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  #1  
Old 03-28-2011, 06:48 AM
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duncanstives duncanstives is offline
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Location: Zoe, KY
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Engine swap questions... Not exactly another 350

But pretty close... Only 1 off in fact.

Yesterday I picked up a Ford EFI 351W for my Waggy... 80K miles with harness, ecu, new set of shorty headers, exaust back to the cat flange (including o2 sensor) and new MSD fuel pump for $300... I thought it was an awesome price and justified the drive to Indiana to get it. That said the thing is HUGE... Maybe its just because it has all the stuff on it and wires sticking off ect but I remember the 360 I picked up looking a lot smaller... I am slighty worried about it fitting under the hood.
This is going to be essentially a big 4 seat FSJ based buggy when its done but I would like to keep the stock hood and firewall plus I would like to keep my hydroboost (though I might have to fab up some crazy linkage to make it work with the huge engine). Basically my questions are these:
Anyone every done a 351 swap? Any issues? Anything I should know to make it easier?
The PS pump is missing on mine... I figured this was OK because I heard it sucked. Any idea what I might replace it with since I am running Hydroboost and will have hydro assist? Any options for dual pumps?

BTW the rest of the drivetrain will be np205, np434 (wide ratio), D60 front with detroit and 14 bolt welded. Ratio will be 3.73 or 4.10 (havnt decided yet) and tires will be 37in HMMWV tires on recentered double beadlock HMMWV rims.

Thanks.
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Resting in peace... Um... In piece... Er... IN PIECES

Current Status: Under construction. Phase 2.

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  #2  
Old 03-28-2011, 06:52 AM
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710 Burner 710 Burner is offline
 
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Cool. Its probably just how it looks. An SBF should be about the same rough dimensions as AMC.
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  #3  
Old 03-28-2011, 07:28 AM
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csuengr csuengr is offline
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When you take the intake and front accessories off, what remains is slightly smaller than an AMC V8. The truck intakes are TALL. The F-series engine bays are huge compared to a FSJ. Width isn't an issue as SBF are narrower than an AMC. The worst part is that the SBF water pump is lower than an AMC so the fan won't line up with the radiator shroud. If the intake is too tall, BC Broncos has an adapter to put a car upper intake on the truck lower.
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  #4  
Old 03-28-2011, 08:11 AM
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duncanstives duncanstives is offline
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Thanks. Thats exactly what I am worried about: The intake is super tall. Not worried about the fan shroud because the rad is going in the back trophy truck style with electric fans. Maybe I am a bad driver but I have damaged 2 radiators when things that were not supposed to go past the grill WENT past the grill ... So in the interest of solving the real world problems I run into while wheeling... Into the back it goes! (plus I think expanded metal will go over the grill just to be extra safe)... Might even leave the mechanical fan on just to keep the the engine bay nice and cool on hot summer days.
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88 Waggy
Resting in peace... Um... In piece... Er... IN PIECES

Current Status: Under construction. Phase 2.

86 Pathfinder Conversions "K-Van"

Current Status: Broke

Volkswagen rail buggy

Current status: Broke

95 Jeep ZJ V8

Current status: DDing
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  #5  
Old 03-28-2011, 10:12 AM
chrism chrism is offline
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Join Date: Apr 07, 2002
Location: Derby, NY
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Get the PS brackets off of a 351W powered ford van of the same vintage as your engine. They used the standard saginaw style pump. BCBroncos sells an adapter plate that will let you use the shorter 5.0 car intake upper on a truck lower. Its not going to flow as well as the aftermarket stuff but its way cheaper.
I have never put one in a FSJ but I have done SBF swaps into other jeeps. Feel free to ask questions. Its been a while but I should be able to help.
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  #6  
Old 03-28-2011, 10:59 AM
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duncanstives duncanstives is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrism
Get the PS brackets off of a 351W powered ford van of the same vintage as your engine. They used the standard saginaw style pump. BCBroncos sells an adapter plate that will let you use the shorter 5.0 car intake upper on a truck lower. Its not going to flow as well as the aftermarket stuff but its way cheaper.
I have never put one in a FSJ but I have done SBF swaps into other jeeps. Feel free to ask questions. Its been a while but I should be able to help.

Thanks... I will wait until I get the thing mocked up in the bay to see if I can make it fit for the intake thing... My plan is to make an engine cradle like some cars have that the engine mounts to and then the cradle goes into the vehicle fitting right between the frame rails... This gives me an extra crossmember up there, makes it easier to install and remove the engine and protects the oil pan in the event that something should come up there (leaf sping breaks and the housing comes up there or a rock, log, etc somehow comes flying up).
As for the steering pump: Yeah I heard that was the way to go but will even a regular pump be good enough for hydro boost AND hydro assist? I had heard an FSJ pump was barely enough but it was ok but I am not sure about this one.
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88 Waggy
Resting in peace... Um... In piece... Er... IN PIECES

Current Status: Under construction. Phase 2.

86 Pathfinder Conversions "K-Van"

Current Status: Broke

Volkswagen rail buggy

Current status: Broke

95 Jeep ZJ V8

Current status: DDing
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  #7  
Old 03-28-2011, 11:02 AM
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will e will e is offline
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Make sure the radiator is good and protected in the back. You don't need a rollover busting it open and sending HOT HOT fluid over everyone.
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  #8  
Old 03-28-2011, 11:06 AM
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duncanstives duncanstives is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by will e
Make sure the radiator is good and protected in the back. You don't need a rollover busting it open and sending HOT HOT fluid over everyone.

Yep... It will be well below the roofline of the cage and also covered in expanded metal. Especially since it will be just behind the back seats angled from the floor of the "bed" up at about a 45 degree angle... The most likely failure mode were it unprotected would not be a rollever but rather me tossing some cargo back there and it hitting and/or getting stuck in the fan blades.
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88 Waggy
Resting in peace... Um... In piece... Er... IN PIECES

Current Status: Under construction. Phase 2.

86 Pathfinder Conversions "K-Van"

Current Status: Broke

Volkswagen rail buggy

Current status: Broke

95 Jeep ZJ V8

Current status: DDing
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  #9  
Old 03-28-2011, 12:29 PM
ajbirken ajbirken is offline
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Join Date: Apr 04, 2007
Location: Raleigh, NC
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on google search site:ifsja.org gbarrett ford swap

this will pick up old archived posts from old servers

I think that he did it like 10 years ago and said it was pretty easy.
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  #10  
Old 03-28-2011, 01:09 PM
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duncanstives duncanstives is offline
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Thanks. Heres the thread if anyone is interested. Nice to know I am not on completely new ground... Although according to his profile that guy has not signed in since 12-31-1969 at 7am.... LOL
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88 Waggy
Resting in peace... Um... In piece... Er... IN PIECES

Current Status: Under construction. Phase 2.

86 Pathfinder Conversions "K-Van"

Current Status: Broke

Volkswagen rail buggy

Current status: Broke

95 Jeep ZJ V8

Current status: DDing
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  #11  
Old 03-28-2011, 02:15 PM
ajbirken ajbirken is offline
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Location: Raleigh, NC
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FWIW

I think that he moved to CO and got a new screen name and was on relatively recently. He seemed like a pretty nice guy so he might still respond to e-mails etc.

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/member.php?u=24554
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  #12  
Old 03-28-2011, 05:48 PM
chrism chrism is offline
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Location: Derby, NY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duncanstives
As for the steering pump: Yeah I heard that was the way to go but will even a regular pump be good enough for hydro boost AND hydro assist? I had heard an FSJ pump was barely enough but it was ok but I am not sure about this one.
Not sure on which pump you should use but the van bracket gets you the GM style pump mount. Then use a PS pump from a gm vehicle with hydroboost.
In my CJ I use a pump from an astrovan that had hydroboost and power steering. It gives you a smaller body to clear the steering shaft and uses a remote reservoir. I modified the valve in it to put out more pressure since I will probably be adding a ram assist somewhere down the road.

Edit: How funny a post from me in that thread from 2003. I was going to put that 351 into my 82 cherokee....unfortunately she is long gone now. Engine is still sitting on a stand in my garage.
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Last edited by chrism : 03-28-2011 at 05:54 PM.
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  #13  
Old 03-28-2011, 06:59 PM
duncanstives's Avatar
duncanstives duncanstives is offline
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Join Date: Mar 27, 2008
Location: Zoe, KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrism
Not sure on which pump you should use but the van bracket gets you the GM style pump mount. Then use a PS pump from a gm vehicle with hydroboost.
In my CJ I use a pump from an astrovan that had hydroboost and power steering. It gives you a smaller body to clear the steering shaft and uses a remote reservoir. I modified the valve in it to put out more pressure since I will probably be adding a ram assist somewhere down the road.

Edit: How funny a post from me in that thread from 2003. I was going to put that 351 into my 82 cherokee....unfortunately she is long gone now. Engine is still sitting on a stand in my garage.

Still sitting on a stand you say? Hmm... You should swap it into the waggy really quick and let me know how it goes... Lol

Thanks for the info I had read about pumps with remote reservors and modifying the valve but I had forgotten about it... I will dig it up again.
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88 Waggy
Resting in peace... Um... In piece... Er... IN PIECES

Current Status: Under construction. Phase 2.

86 Pathfinder Conversions "K-Van"

Current Status: Broke

Volkswagen rail buggy

Current status: Broke

95 Jeep ZJ V8

Current status: DDing
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  #14  
Old 03-30-2011, 07:42 AM
chrism chrism is offline
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Here you go:
http://westtexasoffroad.homestead.co...rsteering.html
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