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  #41  
Old 11-20-2008, 09:23 AM
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the goodies should be here tonight. exhaust manifold, lift pump and oil lines for the turbo. these are the big ones i have been waiting for. i get these installed then i can check clearances and rock and roll with the welder to finalize the mounts ect.

Thought about it last night if i really have problems with clearance at the heater box i can probably go get an early all metal heater box and change some dimensions to clear the turbo.
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

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  #42  
Old 11-21-2008, 01:09 AM
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ok got home tonight LATE got a little more done


i hate this 1 hour at a time crap hopefully next week goes better.

got LOTs of goodies when i came home. had an alternator, voltage regulator, exhaust manifold, pison lift pump conversion kit.


did some bugger welding to the waste gate to keep it closed. mounted the turbo. mounted the alternator, installed the piston pump, fabbed the down pipe for off the back of the turbo and checked for clearance on a new battery location. all went well measurements were tight but planning paid off BIG time. went bigger on this conversion than i ever thought i would. previous conversions we just installed the motor with a cross over pipe and ran it but this one with AC, after cooler, HY turbo and flipped manifold as well as dodge bellhousing and hydraulic clutch is a far cry from a 105hp 4bt with cross over pipe and a t-19 behind it.



pretty stoked. motor is coming out tomorrow night to get final touches. holes plugged oil lines finished up. details tended to leaving only radiator lines and PS lines to be hooked up when i put her back in.

I really want to put the south bend 6 spd flywheel (read heavier) with the sealled pilot bearing but money is tight, i'll have to wait for another day and $300 to upgrade that part of this conversion. i am dreading the hydraulic clutch setup of all things i fear it will bite me in the *** too short a throw or some pain in my butt will come back to haunt me.

pictures included and hey im no professional with a camera. i'm just joe six pack trying to pretend to be a journalist


Any additional measurements you want you had better ask now. because later it might be a serious PITA to get them.

The flipped dodge manifold is the way to go in a FSJ. the clearance is tight but it does clear the heater box.

Hey BTW where is MCinfantry i'm due for some harassment from you..... i'm only shooting for 180 hp despite our debate about 200+ - 300 hp applications of the 4bt. i am conceeding you are right i am not willing to spend the money nor risk detonating my moro in the name of most possible tire smoke where ever my hp falls is where it will stay im just not interested in exceeding 205 hp which would probably yeild (475 ft/lbs) nor do i want to get over 520 ft/lbs because that would be knocking ont he door of 230 hp which i think would be a hard number to reach based on previous experience with these motors and the VE pump.......... if i even make it that far.

like i said 180/ 420 and i'll be happy









Yes the 3" 90* down pipe clears i had to cut it so the 90* turn stars right at the flange and i plan to wrap the pipe other than that is see no issues with clearance the wires are all going to be clipped backin to their holders when i finish




these are pretty shaky but i always hated trying to do a conversion without being able to visualize more angles of what others had done.







i only hope at the end of my pictoral that this thread helps others do the same. i cant provide all the answers as i like to improvise as i go but as much info as i can provide i will openly offer to you.
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

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"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."

Last edited by dusty : 12-03-2008 at 03:40 PM.
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  #43  
Old 11-21-2008, 09:03 AM
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Hows the clearance between the oil pan and the front axle?
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  #44  
Old 11-21-2008, 09:27 AM
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about 2-1/2" straight up to the pan from the pinion webbing, i'll measure tonight. and the drain plug sits straight up from the pinion webing of the cast dana 44 pumpkin so it just overhangs that webbing by maybe 1/2"-1" when sitting idle . fortunately our axles swing forward when the suspension compresses. so when that happens the front of the oil pan and hte drain plug clear the pinion webbing by about 1" at full compression. close for sure. but i think i am safe. i could still lift the motor another 1/2-3/4" but man i dont feel like redoing the mounts so im thinking things are going to stay this way. if i really need a little extra some 1" shackles or maybe some 6" lift springs for the front and leave the 4" springs in the rear.


right now with the BJ's springs and the 4" lift in front from the top of the 33x12.50 on 8" x15" rim tire to the bottom of the WT flare is 5.25" in the rear it is 7.5" Could do a 6" spring in front probably end up at 7" between tire and flare and do a add a leaf int he rear and be at 8" in the rear but the jury is out right now on suspension mods. gotta ge the mechanical details of the installation done first AC, coolant, exhaust, intake, PS clutch assembly
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

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GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."
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  #45  
Old 11-21-2008, 10:52 AM
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Eugene 1 Eugene 1 is offline
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This is awesome are you going to post video ? when its running ?
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  #46  
Old 11-21-2008, 11:02 AM
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dusty dusty is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eugene 1
This is awesome are you going to post video ? when its running ?

that would require me to become technologically savvy. i just figured out how to post pictures and download things......

i might but im thinking we all will be safer if i jsut stick to wrenches
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

AMC 401 supporter

GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."
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  #47  
Old 11-21-2008, 11:03 AM
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Eugene 1 Eugene 1 is offline
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Ha !
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1979 Cherokee Dodge CTD with running Gear Build thread
http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=133468
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  #48  
Old 11-23-2008, 11:31 PM
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little irked with my self today. couldnt get around to packing the mounts over to a freinds house to get them welded. i have no 220 hookups so i packed em into my oven turned it upto 550 degrees and preheated the metal then hit it with the 110 hopefully i got enough penetration. witht eh 110 on .035 wire 3 wire speed and cranked to the max to weld the 1/4" plate. if not i can always make new mounts i'll keep my eyes on em to see if there are any cracks that develop over time.

anyways, welded the mounts and re installed the motor in the process smacked the heater box gotta love fiber glass. looks like i'll be shopping for an old all metal heater box.. probably a good thing because unfortunately the darned motor settled and shifted to the passenger side a 1/2" of which i can probably take 1/4" of that out ........ i moved the mounts up 1/2" and in doing so it shifted things closer to the heater box.

oh well im pretty happy with the clearances all around..


FYI oil pan drain plu to pinion webbing 1-1/2- 1-3/4" clearance verticle from the top of the webbing..


Anyways motor is mounted securely now and i dont plan on another removal unless something catostrophic happens


pictures


one final look around



alot bigger than an AMC luk clutch





note the "custom" exhaust plate. these turbos use v bands to clamp the exhasut on. conveniently i had a old t-14 bearing spacer from the old AA chevy to t-14 adapter kits. it just happens to be 4" in diameter with the perfect lip to seat up on the back of the turbo and for the v band to clamp onto. now i can just weld 3" pipe to the back of it and go.




what the hell was i thinking trying to do this at 9 pm by myself on a sunday night .....




Sewer pipe is cheap

im looking for the 2-1/2" pressurized intercooler tube to travel over the top of the 3" fresh air intake. it'll be tight but should give me a better air intake angle pointing back towards the heater box where i will be putting the air filter






hooked up fuel lines, power steering lines filled the engine with fluids so now it comes down to waitng for the radiator and doing some wiring.


I am running flared power steering connections so i took the stock oring ps pump piece out and inserted the flared one back into the 4bt pump. done deal. reused all my existing ps lines
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

AMC 401 supporter

GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."

Last edited by dusty : 11-24-2008 at 03:32 PM.
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  #49  
Old 11-24-2008, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DieselSJ
Nothing sacreligious about what you are doing. You are just doing something that the factory should have done!
Preach it Brother!!
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...but if it works, I wouldn't touch it.
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Originally Posted by Lindel
Best laid plans, yada yada yada...
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  #50  
Old 11-28-2008, 01:19 AM
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using 2-1/2" tubing with stock dodge boots

little tight

heres some pictures








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The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

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"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."
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  #51  
Old 11-30-2008, 12:15 AM
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no pictures today. doing a bunch of hose routing, rewiring and then oh yeah. the **** oil pan had a couple of small cracks or pin holes in it so after i filled it up with oil last night. thismorning i round 1.5 gallons of 15-40 on my garage. so i had to weld that up today also.

re routed battery cable to starter finished about 90% of the wiring under hood. messed with the brass fittings on the fuel return line what a PITA and sourced the fuel filter.

figuring next week will be spent messing with fuel tank and fuel lines. i hope to do the 42 gallon suburban tank but there also is a 30 gallon yukon tank that looks like a good contendet little narrower little shorter but also 1/2" deeper than the suburban tank. a mid 70's ford 38 gallon tank looks like a good choice also due to the fill neck and the vent location but the fuel pickup is no longer available and it is a goofy side mount so that could be a problem


hope to reseal all the cowl seems that i can and to do the roof plugs to get this son of a gun to quit leaking.

havent got to the hydraulic clutch yet but i did cut up the jeep radiator and figure out basically what i am going to need to do


rough wiring, no coolant or radiator yet fuel hoses into a 1 gallon jug and we have SMOKE


ALIVE.... ITS ALIVE hack hack cough hack ITS ALIVE "Ladies and gentlemen may I present for your intellectual and philosophical pleasure … the creature. "




Ok now i need to finish up all the other crap. mainly finding an intake grid heater and fabbing the intake tubing but she fired up naturally aspired.

HA 23 days start to smoke. by the end of december it will either drive out of the garage under its own power OR i'll be seved papers and still battling with it. not seriously but i have to hand it to my wife she is amazingly patient.
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

AMC 401 supporter

GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."

Last edited by dusty : 12-03-2008 at 09:42 AM.
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  #52  
Old 12-03-2008, 09:51 AM
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finally got the headlights in and all the wiring back into the



wiring is cleaned up loomed and routed for all bu the heater



heater hoses routed



still need 1 final PS hose made fromt he HB sown to the ps box. the old line thats in there was a total butty fab from day 1

and a picture of Dave's gremlin for all the gremlins i am about to start finding


any picture or measurement requests
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

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GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."
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  #53  
Old 12-03-2008, 12:02 PM
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JeepinPete JeepinPete is offline
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What are your plans for the air intake? With the way the plastic pipe is looping back, it looks like you are setting up for a snorkel.
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  #54  
Old 12-03-2008, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JeepinPete
What are your plans for the air intake? With the way the plastic pipe is looping back, it looks like you are setting up for a snorkel.


using the sewer pipe as mock up, it is 4" OD so i could check clearance under the 2-1/2" pressurized tube going over it. i plan on getting some 4" ducting compressing it some and then routing it in that spot.


i am planning to put the air filter up on the fender right in front of the heater core and blower motor


like i noted backa page or tewo the objective is to get an efficient running and responsive (fairly clean at the tail pipe) 180-185hp / 425-430 ft/lbs if i can get it to 200/460 or 205/475 that would be better than expected
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

AMC 401 supporter

GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."

Last edited by dusty : 12-03-2008 at 03:44 PM.
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  #55  
Old 12-03-2008, 02:59 PM
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It is coming together real nice. I'm looking forward to seeing how it does for you.
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  #56  
Old 12-03-2008, 05:48 PM
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i am going to miss the 401 and the "what for" that you could pull on people when you opened up the 4bbls but not the sucking sound. or the constant gas stops
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The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

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"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."
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  #57  
Old 12-03-2008, 05:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dusty
i am going to miss the 401 and the "what for" that you could pull on people when you opened up the 4bbls but not the sucking sound. or the constant gas stops

I think you'll be surprised with the power a 4BT is capable of. My bone stock one is rather peppy and it's at the bottom of the power curve.
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  #58  
Old 12-04-2008, 12:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mikel
I think you'll be surprised with the power a 4BT is capable of. My bone stock one is rather peppy and it's at the bottom of the power curve.

i have been thuroughly impressed with several stock 4bts that i have help install for buddies. and even a couple that they have turned up but i have never cranked on to where i have always felt the point is for balanced power, performance and operation.these little motors in stock form are super impressive but i am hoping to push the power curve outward and upward.

I just recently got my 03 dodge dialed to the point where if i roll into the throttle unless i load it up it burns clean and snaps to 40 psi with a big turbo. and it tows like a dream but then again upwards of 891 ft/lbs adn 437 hp tends to be right on the money but pulling a 8% grade for 7 miles at 60-65 mph with 16k in tow and egts not spiking is what i wanted. i can blacken an intersection if i lug it down and load it up but otherwise mild throttle control and it ramps up very nicely. my old twin turbo'd 12v ran like this 03 adn im hoping to get the 4bt somewhere in between with responsiveness which shouldnt be hard since it was snappy out of the box and big hp numbers 180hp is a 50% increase over stock without over burdening the ability of the package to support and cool it efficiently while towing. via the larger intercooler and turbo i hope to have very well balanced hp/torque numbers without the dull haze and or excessive black smoke and with controllable egts when towing. cake and ice cream too i know but i like pushing the envelope while getting the desired result is what i am after while all keeping the budget in somewhat of a reasonable range.

right now motor was 1800
added parts have amassed about 1281
i still need radiator fuel tank hydraulic clutch and throttle cable as well as misc crap so i am figuring another $1k in all that

radiator looking for a 3" thick cross flow radiator with 1-3/4 upper inlet on driver side and 2-1/4 or 2" on passenger side down low total dimensions measuring 19" high by 27" wide there is some plus and minus factor there i could go as big as 21"x28 " but things would be tight and the cooling would be unnecessary

would i have been better off selling the chief an buying a a 89-93 dodge with everything already to go. Yep better axles, better frame better horse power, more availability and less botty fab. BUT no satisfaction................ no class no style


now about that leaky cowl .... who's the bone head at kaiser and then amc who designed these darned body seals that leak so well
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

AMC 401 supporter

GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."

Last edited by dusty : 12-04-2008 at 12:23 AM.
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  #59  
Old 12-05-2008, 11:19 AM
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here is where my leak was and it was under all the body seam filler that was smeared around in there


thinking i can re weld the seem and the hole and then fromt he top use some henrys 208 since the cowl never gets overly hot or i'll just source some new seem filler. what ever i do thought he fender is coming off to get a full view of what i am up against





lower radiator hose location relative to the stock radiator with mounts cut and re welded



upper hose location


oil pan clearnance notice the sway bar is un hooked and laying down. i will probably put 2" or so spacers between the frame and sway bar to keep it and make things work


crappy pciture turn your head at an angle maybe you can make sense of it but it shows you the distance oil pan/ drain plug etc to teh webbing on the dana 44 plenty of room but still tight



doesnt show it well but the suspension fully compressed 4" and the pan jsut clears the webbing by 1/2" so there should be no contact issed what so ever
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Cherokee S Chief Widetrack W/ Cummins 4bta Diesel, 91 dodge intercooler, hy35/9, AC NV4500/D300 3.54's Ploks 4" BJ's w/ 33's, scout 33 gal fuel tank ( Sold, to a good fsj home)
The 608.9 hybrid dana 44 build

AMC 401 supporter

GO UM Montana Griz

"Dont worry the Coors light engineering department will be documenting this accordingly."

Last edited by dusty : 12-05-2008 at 11:22 AM.
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  #60  
Old 12-05-2008, 12:32 PM
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JeepinPete JeepinPete is offline
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I get wet passenger floors every time it rains. Makes me wonder if mine isn't leaking in the same spot. I don't know if you've done anything with the floor, but the corner where the floor ramp up also has a mound of seam sealer. That was the only spot of rust on the floors on my Cherokee.
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