with paint (rattle can over Rust most of the time) I don't have much experience with the Roll On Bed Liner products, but I assumed that since it isn't Intended to be applied over rust, that it might not work as well as I'd like it to over a rusty surface.

I agree with turning and the mini spool in front....I plan on only locking in 1 hub in normal trail driving, then I can lock in the other if I need the extra climb....after all, an open diff only gives power to one axle and its the one with less traction...this way I can have complete pull with one tire and both if it becomes necessary. Not a typical thing to do, but it was a lot cheaper than a locker of any sort and plenty durable for my intended use. (By trails I don't mean Serious Rock Crawling trails...I mean the ones that are 4x4 only that run through the forest, going out camping, to the river, etc...I'll build a buggy one day for the significantly extreme stuff...I don't really want to tear up my waggy...its a 69 with less than 50k original miles and a virtually perfect body.)

It is water under the bridge, of course...I expected teasing, or advice/constructive criticism, just not blatent insults or rudeness. Opinions are always welcome, just no reason for some people to try to make themselves feel better by degrading others. I never made painting the axles a focus, the other poster, for some reason, did. I don't feel I made an a-$s of myself mentioning my intentions although others aparently did.

Thanks for posting on my thread, I do appreciate all opinions even if I don't agree, just not ones that are intentionally rude or blatenly insulting.

Nathan.

**gsmikie** · 02-10-2010, 08:46 PM

u r going to do the trans while its out .......