OPPOSE FEDERAL "CASH FOR CLUNKERS" PROGRAM

[shredby4]

OPPOSE FEDERAL "CASH FOR CLUNKERS" PROGRAM

Washington lawmakers are drafting a large economic stimulus package to help create jobs and rebuild infrastructure. They want to include a nationwide scrappage program which would give U.S. tax dollars to consumers who turn-in older cars to have them crushed, as a misguided attempt to spur new car sales. The lawmakers need to scrap this idea.

The stimulus package is being drafted right now. House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-CA) wants to introduce the bill on January 6 and have it approved by Congress by January 20, so that President Obama can sign it into law after he is inaugurated.

Contact House Speaker Nancy Pelosi IMMEDIATELY To Oppose Cash for Clunkers!
Call: 202-225-0100
Click here to send an electronic message: http://speaker.house.gov/contact/ (http://email.e-mailnetworks.com/ct/3856825:1718398440:m:1:114718474:3D758CA4C691C164E 367F9F431E1805B) Talking Points
Feel free to use any of the statements below as a starting point for your message to Speaker Pelosi.

I am [calling/writing] to urge lawmakers not to include a “Cash for Clunkers” provision in the economic stimulus bill. Owners who turn in vehicles for crushing would receive a "minimal" payment to purchase a new car. This is a misguided attempt to spur car sales and claim that the country’s air quality or fleet fuel mileage is being improved.
I work for [company name] located in [city and state]. My company is part of the specialty automotive industry, an industry which enables consumers to enhance their vehicle’s appearance, performance, comfort, convenience and safety. “Cash for Clunkers” programs deny our small businesses the availability of older cars necessary to develop and market their products and services. The programs will hurt my company and our customers.
“Cash for Clunkers” programs threaten enthusiasts nationwide with the loss of valuable parts and parts-cars for repair, restoration, and customization projects. The programs also risk destroying classic, historic and special-interest vehicles, our American heritage.
Cars turned in for scrappage often barely run, or are rarely-driven second or third vehicles that have a minimal impact on overall fuel economy or emissions.
“Cash for Clunkers” programs will reduce the availability of affordable transportation and repair parts used by low-income drivers. It will also compete with the Salvation Army, the Purple Heart and other charities that rely on vehicle donations to raise money.
“Cash for Clunkers” ignores better policy options. If Congress wants to act, support for repair and upgrade is a better choice and a win-win for consumers, dealers, manufacturers and repair shops. Significant emissions and fuel economy improvements can be achieved in older vehicles through relatively simple and inexpensive means: repaired/replaced exhaust systems, tune-ups, etc.
We hope we can count on you to reject “Cash for Clunkers.” Thank you for your consideration on this very important matter. If you choose to send a message to Speaker Pelosi, please send a copy of your message to SEMA also:
E-mail: briand@sema.org
Fax: 202/783-6024

[tazzerzz]

Now I know why that guy was selling his fsj for 89,000,00
He was just a little early on the trigger
Government ploy to get their bailout money back obviously

[fireman91186]

THEY WILL HAVE TO PRY MY OLD CARS OUT OF MY HAND! AND YES I AM YELLING. Some times this country just makes wonder who we vote into office.

[babywag]

CA has had a similar program for years, hasn't really made any difference in classics/older vehicles.

Program is voluntary, and the cars have to be registered and driven to a place that accepts them.
They are inspected, and if everything is good, they accept it.
Usually it is a salvage yard or dismantler.
If it can be repaired easily, they fix and sell them, if not then well it could wind up crushed eventually.

Several other states run similar programs, this is nothing new.

[bigun]

CA has had a similar program for years, hasn't really made any difference in classics/older vehicles.

Program is voluntary, and the cars have to be registered and driven to a place that accepts them.
They are inspected, and if everything is good, they accept it.
Usually it is a salvage yard or dismantler.
If it can be repaired easily, they fix and sell them, if not then well it could wind up crushed eventually.

Several other states run similar programs, this is nothing new.
Yeah several states have the same law, but they don't have the weight of the federal government behind them

[fulsizjeep]

There are two sides of this coin I reckon. It depends on the details and all. From my own life experience, I have traveled a good bit of the USA and there is a huge excess of scrap steel laying all over this fine country. Not just vehicles, but all kinds of metal junk. I would not be opposed to that kind of clean up. We have scrapped some dang ugly rusted out FSJs and I never felt bad about the remains going to the crusher.

[Slinger646]

Take advantage of it. I know guys that have taken a broken $25 Saturday Night Special into a gun buy-back and got a $75 gift card which he spent at.......wait for it......a gun shop.

Drag in a 77 Honda Accord and get you some cash for your FSJ

These Bleedin' Hearts never think things through, so long as it 'feels' good

[mrtazwrench]

Take advantage of it. I know guys that have taken a broken $25 Saturday Night Special into a gun buy-back and got a $75 gift card which he spent at.......wait for it......a gun shop.

Drag in a 77 Honda Accord and get you some cash for your FSJ

These Bleedin' Hearts never think things through, so long as it 'feels' good

I'm not sure how much truth there is to this, but I read somewhere else that it could only be used for the purchase of a new car to help the auto industry.:rolleyes:

[Tornado230]

There is no way there will ever be a new vehicle in my driveway unless it belongs to someone else or someone gives it to me.
I am probably the reason the industry is in the dumpers. They stopped making what I would buy.
I bought my last new vehicle June, 1982.

[Wagoneerlover]

I agree with Tornado,

First off a new vehicle is a depriciable asset. Drive off the lot and you already just lost $5,000 in value. Besides that newer vehicles are snazzy and have all sorts of gizmos (High end stereo systems, things that unlock your vehicle by the smell of your feet or whatever else they may have.) But have you ever gotten into the internals of the new stuff? With paper thin cylinder walls on the engines and the cheapest of cheap just to get it off the assembly line. How many of you have towed something behind your 727 or th400 trans that was well above the rated capacity only to have the trans laugh at you and ask for more? Or how many of you have redlined the AMC engine for the umpteenth time only for it to keep on ticking? Try that with these new vehicles and your new vehicle will also be on the scrap vehicle list. Independent suspension and off-roading not a good mix.
I like having a vehicle that is true to form and can be taken off road and still survive and still be driven on road with a level of comfort, one that has internals that were made to last and not fall apart after 3-5 years so that I am forced to buy another.

To-add-to that these newer vehicles are no longer friendly for the home mechanic. How many of you have had a new vehicle headlight go out only to find that in order to remove the headlight they have to lift the engine slightly and remove a special plate that you need a special tool to remove. Or a vehicle where in order to change the battery you have to remove the front tires and lower part of the suspension blah blah blah. or how about this one. Well your left blinker blew out and it will only cost you 1.200 to fix it becuase there is a computer that controls the blinker and then there is another computer that controls the first computer and both computers are tied into the PCM and if one blows out it blows the whole system and all three computers have to be changed. (no thakns I will keep my user friendly rig)

Additionally, As opposed to me getting rid of an old vehicle only to have a new one made I would rather just keep the old one. If any of you have ever done extensive travelling in many other countries you wont see ten thousand of the newest vehicles on every corner. Many of the countries I have visited you will see people taking older cars and keeping them going. You don't see mounds of cars on the side of the road or piled up in scrap yard. People take what they have and keep it going. When something breaks they replace it. Many will swap in a new or different drivetrain but they dont believe in throwing one away only to replace it every three years. (Adds to the amount of waste)


Lastly, part of the fun of the old time rigs is that it is fun to see what creative ways you can come up with to install or retrofit the new things into the old vehicle. How many of you jumped for joy on finding that the HEI dist. actually worked in your AMC or that you could turbo the old engine?

[mrtazwrench]

There is no way there will ever be a new vehicle in my driveway unless it belongs to someone else or someone gives it to me.
I am probably the reason the industry is in the dumpers. They stopped making what I would buy.
I bought my last new vehicle June, 1982.

I'm kind of in the same boat here, My DD is 19 year old corolla that I bought broken, 2 J-trucks that drive, and the family vehicle is 15 years old. I will not buy new, but the next family vehicle will be some sort of SUV with 3 rear shoulder belts, the current one only has 2. I have never bought new, I deal with enough newer junk at work, and new makes no sense at all payment, higher insurance, tab fees etc. We have been car payment free 4-5 years now.

[Wagoneerlover]

I'm kind of in the same boat here, My DD is 19 year old corolla that I bought broken, 2 J-trucks that drive, and the family vehicle is 15 years old. I will not buy new, but the next family vehicle will be some sort of SUV with 3 rear shoulder belts, the current one only has 2. I have never bought new, I deal with enough newer junk at work, and new makes no sense at all payment, higher insurance, tab fees etc. We have been car payment free 4-5 years now.

Excellent point that I forgot to write about. I have been payment free for several years now. Who wants 2-300 bucks a month hovering over their shoulder for five years and insurance to add to it?

[Clean RC]

I agree with all of you on this the newest rig I own is my 90 XJ.. Even Jay Leno said the best form of recycling is driving the same vehicle for 20 plus years.. I am tired of all the tree huggin liberals in Cal, where I live they look up at me from their prius with their noses in the air.. Thats just because the XJ is on 8" of lift with 33's...:D

[woodybeone]

Right.
Have people bring in their old cars that they can probably just keep on the road for cash that they can only spend on a new car they won't be able to afford to insure,or keep up the repairs on.

[mrtazwrench]

Excellent point that I forgot to write about. I have been payment free for several years now. Who wants 2-300 bucks a month hovering over their shoulder for five years and insurance to add to it?

It is more or less nessary for us, We started out 9th year on single income back in august. While we did have a payment on the used 94 during part of that time, but I think we will be putting away some money so we can pay up front for the next one to be bought or built for the family vehicle. The current one may be kept until it is unable/impractical to fix, our oldest will hopefully be driving and he may get this one to drive.

As far as what is next I have a wag I'd like to build, but the requirement of 3 rear shoulder belts still seems to be a major problem, and has be thinking about newer junk, I would do a grand cherokee, but they were very slow at getting that 3rd shoulder harness in, this has me looking at GM as that is what the current one is, almost no chance at all goung ford. If I do the wag it may just do camping trips and very bad weather, and I'll pick up a cheap GM car for daily use.

[Bill Moore]

There is no way there will ever be a new vehicle in my driveway unless it belongs to someone else or someone gives it to me.
I am probably the reason the industry is in the dumpers. They stopped making what I would buy.
I bought my last new vehicle June, 1982.yup, totally agree, I build my own now, but if jeep would of made that turbo diesel gladiator 6 speed pickup, Id thought hard about it, no wonder the car companies are sucking wind, who wants what they make? a glob of high maintenance plastic that takes 10 hours of moving stuff to change anything!

[mrtazwrench]

Lets not be so shallow!

Give the government SOME credit! How many BILLIONS did the big three automakers ask for in their bailout request?

In the big picture of things, this doesn't sound like such a bad idea to help kick start the current state of affairs with US economy.

Well that is a good point... but I see it as turning out like the housing crisis, buying above your means, then there will be all kinds of auto repos going on... it all goes back to that lots of people buying above their means, relying too much on credit etc... that way of doing things is how the economy got to where it is today.:rolleyes:

[duncanstives]

My guess:
People driving old cars will turn them in for credit on a new one... They will STILL not be able to get credit. Governemnt and induviduals will decry "greedy" banks for not "giving people a chance" and policys will be changed or law made to make/encourage the giving of auto loans to people who would not otherwise qualify. People will get them everything will look good then they will all get repo'ed and the industry will be even more in the dumps than it is now and the industry will be blamed for "greed" (again) for giving loans to people that should not have got them.

Remind you of anything that happened in the last few year with another industy?

What makes me even more mad than the fact that it happens in general is that the VERY SAME people who make it happen in the beginning turn around when it goes south and assign blame to businesses just for doing as they demanded and no even calls them out... Do people just have sort of mental retardation that prevents them from remembering whats been said and demanded more than like 2 days ago? Or are they all just deliberately ignoring it? :mad: :mad: :mad:

Oh yeah: Who gets stuck with the bill? You need only look at your own paycheck to find out

[/rant]

[Chrome]

who wants what they make? a glob of high maintenance plastic that takes 10 hours of moving stuff to change anything!

EXACTLY!! The power steering pump went out on my 02 Lincoln LS. They do not make a new pump so I had to settle for a reman from F*rd. The reman was $150 then...hope your sitting down...in order to install it the A/C compressor had to be completely removed. The total bill for draining the freon, removing the compressor, replacing the pump, reinstalling the compressor, recharging the system, and filling the power steering system with fluild....$507. And to top it off they did not put new seals in the lines on the A/C so all the freon has leaked out and now I the compressor has to come back off to replace the seals and recharge the system. :banghead: :banghead:

So they can keep their check for my old beaters.

[crispyboy]

I feel like I am putting more people to work by driving my old vehicles. They folks at the parts house know me by name..... I buy lots of parts to keep old cars going. I usually spend the extra coin to buy domestically manufactured parts as much as I can - I think this helps the economy more than a one time purchase at a car dealer. Where does the money go after a new car purchase? To the bank for the note and to the county/state for higher ad valorum taxes......
The only reason I will make a change is because we have a baby due in April and I don't know about space constaints yet......

[starlifter]

If they will give me $22,000 for each of my Jeeps they can have them. Of course that will need to be in small, unmarked and previously cirulated bills stuffed into a Piggly Wiggly (local food store chain) sack placed next to the burned out oak tree at the bottom of dead mans gulch.:eek: On second thought, just post it to my account because my Jeep won't make it in & out of there:rolleyes:

[mrtazwrench]

I did some searching, and found nothing about this on the SEMA site, maybe I just didn't find it, but I did find this site that is kind of the same thing.


http://www.motorists.org/emissions/home/keep-your-old-clunker-on-the-road/