1963 J-200 SLOOOOOW Build

[63J200atLSU]

Ran all new hard lines from the master cylinder to all four wheels. Figured if I was going to go through the trouble, might as well get em all. Also, the old master cylinder was locked up in the fully depressed position. Probably need to soak it in diesel for about a month and use another master cylinder to push it open so I can see what's what. For the time being though, my truck has brakes and I'm thrilled.



I realize my drive shaft is still flipped around... Haha...

[toddthewelder]

Slow progress is still progress. Mine has come to a complete halt waiting on back surgery

[63J200atLSU]

Originally Posted by toddthewelder

Slow progress is still progress. Mine has come to a complete halt waiting on back surgery

Yeah, I hear ya. I was just excited to get a chance to work on it over spring break. But seeing as now I don't have to push it in the driveway and I can stop it from running into things, I'm pretty happy. Good luck with your back surgery man, back stuff is the worst!

Question. I can find a large amount of the headlight switches around. I really also need the plug from the harness. Mine is ten kinds of twisted up. Any thoughts?

[toddthewelder]

Originally Posted by 63J200atLSU

Yeah, I hear ya. I was just excited to get a chance to work on it over spring break. But seeing as now I don't have to push it in the driveway and I can stop it from running into things, I'm pretty happy. Good luck with your back surgery man, back stuff is the worst!

Question. I can find a large amount of the headlight switches around. I really also need the plug from the harness. Mine is ten kinds of twisted up. Any thoughts?

Thanks, it's no fun at all. Chances are if anyone has one it will be in the same sad shape the one you have is, you may be better off making a new one. Can you take a picture of what you have, I'm not even sure I know what the ones in the early J-trucks look like.

[63J200atLSU]

So today, I ran a compression test on the engine, what I got back was saddening and perhaps explains why the engine hasn't exactly been running like the sewing machine I know it can be... The cylinder results are as follows.
1 - 175
2 - 175
3 - 30
4 - 170
5 - <5
6 - 150

So I have exactly one cylinder in what would normally be considered the acceptable range. Poured a little marvel mystery oil in 3 and 5 to try and diagnose the issue further, ran the compression test again with identical results, so that would generally rule out rings I suppose. I also took a long wooden skewer and put it through the 3 and 5 spark plug holes and turned the engine over by hand to see if the piston was even moving i.e. check that the connecting rod wasn't broken... Both were moving... Took the exhaust manifold off, from the exhaust ports, I could see that the #3 exhaust valve was black black black.

So now my question is this: if all the valves are moving freely, what are the chances that there is so much carbon buildup on the exhaust valves where they seat that it could cause the cylinder to lose all compression? Anybody have any thoughts on where to go with this?

Also, anybody have a good link for a 230 head gasket? It seems to be a discussion of debate over at m715zone as to wether the civilian and military 230 head gaskets are interchangeable...

[joe]

Originally Posted by 63J200atLSU

Also, anybody have a good link for a 230 head gasket? It seems to be a discussion of debate over at m715zone as to wether the civilian and military 230 head gaskets are interchangeable...

No links but I would try Kanters via phone. They have 'some' stuff for the Kaiser 230's...some. Otherwise I'd net search for some of the major gasket manufacturers an "call them" Often they make gaskets for motor A but not for B. The orig manufacturers 'may' still be making them for the S.AM or OZ market but since minimal US demand don't list it in the vendor books supplied to the US auto parts houses. You could try sourcing Kaiser 230 stuff on Latin American sites. The 230ohc and it's variations were used/sold a lot longer down there, specifically Argentina than they were here? I have no idea on the differences regarding the Civi or Mil versions of the 230 other than the motor mounts.
On a side note: yeah you got serious comp issues in at least a couple cyls. Head gaskets generally blow in one spot 'maybe' affecting two side by side cyls, so I doubt it's a head gasket issue. Have you done a wet comp check after the dry comp check? I'm not buying a bad head gasket can cause multiple cyl low compression but I'm NOT a mechanic. Any water in the oil, oil in the coolant issues? If not I'd guess not a head gasket issue...rather just an old lack of previous maint motor. Common back in the day for the OHC 230's to be run low on oil and the top end gets oil starved, in turn wiping out the cam and cam bed. Keep researching, diagnosing. measuring before just "click here/add to cart" shotgun maint. Save your money for fixing what's really wrong.
Welcome to the world of running/diagnosing/fixing/parts chasing a motor that hasn't been built in near 50 years. It's a very basic simple old school motor but there ARE rules even(especially) when buying a cheap project vehicle. Keep banging away diagnosing before breaking out ands lapping down the plastic.

edit: PS, how many miles on the motor?

[63J200atLSU]

Not a whole lot to report here, but thought I'd post some pictures as I take clean up the 230. Pulled the head on Monday (that is one heavy son of a b...) and nothing is obviously broken, cracked, bent, sticking or otherwise damaged. Looks like a couple of te cylinders are running rich or maybe have some oil that's leaked in somehow. I'll post more pics in the next couple days. As always, your thoughts and suggestions are welcome!

[63J200atLSU]

So finally got most of the things knocked off of the ole honey-do list, back to work on the truck yesterday... It is indeed two bent valves, presumably from when the engine jumped time at some point in the past, as I believe it was one tooth off for a long time. Found a set of all 6 NOS intake valves for $40 shipped, planning on getting this done later this week.

Also, anyone have any experience with getting a really REALLY stuck thermostat housing unstuck? Seems like someone in this truck's life got their JB Weld and Permatex mixed up somewhere along the line. It is SOLID... My only thought is to use a razor blade/box cutter and just kinda work my way in there a little bit at a time... Would welcome your suggestions though!

[toddthewelder]

Heat it up with your torch then bump it with a hammer, should come off.
You may have to do it a few times

[63J200atLSU]

Just posting the progress, got the cylinder head all cleaned up, new valves and polished the seats, everything seems to check out. Currently waiting on an upper radiator hose. Apparently at some point the radiator had just water in it and rusted not only the thermostat but also the inner spring of said radiator hose. Twas ugly. Project of today was the headlights. Believe it or not, got this pair off of ebay. Apparently, they're for an RV, but that didn't bug me too much as I didn't even have to drill new holes and they came with bulbs and bezels for $39 shipped. If anyone is interested, I can find the seller on eBay and post a link.

Serehill is shipping me one of his harnesses to keep from melting all of my switches in the future and to get a brighter light from these guys. Cannot wait. Next up: floor pans. It's a good summer, friends.

[Wagoneer-ing]

This is my kind of build thread! That old motor is looking pretty good!

[63J200atLSU]

Thanks! Contrary to many (potentially valid) opinions, I've chosen to stick with the 230 for now. Figure I at least owe it my solid effort at rehabilitating it! Right now, I'm vexed trying to figure how to reinstall the oil line in the rear of the engine without pulling the head again. As an aside, I pulled the head without benefit of a hoist. Near killed me. Pretty sure that'll be my next investment.

I'm intending on building a wooden thriftside bed for it as soon as I get the rustouts addressed. I know this kind of bed isn't typical on 60's period trucks, much more common in the 50's and earlier trucks, but I think it would look fantastic and since this old guy had all but been left for dead, I feel like my obligation to the truck is to enjoy it fully. A few have tried to convince me to look for an original thriftside bed, but that's just not the point, I guess.

Doh well. First things first, I guess. Gotta get this engine purring and save the poor old body it's dragging around!

[63J200atLSU]

Not a whole lot to report, been working on cleaning up the frame and using some rust encapsulator after trying to get it down to bare metal. Eastwood frame paint being used all around with their extension hose for the boxed in portion of the frame.

Got the headlights, tail/parking lights, brake lights and blinkers all functioning correctly. Trailer tail light converters are really a god send. My rear harness is now test fitted and idiot proof for wiring purposes. Just waiting to get the frame finished before I re-install it.

Up next is body work. This is going to be my hell, I already know it. My plan, as of today, is to get it in the garage so I can take off the doors and front clip and then pull the windshield and rear window. It's got some pretty bad rust on the front brow driver's side corner. I know there is no "easy" fix for this, and really te easiest option would be a new cab. That being said, getting another cab to Louisiana is next to impossible. Would it be a bad idea to cut the roof so I can completely get out the rusted bits, get it all in good shape and then weld it back in place? Was planning on cutting/rewelding around the drip rails, seems like that would allow me easier access to do a more thorough repair and being behind the drop rails would also allow it to be a more concealed repair. Thoughts? Feels like I'm starting to see the light at the end of the tunnel to daily driver-ville!

[63J200atLSU]

Sorry for the lapse in posting to anybody actually following my build... short of it, I've been working to get all the electrical stuff in order, got headlights, tail lights, blinkers and brake lights all functioning properly.


Also stripped what I could of the frame and painted it. When I graduate and have a little more money to spend, I want to pull the cab off and do a professional restoration, but my goal right now is to make sure everything is safe (the frame is super solid, surprisingly) and looks passable so I can drive it around town.


So this weekend I started digging into the floors. My word. Nasty nasty nasty. If there were people around here selling complete cabs, it would totally be the better option to just replace it outright, but that's just not an option for me currently, so patching time. Worked on my mig skills on some pieces of scrap I had in the garage, now that I'm confident I can weld something structurally ok, I'm going to work on making my welds prettier by doing the floorboards. That way they'll be covered and my skills will (hopefully) be much improved by the time I get to patching things like the cab corners.

Today, I cut three layers of slapdash floor patches from the driver's side before finally getting down to the original floors. Sad thing is, if someone had done it right in the first place, or at least even tried to cut out the floor cancer in the first place, they wouldn't have ended in near as bad a shape... Ah well. New beginnings and fresh starts and what not...







Of an unrelated note, those of you of the praying/keeping stuff in your thoughts sort, do keep my city of Baton Rouge in your thoughts. My girlfriend lives about 2.5 miles from where the Alton Sterling shooting took place, and the whole city is in this weird tense kind of suspicious state. No matter most people's thoughts on what actually did or didn't occur last week, I don't think anybody wants to see more people hurt or killed, and it feels like the threat of rioting and violence within the city is very real and only being perpetuated by the way national media outlets are perpetuating stories by misrepresenting events and sentiments. That's all I'll say about it. Stay safe out there amigos.

Till next time...

[Randyre]

Subbed !

[63J200atLSU]

Welp... Summer school's over. Sad to say, but differential equations was the part of my mechanical engineering degree that helped me out in literally zero ways when it comes to bringin this old guy back to life. I've also been receiving a daily dose of shame and humility reading Kaiserjeeps' build thread, so it's about time these floors get done I think.

Also in the works for ten very near future are a speedo cable install (does anybody know where this is routed on the older trucks?) aaaaaaaaaaand

Took a little bit of a risk on an eBay auction that I found. Had been looking for a 2bbl setup for the tornado, the carbs and their parts are in plentiful supply, but the manifolds are very very scarce. Found an auction for three allegedly complete Holley 2300's but all three in need of some serious work BUT a 230 2bbl intake manifold was also included with them. So I'm also going to have that little rejuvenation project running in the background. I've heard it makes a huge difference with the 2300 instead of the single barrel 1920. At any rate, the carbs looked rough in the auction but I'm crossing my fingers. Nothing ventured, nothing gained, right?

More soon!

[Achilles]

If nothing else you get the much needed intake manifold. The carbs can be rebuilt. Looking forward to seeing more progress with yoir build.

[63J200atLSU]

Originally Posted by Achilles

If nothing else you get the much needed intake manifold. The carbs can be rebuilt. Looking forward to seeing more progress with yoir build.

That's exactly what I was thinking. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems the 2300 had a pretty wide range of applications and they're easy enough to find, but the scarcity of the tornado with the 2bbl setup makes those manifolds near impossible to find. My plan for now is to really clean up and rebuild all three carbs and sell the two I'm not using. Figure that should pretty much cover the cost of the auction price plus the three rebuild kits while still giving someone a good price on a rebuilt carb.

I too am looking forward to seeing some more progress on this truck... It's just been looking at me every day like, "Uhhhhhhhh, pretty sure you're not finished here."

[Achilles]

Originally Posted by 63J200atLSU

I too am looking forward to seeing some more progress on this truck... It's just been looking at me every day like, "Uhhhhhhhh, pretty sure you're not finished here."

LOL, I know the feeling!

[63J200atLSU]

Got about 80% of the floors done today, I've still got to make a template and cut out/weld in the piece all the way up under the pedals, was trying to knock out the larger sections first, although I think if I were to do it again, I'd to all the edges first so I could have nice square/straight pieces to put in last... Anyway, I'm whooped for the day. I'm pretty awful/slow at this welding business, but the floor seems way more sturdy than the crap I cut out. Really looking forward to getting this phase done, it's rapidly approaching being driveable.



Also, for anyone interested in just how ridiculous I am, and just so no one thinks I'm mistaking this for some speed demon, I did this today. Not sure if it'll stay, but I got quite a laugh out of it...

http://s1381.photobucket.com/user/gr...f92ya.mp4.html

More soon, hopefully.