View Full Version : What exactly do revolver shackles do?
KYJ10
10-09-2002, 02:27 PM
Do they provide any lift over stock shackles? Can you put them on the front? And if so, do they affect the performance and handling? Im looking to get about 1.75" lift in the front. Ive already done the GMC shackle deal, but still am to low. Would love to swap 4" rusty's front springs, with some one with 6" springs! Anyway, thanks for your help, Dennis
blt2krl
10-09-2002, 04:00 PM
Revolvers can be put on the front. They provide and 1.5 to 2 inches of lift. they haven't affected my performance or handling. They have increased my articulation tremendously. This is a pic of Rockjeep44's rig. He has them front and rear.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/fda59052/bc/Jeep/Rockjeep44.jpg?bcCOJz9A49LXjbY6
KYJ10
10-09-2002, 11:49 PM
My next question is, where can I get some without paying and arm and a leg? Thanks Dennis
blt2krl
10-10-2002, 03:11 AM
You can pic them up at www.trailquest.com (http://www.trailquest.com) . They have the best price at $145 for the pair. Just order a pair for the 90's XJ.
Yep, what blt2crl said. I have them front and rear and haven't noticed a difference in handling. The articulation is awsome. Treyl
Sitting Bull
10-10-2002, 09:06 AM
What modifications are necessary to make them work for the rear? Or do they still work with a "hanger" set-up?
FSJeeper
10-10-2002, 09:29 AM
They bolt up, no mods. Takes less than an hour to do all 4.
bchesley
10-10-2002, 02:46 PM
You need a rear shackle flip!!
Marc_01
10-10-2002, 04:30 PM
Im interested in these because my rig is my daily driver, but i want as much articulation as possible. More flex = less need for lockers.. correct?
Stuka
10-10-2002, 05:07 PM
marc: to a extent yes. But if you dont have much weight on a tire its going to spin. Whenn the revolver extends it does so because the axle is dropping and the only weight there is the axle and tire. BUT...if having revolvers alllows you to have good weight on either both front or both rear tires, then it would negate the reason for needing a locker at the given time.
Andrew
10-11-2002, 02:24 AM
I know there has been a lot of discussion regarding these things "unloading" on people going around corners during street use. Is there some way to LOCK them out when you're on the road and then just pull the pin when you hit the dirt? Kinda similar to a sway bar dico?
blt2krl
10-11-2002, 03:10 AM
Hey andrew what your hearing about unloading going around corners and so on is from the SWB guys. I have had them on my rig for a year others have had them longer and noone has had them unload whill driving on the street. If you would like to design a locking system then feel free but it is not needed.,
rockjeep44
10-21-2002, 10:50 AM
Never unloaded on me and I drive the crapp outta my Jeep on road on off. BTW, Paul your jeep is sweet man I checked some of your pics on Yahoo. Don't see em like hardcore very often.
-Andrew
will e
10-21-2002, 02:53 PM
What's the brand name?
rockjeep44
10-21-2002, 05:41 PM
teraflex
69WagFromH@%L
10-21-2002, 06:54 PM
Will they work on my 69 Wag?
YAKFSHR
10-22-2002, 01:38 AM
somebody said the provide 1 1/2 to 2 inches of lift. is this only when articulating? or is the lift all the time. got the espos 2" over springs but the rear end seems a little low still. can i just put them on the rear to raise it a little?
When the revolver is closed, it measures about 1 1/2" longer (eye to eye) than the standard shackle. I didn't measure when opened, but it is a lot.
Kong
rockjeep44
10-22-2002, 03:04 AM
Actually, the revolvers don't give you any lift. 1/4in to 1/2in at most.
-Andrew
blt2krl
10-22-2002, 03:08 AM
It provides 1.5 to 2 in of lift in the closed position. Yakfshr you will have to have a shakle flip in the rear in order to use the revolvers. I hope you come to Moab by the way. I remember a post where I said I was wanting to get some FSJers to come and do some extreme wheeling and to get away from the retards. You took a little afence to it, I think. I was not meaning you as a retard. When you go to Moab you will understand what I'm talking about. I would love to wheel with a fellow FSJer on any class trail. smile.gif Andrew one of these years we will have to get together and do some wheeling.
Paul,
Count me in on that Moab thing! I already have too much body damage to mention, so I don't mind.
YAKFSHR
10-22-2002, 04:02 AM
blt2crl: i didn't think you were talking about another fsjer even though i qualify as a "retard" when it comes to off roading. even with the new springs it seems the rear end is still lower than the front and i wanted to raise it up a little and thought the shackles might be the way to go.
will e
10-22-2002, 07:51 AM
Okay. We have one vote that it only provides 1/4" lift and another that says 1 1/2 to 2 inches. Looking for confirmation.....
If my lift kit doesn't get me high enough I could look at going with revolvers in the front and 2 inch blocks in the rear but only if the recolvers give me a lift in the front.
blt2krl
10-22-2002, 08:04 AM
I know for a fact I got an 1.5 of lift out of revolvers. lift will very with vehicle and suspension setups.
What is involved in a rear shackle flip other than the obvious? Are there parts to be bought or fabricated?
blt2krl
10-22-2002, 11:45 AM
You can fab your own brackets or buy RB kit. River Beasts kit is a kit designed to lift the rear (without a block) to match a SOA in the front. His kit will net about 6-7in of lift. I also know Brad Chesely has a version that will give you about 3-4in of lift after the flip. This is RB site on his kit:
RB kit (http://home.earthlink.net/~riverbeast/RB_Kustoms/info.html)
You will have to contact BCHESELY for info on his setup or search the archives.
Paul,
I am about to question your statement...
...please understand that it is done for the purpose of furthering the general knowledge of the FSJ crew and that I have a lot of respect for you cause your wag is so much nicer than mine...also, anything I asy can be taken with a grain of salt cause I have never owned a pair of revolvers....with that said and after having thoroughly discredited myself....
I am questioning the statement that they can give you so much lift...
even if the eye to eye length of the Revolver is 1.5" longer than a stock shackle, installing them would only give you a lift of approximatley 3/4"
Since you are raising only one end the spring, the middle of the spring is only dropped by half the distance of the increase.
you would have to raise both ends of the spring by 1.5" to get a lift of 1.5"
In other words, for the revolver to give you a lift of 1.5" at one end of the vehicle, the increase in eye to eye length over the stock shackle would have to be somewhere around 3"!
Now is that really the case?
Again, like I said B4, you are infinitely wiser than I and your comment that the lift will vary by application is well taken, but please explain how you got so much of a lift...
BTW, what chu think about coming over to Boise for a FSj meet this wknd...did you see the thread in the events section?
rockjeep44
10-22-2002, 12:32 PM
I only got about 1/4in of lift if that. I believe Paul that he got as much lift as he's saying but there must be another reason for it because thats the first I've ever heard of that happening.
-Andrew
http://www.off-road.com/chevy/reviews/revolver/revolvr-old.jpg
will e
10-22-2002, 02:12 PM
WOW. Thanks for the picture. I understand better how it works. Also, thanks guys for not being 'know it alls' who can't believe other people's views. (See post about maturity of the group). Anyways. This might be my next upgrade. That and some extended brake hoses.
Would still like to hear how Paul got 3". It looks to me like it is only good for 1/4" of actual 'lift'. Must allow the suspension 3" of travel though...
blt2krl
10-22-2002, 02:31 PM
I here you guys and believe me I take no offense. Here is my setup 6in Rusty's lift and revolvers in the front. Now I break it down this way 6in lift springs (front) and 4in lift springs + block in the rear to net 6in of lift. I added the revolvers up front figuring about a 3/4 - 1in lift total. When I got the revolvers on I went and bought a 3in block for the rear to make up the difference. The rear still sat half to three quarters of an inch low. I also believe that Camo Cow got around 1.5in of lift but I could be wrong. The only thing I can think is perhaps the springs weren't providing the addvertised amount of lift in the rear. I totally agree though Jode that 3/4 of an inch should be the calculated amount of lift. Andrew your revolvers look like the revolver made by metal made rite. Are they? I was wondering if there was a change in design when Tera Flex took over. Anyway I will revert to the calculated lift numbers instead of my numbers, as they do seem more practical. I will try to take some pics tomorrow. Jode, I wish I could make it but my buddie is getting married this weekend. It looks like alot of fun though. Take lots of pics.
rockjeep44
10-22-2002, 03:14 PM
I don't think they changed design. Mine say teraflex on the side. I used to have a bunch of pics of my revolvers and my rear shackle flip and now I can't find them!!! I hate that.
-Andrew
YAKFSHR
10-22-2002, 03:25 PM
i hear ya, my espo 2" over springs are no where near 2" and when i questioned them about it they said the specs call for i believe she said 1 7/16" not really 2". to say i am dissapointed about the amount of lift they advertise and what you get can be an understatement. i like the ride but i wanted more lift. i bought my ranchos based on the 2" and ordered my tires based on the same info.
blt2krl
10-22-2002, 03:32 PM
The only reason I say that Andrew is mine are a little different. My grease zurk is in a different spot, I don't have that weld by the zurk in your pic and my swiveling arm appears to be longer. I will definitly post pics tomorrow.
will e
10-22-2002, 03:33 PM
Talk about false advertising. BFG on their web site shows that their 33" tires are actually 32 inches and some fraction.
I still like the revolver idea. If I ever do buy a set I will do some before and after measurements.
irbob
10-22-2002, 04:03 PM
This is a great informative thread. Thanks for all the kind discusion. Could it be that you are talking about two different makes of the revolvers? Different model numbers maybe? Just a thought cuz they do make them for several applications. Rock on guys. smile.gif
rockjeep44
10-22-2002, 04:23 PM
Actually Paul that pic isn't a pic of my revolvers. I'm pretty sure you're right that those are metal made rite. I just found that pic on the net. My revolvers say Teraflex on the side and are like you described so I guess you're right they did make a few changes. Bob, they do make different models but the only model that will work for us is the XJ model.
-Andrew
O.K. folks! I finished putting in my revolvers and lift tonight!
I have a somewhat definitive answer to the "revolver" lift in question. But first the disclaimer: This must be used with a new 3.5"-4" full spring replacement kit from rusty's, with a 2" block in the rear, rusty's shocks on a 81 Wag that is a nice lighter brown. (Get the picture? :D ).
The revolver I installed is the Teraflex RXJ, purchased for a mere $155 @ www.trailquest.com (http://www.trailquest.com) (where I'm at that is about 3/4 of a month of plasma donation, that's right... pimpin' out my body for the FSJ).
The revolver yielded 3/4" more than the stock shackle.
That's all I have to say. I bought a two inch block thinking originally add about 1 1/2" from the revolver, but after looking at it and measuring, it actually makes the back not look saggy. Of course, I will remeasure in the morning, since I got a little ant-sy to go trash my new upgrade.
Also, you can fit BFG 35x12.50 on 15x10's with about an inch of trimming.
Kong
[ October 22, 2002, 10:59 PM: Message edited by: kong ]
will e
10-23-2002, 01:45 AM
Wait! I have '81 Wag in light brown color. I just ordered Rusty's 4" kit. I am still kicking the revolver and block idea around.
Did you get the blocks from Rusty's too?
With the Revolvers, did you need to extend the brake lines up front?
With the blocks did you need to do the line in the rear?
Without the blocks do you think I will have any problem with 33" tires on my 15X7 stock rims?
Thanks and click on the 'Wonder Wagon' in my sig to see my truck.... maybe ours were seperated at birth!!
Originally posted by will e:
With the Revolvers, did you need to extend the brake lines up front?
Again, I've never had them but the answer is YES!!!
I have a 4" lift with no revolvers and my brake lines are too short....throw in the revolvers and you are asking 4 trouble.
Buy the OEM front brake lines from a 1977 Chevy, Suburban or Blazer at any local auto parts store. They are approx 19.5" long and should only cost around $19.99.....
.....Or go pay an aftermarket co. a ton of money for special ones...I dont care either way :D
River Beast makes a bolt on kit if your looking for I beleive 5 to 6 inches. any less you will have to cut off the old hangers and fab new ones in, that's what I did. I got about an 1.5" out of my revolvers.
will e
10-23-2002, 09:30 AM
Thanks for the brake line tip jode. I will give that a try. Probably at Napa. If I try Checker Auto then I will have to make up engine sizes, carb size, whether it has A/C or not....
Great thread! If I don't want to lift the rear, than I guess revolvers and a flip kit won't work, right?
LOL @ Will E
Mark
As was mentioned previously, if you want to flip the shackle in the rear without lift, then you are on your own. It is possible...but you'll need a welder and skills.
I've thought that a good way to do it would be to cut off both hangers then weld the right-side one back on upside down on the left side and vice versa with the other side...(Go look at them to visualize what I am saying) but that would prolly give some lift so to get no lift would take even more fabbing....but come on...these things are so low stock that they could ALL use a lift smile.gif
blt2krl
10-23-2002, 11:21 AM
Okay guys and gals here we go. I have some pics and lets see where it leads us. This first pic is of the shackle on my rig.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/fda59052/bc/Jeep/onrig.jpg?bcjPs39ASMzFScrz
The next is the stock shackle that measures 3in from hole to hole.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/fda59052/bc/Jeep/factory+shackle.jpg?bcjPs39A2_7V9a2s
The next pic is the measurement of the revolver as it sits on the rig. It measure 4.5 incher from hole to hole.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/fda59052/bc/Jeep/revolver1.jpg?bcjPs39A0s4dRw4.
The next two pics are the factory shackle up next to the installed Revolver. The difference is 1.5inches.
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/fda59052/bc/Jeep/Revolver3.jpg?bcjPs39ATHBqYfE1
http://us.f1.yahoofs.com/users/fda59052/bc/Jeep/Revolver2.jpg?bcjPs39AloDWF95V
rockjeep44
10-23-2002, 12:39 PM
Paul, I was doing some thinking. I've outboarded my springs since I'm running full width and I've also moved my axle 1in forward which makes the revolver sit flatter than yours. I think thats the difference in lift we're talking about right there. Nice pics.
-Andrew
Paul,
again, with all due respect....you jsut showed that the shackles are 1.5" higher than stock...doesn't that mean, then, that the actual "lift" to the front of the truck should be somewhere around 3/4"?
blt2krl
10-23-2002, 03:55 PM
Your right jode I just showed you what the actual lift should be. I won't disagree with you at all. The only point I was making is the fact that I put the revolvers on the front expecting a total lift of 3/4 to 1in of lift. I then bought a 1in taller block and the rear still sits a half an inch low. Now it sat level before the revolvers. The only thing I can think is that maybe the arch and spring rating of the front springs or rear springs is causing the weirdnous. I myself don't get it either. I will throw a question back at ya. Why dosen't my rig sit level or with a slight rack to the front after installing the block? I don't know Jode it really has me scratching my head.
I measured the same thing: 1 3/4, but I thot you are supposed to cut that in half which comes out to 7/8 (basically 3/4") for the "total lift". I have a two inch block in the rear and the rear sits over an inch above the front.
will e: blood brothers! My real brother has a 3" skyjacker lift and has 32s and only rubs under heavy articulation. 33's should do the the trick, but I'm sure you'll have to trim just a bit (that's without the 2" block from rusty's). With the 35's I rub if I cough, so if you don't want to trim, go with the 2" block. It prolly makes a difference too if you tires are narrower (I'm assuming you go 33x10.5s?)
You do need to to new ebrake for the rear. the rears seem ok for the standard brake lines. I haven't done that yet....
While on the road, you don't need extended brake lines for the front, but Im going to make sure that I don't yank 'em off off-road (test tomorrow morning), but I expect that they'll have to get done before this weekend.
Jode's jeep is kind of jacked up ;) , he's the kind of guy that tells you he has a 2" lift and it is really 4". Just poking Joe....
[ October 23, 2002, 11:20 PM: Message edited by: kong ]
will e:
we may have a saiamese twin situation, my jeep has a big scar down the pass side.... maybe they had to pull out the jaws of life :D
i think the 2" block from rusty's was $12. A lot of people on the list don't like the rusty's shocks either, but for a whole day of driving, I'm a fan.
Kong
gwinn
10-23-2002, 06:00 PM
I wish I could give some credible input here, but I also installed an AAL and re-arched my Skyjacker springs when I installed my revolvers. I got 3-1/2" more lift.
gwinn,
how much lift did you get out of the rearching?
I seems to be a draw between the 3/4" (really 7/8") and the 1 1/2" folk, depanding on how you measure lift (by either just the eye to eye shackle length, or 1/2 of that amount).
Kong
I have to stand by blt2crl because i got about 1.5" out of my revolvers too. I think the new bushings the revolvers came with and the new bushings the new springs came with might have helped too. I just don't see 3/4 of an inch of sag in old bushings, but anything is possible.
dnixon
10-24-2002, 05:22 AM
Okay I have a question.. Does any of your guys revolvers hit your springs? Mine seem to contact the spring under compression on the arm that connects to the spring eye... I also noted in your picture the little "rounded" edge was point away from the axle.. I think mine is the other way.. could this be causing the contact? I didn't find anything in the installation instructions saying not to put it on either way so I just kind of guessed..did I guess wrong???
FSJeeper
10-24-2002, 05:27 AM
My springs sit totally flat front and rear. The revolvers do hit the springs. Arched springs do not have this problem.
dnixon
10-24-2002, 05:30 AM
Ahh Originally posted by FSJeeper:
My springs sit totally flat front and rear. The revolvers do hit the springs. Arched springs do not have this problem.Ahhh that is why... Good ole' SOA flat springs... thanks FSJeeper
I have arched springs so mine revolvers don't touch my springs.
paul,
Dont all wags have a saggin keister?
To set the record straight after my character was called into question by certain somebodies tongue.gif
Mine has a 2" BL and 4" springs up front with 4" blocks in the rear and new stock rear springs. It has a saggin rearend too...maybe it is the nature of the beast.
I have a thought. maybe the whole discrepancy here is due to the fact that the revolvers were installed only in the front...maybe that created a cantilever effect to make the front bumper hihger...you know what I mean? if the rear were lifted by an equal amount (3/4"), it would actually bring the level of the front bumper back down a little bit.....right?
:D
blt2krl
10-24-2002, 08:02 AM
Jode I don't have bumpers. I have brand new springs in the rear. TC has them front and rear.
All's I know is mathmatically it only gives 3/4" but it physically gave me 1.5". Don't know how or why but that's what it gave me..
KYJ10
10-24-2002, 02:26 PM
Since I have the 6" rusty's with no sahckle flip in the rear, I was thinking maybe of getting revolvers for the front only. At least I'll flex like hell up front. I guess this wont hurt anything??? I sit pretty level now(with chevy shackles up front), so the revolvers should keep me the same, as the chevy shackles add about 3/4". Anyone need some chevy shackles??? Thanks for another informative thread. I think this thread I started and the exhast one, are both racking up the pages. Dennis
I think that I would tend to agree with tc. Mathematically, it works out to 3/4", but maybe a bit more in the real world. I have 6" in the rear, and 4" in the front, with the revolvers in the front, it seems pretty balanced all around with a bit of extra on the rear.
Either way, revolvers aren't really made for lift, but either way, I think all of the revolver folk may agree on this: we'll take whatever lift the revolver gives us, and in general it is at least near an inch to an inch and a half.
blt2krl
10-24-2002, 02:49 PM
Here here to that Kong. When you going down to Moab. I'll be there the weekend before Easter jeep safari. Let me know if your going to be down there and we will have to do some trail rides together.
paul, whatch out what you get yourself into...dont want to catch yo'sef riding with any of the lower element :D
tongue.gif
BTW Kong, is that 6" springs in the rear or did you get the 4" springs and a 2" block? or a 2" AAL?
As far as the lift provided by the revolvers...congratulations on defying the laws of physics...I've always wanted to do that...as my old physics teacher used to say
fysics is fun! redface.gif
rockjeep44
10-24-2002, 08:14 PM
If you have a problem with a sagging rearend, just chop the top, bob it, and throw the tailgate away. I got at least 4in from the weight loss alone ;)
-Andrew
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