TF 727, Lock-Up or Non-Lock Up??

[88GW]

In my 88 Grand Wagoneer, does it have a Lock-Up or Non_lock Up Torque Converter? I am guessing it is a non-lock up due to its behavior, but I could be wrong. I need to know before I call to order a valve body/ shift kit for it. TIA

[WillyPete]

should be non lock up

[andy d]

i thought it depended on whether the wag has a towing pkgage. if it doesnt,then it has a locking converter. if it has the towing option,part of that is the non -lockup converter

[Don S]

I put a tune-up Tach. on my '81 360 727... By picking up speed very slowly the tach drop 50 RPM at 45 mph every time. Of coarse it could have had one and then not be working.. :rolleyes: .......ds..

[WillyPete]

oooohhhh yeah. i'd forgotten about the tow package thingy. andy d has the right of it.

[88GW]

I have the factory towing package on my 88. Is this a 100% thing that I have a NON LOCK UP converter. Once again I have never felt it lock or unlock.

[Ralph]

I believe every TF727 put into FSJ's had lock-up converters, whether they had the towing package or not. I've just rebuilt one from a Jeep with a towing package (Narnian's 1980 Cherokee) and put it into my 1984 J10. The transmission that came out of the J10 without a towing package is exactly the same, and is also identical to the tranny in my 1988 Grand Wag w/o yoeinh

By the way, if anyone's interested, I can get a reman converter for $140 plus shipping (plus tax for Ohio residents). A reman TF727 is $630 plus exchage (or $400 core deposit), plus shipping (plus tax for Ohio residents).

[wagdriver]

Ralp you seem to be well versed in the trans business I have an 88GW maybe you can give me a clue as to what I am up against. If I let it set for a couple of days if leaks about a cup of trans fluid, it looks like it is coming from the front seal area. If I drive it every day it doesn't seem to leak. The thing has 140k on it so I don't think it would be cost effective to pull it to repair the seal. I was thinking, if I have to pull it I might as well have it rebuilt since its pretty high milage. Your thoughts? Thanks

[88GW]

So is there a 100% way to identify a physical part or connection that would designate this transmission as Lock vs. Non-Lock. Anyone???????

[willowgypsy]

I don't want to open a hornets' nest, but I had a mechanic tell me that the lock-up torque converter is a myth. He was working on another Jeep of mine and I told him that I had recently had a transmission rebuilt in my 82 Wagoneer. He asked if they charged me for the lock-up torque converter and then laughed and said that I was taken when I told him I had been charged extra for a lock-up.

[Crazy_Jeepman]

I am the last one that should be replying here cause I hardly know how to check an automatic for the correct fluid level. Anyhow I do know some. I believe the Torque Converters are lock up converters. Yes, there is such a thing and it is not a myth. Anyhow I have stolen a Schematic Diagram from Wagoneers.com for the JEEP TF727 and uploaded it. You will be able to see in Part #1 what you are looking for. Jeep TF727 (http://images.andale.com/f2/116/106/4651773/1014862265716_tf727_Jeep.jpg)

[Don S]

I forgot to say, if it means any thing, my '81 360 727 does not have the towing PKG. It was ordered with buckets, upland susp., altitude compensator, and no wood trim. It's a lock-up for sure. I bought it from the original PO who was a Forest Service Ranger. My wife can hear and feel it lock..but I can't......... :rolleyes: .......ds..

[Big Daddy aka.redwoodsignman]

I'm no expert but I just had the 727 out of my 1983 and have no idea wheather it has the towing package or not. A friend pulled it and I tok it to the rebuild shop and he said the differance between the two differant tranny's is the non-lockup has a single shaft and it is not tapered the lockup unit has a large tapered shaft with a smaller one coming out of the center, the second being the one I had. Is he blowing smoke?

[Ralph]

I don't claim to be an expert, just obsessed! But my experience in the previous six weeks with four TF727 transmissions from '79, 80,'84, and '88, is that they are all identical, lock-up types. redwoodsignman has the description correct.

That said, wagdriver, what you're likely experiencing is a bad front pump seal. It's very much like the seal on the back of the front wheel hubs; the ones that come in a rebuild kit have a rubber sleeve added to extend the sealing range. So when you're driving the tranny fluid is inside the transmission, but when you stop it settles and seeps out from the front pump seal, then forms a pool in the bellhousing, then leaks out where the bellhousing mates up to the engine block. The only fix I could imagine would be to drop the tranny and replace the seal.

[wagdriver]

Ralph thanks for the reply, I kind of thought that was what I up against. I'll live with it for a little while longer. I think I will eventually have it rebuilt. It just doesn't make sense at this point to pull it and do the seal. Thanks again for you input. ;)