3spd to 700R4 swap?

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  • Casey
    • Oct 08, 2003
    • 6151

    #16
    Originally posted by Jacksons Hole
    I'm starting to like the AW4 idea....




    Thanks for the link. I'll check to make sure, but it looks like I have a D-20.
    To keep my passenger side output on my '74 Cherokee project I'm using a CJ D300 behind my AW-4..none of it in yet..just piles of junk right now. The CJ D300 bolts right up and a CJ twin stick from almost any, but definately Currie Ent works very well.

    '93 XJ engine, transmission and fuel tank all going in the '74. I'm a little stumped with the shifter right now 'cause the '74 was an auto. I'd like to keep the column shift, but the XJ floor console may just work with some improvements.

    I plan to adapt the GM 4spd column to my Chief in the next two weeks. It will shift the 700R4. Looks good for bolting right up..maybe have a clocking issue with the linkage...I'll know more soon.
    1994 YJ
    1986 Comanche
    '57 FC-150

    Carolina Full Size Jeep Club
    www.cfsjc.com


    www.patriotguard.org

    Originally posted by Jeepstress
    "Go forth and be a tool".
    Originally posted by 78 Wagoneer
    This year for ECI I got a Jeep. Pretty important upgrade.

    Comment

    • Jacksons Hole
      232 I6
      • Apr 02, 2010
      • 198

      #17
      Originally posted by Billygoat
      With a 700r4 can you make the stock column shifter work?

      I don't care if I lose the ability to put it is 1, I don't have room for the floor shifter, and to be blunt am to cheap to want to buy 1.
      Maybe?

      Originally posted by Wagoneerlover
      5). I don't know of anyone nearby who has done the 700r4 swap so I wouldnt be able to help you here. (Although I could tell you what I did on mine) but from what research I have done on the 700r4 I would think that it could be done either way. (Your shift points on the column just wouldn't mesh up etc as I think the 700r4 has D, 3, 2, 1 and our rigs have D, 2, 1 (Park, nuetral and reverse ommitted) I could be wrong on that though.
      Cheers!
      1971 J2000 Gladiator - "Bertha"
      AMC 360 - 2bbl Motorcraft Carb - T-15A 3spd - D20 T-Case - 11" Clutch - D44 front and rear - 4.09 axle ratio
      ** Status - Scrapped **
      1990 Grand Wagoneer
      ** New - Just learning about her **

      Comment

      • Jacksons Hole
        232 I6
        • Apr 02, 2010
        • 198

        #18
        Originally posted by Casey

        I'd like to keep the column shift, but the XJ floor console may just work with some improvements.
        Mount it in the dash and let me know how it works!
        1971 J2000 Gladiator - "Bertha"
        AMC 360 - 2bbl Motorcraft Carb - T-15A 3spd - D20 T-Case - 11" Clutch - D44 front and rear - 4.09 axle ratio
        ** Status - Scrapped **
        1990 Grand Wagoneer
        ** New - Just learning about her **

        Comment

        • getlost4x4
          258 I6
          • Jan 23, 2010
          • 394

          #19
          is it possible to use the adapter from a 71 th400 to bolt up a 4 speed auto from a chevy?

          i just found a stock adapter and was hoping i could use the adapter to install a 4 speed auto.
          www.getlost4x4.com

          78' Jeep Wagoneer (Tank), Built 360, 330 Miles, QT
          360 V8 (fresh rebuild), Summit Racing 8600 cam, GM TBI Conversion (in progress), 31" tires no lift, 2.5" exhaust system,dual batteries, T-Max 9000 lbs winch, many plans empty pockets

          Comment

          • reece146
            232 I6
            • Feb 23, 2007
            • 137

            #20
            I've seen Lokar floor shifters for the 700R4 and TH350 modified for use with an AW4. Well, I've seen articles online anyway. I'm planning on going this route when I put a AW4 into my YJ.

            I understand the desire to retain the column shifter but as a general rule I can't stand column shifters. That's just me.

            Comment

            • reece146
              232 I6
              • Feb 23, 2007
              • 137

              #21
              Originally posted by getlost4x4
              is it possible to use the adapter from a 71 th400 to bolt up a 4 speed auto from a chevy?

              i just found a stock adapter and was hoping i could use the adapter to install a 4 speed auto.
              IIRC the patterns are completely different. I think the spline counts may be off too (27 vs 32?).

              I've completely dumped all Chev knowledge out of my brain pan since getting rid of the last of the Chev stuff I have. I may have the information muddled.

              Comment

              • Casey
                • Oct 08, 2003
                • 6151

                #22
                Originally posted by getlost4x4
                is it possible to use the adapter from a 71 th400 to bolt up a 4 speed auto from a chevy?

                i just found a stock adapter and was hoping i could use the adapter to install a 4 speed auto.
                Engine to trans adapter should be the same bolt pattern.
                1994 YJ
                1986 Comanche
                '57 FC-150

                Carolina Full Size Jeep Club
                www.cfsjc.com


                www.patriotguard.org

                Originally posted by Jeepstress
                "Go forth and be a tool".
                Originally posted by 78 Wagoneer
                This year for ECI I got a Jeep. Pretty important upgrade.

                Comment

                • Hankrod
                  Banned
                  • Jun 22, 2005
                  • 272

                  #23
                  What pattern did the AMC adaptor, adapt to? Chevy or BOP. The 700r4 is a chevy pattern. Hankrod

                  Comment

                  • getlost4x4
                    258 I6
                    • Jan 23, 2010
                    • 394

                    #24
                    i thought the adapters were to mate the GM pattern tranny to the AMC block??

                    look at the bottom of the page. AMC engine compatibility.

                    www.getlost4x4.com

                    78' Jeep Wagoneer (Tank), Built 360, 330 Miles, QT
                    360 V8 (fresh rebuild), Summit Racing 8600 cam, GM TBI Conversion (in progress), 31" tires no lift, 2.5" exhaust system,dual batteries, T-Max 9000 lbs winch, many plans empty pockets

                    Comment

                    • Hankrod
                      Banned
                      • Jun 22, 2005
                      • 272

                      #25
                      I was responding to the question - will a 71 adaptor for a th400 work with a 700r4? A: I dont know, does a 71 adaptor, adapt to a chevy or BOP trans?

                      now I will say that all chevy's (straight 6, v6, and all v8's) from mid 60's to about 2001 have the same trans bolt pattern. BOP are different. Hope this helps, Hankrod

                      Comment

                      • jaber
                        Dragin Az
                        • Oct 17, 2003
                        • 8104

                        #26
                        Originally posted by getlost4x4
                        i thought the adapters were to mate the GM pattern tranny to the AMC block??
                        I have 2 of the factory adapters here.
                        1 is from a '71 J?. It is Buick Nailhead tranny to BOP engine. Worked great for the Caddy engine.
                        The second is a Nailhead tranny to an AMC engine.
                        I dont think there was a factory adapter to a GM tranny, just the Buick.

                        I think I got that right....
                        Jeff

                        '43 cj2a
                        '51 Willys p/u
                        '51 Willys Parkway Conversion
                        '68 Panel Delivery
                        '74 CJ5
                        '75 J-20 Wrecker
                        '75 J-20 Cummins service bed
                        '77 J-10 p/u
                        '79 Cherokee
                        '88 Grand Wagoneer
                        '98 Grand Cherokee

                        Comment

                        • getlost4x4
                          258 I6
                          • Jan 23, 2010
                          • 394

                          #27
                          my friend has the 304 v8, not sure of the year. but it clearly has an adapter on the back of the engine.

                          i plan on snagging it from him and i'll check it to the front of a gm tranny.
                          www.getlost4x4.com

                          78' Jeep Wagoneer (Tank), Built 360, 330 Miles, QT
                          360 V8 (fresh rebuild), Summit Racing 8600 cam, GM TBI Conversion (in progress), 31" tires no lift, 2.5" exhaust system,dual batteries, T-Max 9000 lbs winch, many plans empty pockets

                          Comment

                          • tgreese
                            • May 29, 2003
                            • 11682

                            #28
                            Just a contrarian opinion ...

                            What do you expect to gain from the 700R4 swap? Is it because you want the automatic, or because you think it will give you better mileage?

                            If it's the first, I suggest that you look around for a J-truck that already has an automatic. There were a lot more of them built than with manual transmissions, and you should be able to find a replacement truck with an automatic for much less time and money than you'd spend on a swap.

                            The T-15 3-speed transmission in your truck is a good transmission - strong for a 3-speed, and fairly easy shifting. The Borg-Warner 3-speeds are easy to rebuild, too. From the factory, the clutch pedal force is not particularly truck-like ... but if you put a stiff performance clutch set in, pedal force will go up a lot.

                            Re mileage, I think you will be disappointed on any mileage gains. The main economy problem with these trucks is aerodynamics, not gearing IMO. You'll likely gain a few mpg, but it will take years to make back the money you spend on the automatic swap. A manual transmission is more efficient than an automatic, even an efficient overdrive automatic with a locking converter. It takes power to move all the stuff to shift the gears - no way around that - and gearing up with an overdrive takes energy too.

                            So, what do you really want to accomplish? If all you want is an interesting project that you can spend your money on, then go to it. But I don't see any way you can justify it for practical reasons.
                            Last edited by tgreese; 04-10-2010, 07:50 AM.
                            Tim Reese
                            Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS, hubcaps.
                            Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination ATs, 7600 GVWR
                            Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
                            GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
                            ECO Green: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk

                            Comment

                            • Hankrod
                              Banned
                              • Jun 22, 2005
                              • 272

                              #29
                              tgress is correct. I have a 700r4 in my wagoneer. It has 3.90 gears and 31" tires, so it works out real good. I like the low 1st gear. It was quite costly to convert and was not -in any way - worth any fuel savings. Also the adaptor kits cannot take 500+ hp from a turbocharged 401, the torque converter bolts with spacers will rip right through the flexplate. I know because it happened twice to me. Hankrod

                              Comment

                              • Wagoneerlover
                                350 Buick
                                • Jan 18, 2004
                                • 1456

                                #30
                                tgress and hankrod are both correct. I was able to save substantially by doing all of the work myself on both a trans swap and a TBI install. This helped me to gain extra mileage but the cost did not become exceptionally high. If you get a shop to do all or part of the work the cost start to outweigh the benefits of the potential gains from these upgrades/swaps. I know one guy who had his corvette outfitted with a new trans and engine. A shop did it and the cost start to near the 8,000 dollar mark. (Of course they did all the work, including wiring etc) The aw-4 swap was very inexpensive for me as I did all of the work and it required no adapters (This also depends on what trans case you use as you may need an adapter for that). The tbi install was also cheap because I went the DIY route. (Complete DIY no shop or outside source did any of the work.)

                                But think carefully about what you plan to do with your rig and how much of the work you can do and what the cost of supplies etc will run you or how much the shark (ummm I mean shop will charge you to do the task you cannot do yourself or the entire job if necessary). If the cost are too high then you will be wasting effort, time and money.
                                88 Grand wagoneer AMC 360 all stock
                                89 Grand Wagoneer AMC 360 (Deceased)


                                Upgrades

                                1. Electric Radiator Fan 10/15/11
                                2. Cs-144 Alt 10/1/11

                                All completed long ago (cannot remember when)
                                1. TBI
                                2. New fuel tank
                                3. AW-4 Transmission
                                4. Aluminum condensor
                                5. Custom Gauge Panel

                                Comment

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