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  #1  
Old 10-19-2019, 12:58 AM
Beach_Dude's Avatar
Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
327 Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 535
Factory Exhaust and heater riser question

Going to full factory restoration on the General, except for the ignition because I'll never go back to a prestolite setup...

Welded the pipes in, got the manifolds mounted, new gaskets, etc etc...

Installed the teamgrandwagoner heat rise with the gasketed surface to the manifold, the flare's side to the exhaust pipe, the riser weight toward the cabin and the weight to drop when hot...

However, when the engine heats up, it never opens. I even let the engine heat to above normal operating temperature, which it NEVER does at idle and even spit a little coolant because of the temp. Still needed a screw driver to prop it open, in which it snaps closed immediately after letting go.

I'm sure it opens when throttle is opened a little because I believe I can hear it, but the engine heats up well above normal and will probably overheat in traffic with current setup.

I believe the spring is just wound too tight on this unit... But doesn't the increase in heat cause the spring to expand increasing tension... Wouldn't that close the valve tighter?

The total weight to open the valve is well over five pounds... Feels closer to ten pounds pressure with the screw driver prying it open until it snaps back closed.

I've called tgw and they were supposed to get back to me, but no response.

Is anyone familiar with this unit?

Can I simply let the spring free from it's catch for one or a few rotations or until enough pressure to simply hold the unit closed with low pressure?

Is the mechanical setup of this unit even correct?

Did I do something incorrect?!?!
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
Modified header exhaust w/ported AIR Injection
Slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years

Last edited by Beach_Dude : 10-19-2019 at 03:13 AM.
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  #2  
Old 10-19-2019, 06:55 AM
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babywag babywag is offline
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Join Date: Jun 08, 2005
Location: Land of froot loops and cukcoo-nuts, CA
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Probably just aftermarket crap...
I have always just gutted them, never had a problem even in our super chilly socal winters.
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  #3  
Old 10-19-2019, 10:31 AM
joe joe is offline
 
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Location: PNWet, USA
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+1
Gut it and forget it or if ya gotta have the OEM look, just spot weld it to keep it open.
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  #4  
Old 10-19-2019, 09:01 PM
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Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
327 Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 535
There's a part of me that wants to be completely OE....
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
Modified header exhaust w/ported AIR Injection
Slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #5  
Old 10-21-2019, 04:52 PM
rang-a-stang's Avatar
rang-a-stang rang-a-stang is online now
360 AMC
 
Join Date: Oct 31, 2016
Location: Camarillo, CA
Posts: 2,860
I ran mine gutted, too. In fact, if you want my gutted one, I will mail it to you for the cost of shipping...
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79 Cherokee Chief, barely runs
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  #6  
Old 10-21-2019, 10:18 PM
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ZackN920 ZackN920 is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Nov 18, 2015
Location: Stephenson County, IL
Posts: 906
I know i'll be gutting mine when the Y-pipe finally rots out and needs replacement. (that wont be too long, I patched that y pipe few days ago and the rest don't look so good...) Mine's seized up. I'm hoping its stuck in the open position... Jeep runs ok...


Quote:
Can I simply let the spring free from it's catch for one or a few rotations or until enough pressure to simply hold the unit closed with low pressure?
If it's possible, then why not. I'd try it if you absolutely have to have it factory stock.
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1990 Grand Wagoneer-"The Crapwagon"
AMC 360, TF727, NP229, 3.31gears, 2" lift
Rancho 44044, Rusty's 2" AAL, TFI
...not too rusty anymore
Plenty of patina

The others
1926 Dodge Brothers Business Sedan 212 I4-CRANK START
1987 Lincoln Town Car Signature Series-5.0 AOD (WD)
1987 Dodge Dakota LE 3.9, A999, 3.90 gear (DD)
1994 GMC 'Burban 5.7, 4L60E, NP241, 3.42 gear (DD)
2001 Jeep Cherokee 4.0, AW4, NP231, 3.73 (limbo)
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  #7  
Old 10-22-2019, 08:40 AM
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DBX11 DBX11 is offline
232 I6
 
Join Date: May 18, 2009
Location: Northern Kentucky
Posts: 208
I have one that has never been used It seems to move fine with a small amount of pressure. My old one was stuck closed until I manually forced it to open. It ran better afterwards. Also never had overheating issues from it being stuck in the closed position.
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  #8  
Old 10-23-2019, 10:58 AM
Beach_Dude's Avatar
Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
327 Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 535
So, I released the spring one turn and it freed it up A LOT!

It still doesn't open up all the way when hot, but I'm going to release it one more time to make sure it opens and moves freely based on temperature.

I do have to say, having it heat up within the first mile of driving is NICE!!!!

I'll keep you guys posted.
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
Modified header exhaust w/ported AIR Injection
Slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #9  
Old 10-24-2019, 09:43 AM
twmattox twmattox is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Feb 24, 2003
Location: Indiana
Posts: 1,280
I had the exact same issue. The bi-metallic spring never released. I could loosen the spring; but, it never really worked. It was frustrating to spend good money on a part that never really functioned, and then to not be able to return it because it was "used". Never bought another item from them...
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'83 Scrambler (CJ-8) / 258 / T-5 / D-300 / DANA 30-AMC20 (3.31)
'88 Grand Wagoneer (SJ) / 360 / TF727 / NP229 / DANA 44 (2.73)
'05 Wrangler Unlimited (LJ) / 4.0L / NSG 370 / NV231 / DANA 30-44 (3.73)
'15 Wrangler Unlimited (JKU) / 3.6L / 42 RLE / NV 241 / DANA 30-44 (3.73)
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  #10  
Old 10-25-2019, 09:55 PM
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ZackN920 ZackN920 is offline
350 Buick
 
Join Date: Nov 18, 2015
Location: Stephenson County, IL
Posts: 906
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach_Dude
So, I released the spring one turn and it freed it up A LOT!

It still doesn't open up all the way when hot, but I'm going to release it one more time to make sure it opens and moves freely based on temperature.

I do have to say, having it heat up within the first mile of driving is NICE!!!!

I'll keep you guys posted.
Awesome!

So, what's the ambient temp around you with the Jeep heating up in only a mile? I know I would enjoy that kind of a warm up in the winter. All I got for warm up aid's are the little tubes on the carburetor body and the heat stove from the exhaust manifold to the bottom of the air cleaner. Those are more so just for runability, rather than warm up.
__________________
1990 Grand Wagoneer-"The Crapwagon"
AMC 360, TF727, NP229, 3.31gears, 2" lift
Rancho 44044, Rusty's 2" AAL, TFI
...not too rusty anymore
Plenty of patina

The others
1926 Dodge Brothers Business Sedan 212 I4-CRANK START
1987 Lincoln Town Car Signature Series-5.0 AOD (WD)
1987 Dodge Dakota LE 3.9, A999, 3.90 gear (DD)
1994 GMC 'Burban 5.7, 4L60E, NP241, 3.42 gear (DD)
2001 Jeep Cherokee 4.0, AW4, NP231, 3.73 (limbo)
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  #11  
Old 10-26-2019, 05:00 AM
fsj454 fsj454 is offline
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Join Date: Jan 02, 2015
Location: new bedford ma.
Posts: 466
weight

the iron weight goes to engine side . I think you have in backwards and it is not getting hot enough to open
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1982 cherokee nt. 454. nv4500 .205. dana 60 f+r. twin stick.hydroboost.hydrolic clutch.rock ram.traction bar.warn 12000 winch.4 wheel disc.flip kit.soa.high steer.cross over steer.4.56 detroit locker.35 spline rear alloy axles. 37s .1990 grand wagoneer aka trusty rusty
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  #12  
Old 10-26-2019, 11:48 PM
Beach_Dude's Avatar
Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
327 Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 535
Regardless of the side it's pointed to, wouldn't it still hit well above 200F which would be enough to trigger the riser to heat off, right?
__________________
1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
Modified header exhaust w/ported AIR Injection
Slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years

Last edited by Beach_Dude : 10-27-2019 at 01:06 AM.
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  #13  
Old 10-29-2019, 02:58 PM
Beach_Dude's Avatar
Beach_Dude Beach_Dude is offline
327 Rambler
 
Join Date: Mar 03, 2011
Location: Newport Beach
Posts: 535
Just got a quote from a local exhaust shop to redo the factory y pipe and re-use the cat and muffler, remake the tail end and add flanges to the muffler and cat.

$1200 with 409 stainless

$1600 with 309 stainless

Did I miss something because I shopped for material and it was only going to be a few hundred for 309 total and probably take a day and a half of my own labor?

Does anyone have a good reference for the Orange County area that can do a superb job?

I have a bender at the shop but would need to buy the proper 2.25 and 2.5 dies...

Would it be worth saving $500+ doing it myself?
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1977 Jeep Cherokee Chief
360 w/ MC 4350
Modified header exhaust w/ported AIR Injection
Slightly modified suspection
Original paint, garaged/non-op for over 15 years
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  #14  
Old 10-29-2019, 03:39 PM
rang-a-stang's Avatar
rang-a-stang rang-a-stang is online now
360 AMC
 
Join Date: Oct 31, 2016
Location: Camarillo, CA
Posts: 2,860
Quote:
Originally Posted by Beach_Dude
Just got a quote from a local exhaust shop to redo the factory y pipe and re-use the cat and muffler, remake the tail end and add flanges to the muffler and cat.

$1200 with 409 stainless

$1600 with 309 stainless

Did I miss something because I shopped for material and it was only going to be a few hundred for 309 total and probably take a day and a half of my own labor?

Does anyone have a good reference for the Orange County area that can do a superb job?

I have a bender at the shop but would need to buy the proper 2.25 and 2.5 dies...

Would it be worth saving $500+ doing it myself?
WHAT?!?!?!? THAT IS A RIIIIIPPPPPP!!!!!!

I paid a local shop here in Oxnard $300 to make me a 3" Y-pipe, then another $300 to make my cat/back (I supplied the muffler). I'm about a 90 minute drive from HB. I wouldn't call it a "superb" job but they did a really nice job. I have 2 exhaust configs (both shown in these pictures). I have the cat back only (when I am in my smog compliant configuration so manifolds, stock Y-pipe, and stock cat) and my headers and cat delete when I am not smog compliant. Hence the 2 different prices. I think you can find a shop in OC to do a better job for less $$ than what I paid.



[/quote]

Full Size Jeeper also paid WELL under $1000 for his entire exhaust including the muffler and he has dual tail pipes. Starting at post #776. Not that you can take it to the same shop as him (he is in Louisiana) but for an idea of what exhaust shops SHOULD charge.
http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showt...183237&page=20

I say buy the materials and make your own.
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11 Nissan Pathfinder Silver Edition 4x4
09 Mazdaspeed3 Grand Touring
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