Oil Pan Gasket woes!!

[macguyver]

I have tried twice and I still get leaks. I am having problems getting the oil pan gasket to seal. It keeps squishing out the sides. I am using the permatex ultra black sealer and torqueing even less than the specs. The block is clean and straight and the pan itself looks pretty flat. No major dings or bent edges. Any suggestions? Also, the Fel-pro gasket has wings on both the rubber for the pan ends and on the cork side runners. It seems to me that these overlap and would cause gaps. Am I supposed to cut of the tabs? If so, which ones? The rubber or the cork?

Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Chris

[JeepFreak]

First off are you letting the Permatex skin? I find it's better to let it skin a little before I assemble. Also where exactly is it leaking from. The front part of the pan can be troublesome at times. Also if the pan has been over tightened before you got it, could be a little warped but I have got them to seal even being warped. Also are you using brake cleaner to clean all mounting surfaces? Any oil residue left on the mounting surfaces will cause a leak if you are using permatex. Also I like cork on the pan for the simple reason that it tends to hold up better over time. The rubber is great for valve covers but on a oil pan it will eventually get brittle. Have you tried to just put on the cork gasket dry. you should then only need a little permatex around the corners where the rubber seals meet the cork gasket. All you should need to make the cork gasket work is to apply a little gasket tack to the pan so the cork doesn't slide all over the place when you are shoe horning the pan back in place.

[ April 06, 2002: Message edited by: JeepFreak ]</p>

[macguyver]

Jeepfreak,
Thanks for the hints. I realized a few things I was doing wrong and need to clarify a little. It is leaking from the side rails where the cork gasket is. I didn't use brake cleaner. I'll try it this time. I will also try the gasket tack. Also, I am only using the Fel-Pro gasket which is cork and it has the 2 rubber half-circles for the front and back. The tabs I was talking about are on the front edges of the cork part. It looks like they are supposed to fit under the rubber half-circles. If they are supposed to be like that, It looks like they would cause a gap. Is this making sense?
Thanks,
Chris

[JeepFreak]

Yes the ears on the rubber seals are supposed to be there. If you can't get them to fit just right don't be afraid to get out the razor blade and trim them a little. Be sure to apply sealer to the top and bottom of those ears. Lots of leaks seem to start at those corners. If you put the cork gasket on dry you don't have to be as good about cleaning the block area. The cork works well because it swells when the hot oil hits it causing it to make an even tighter fit.

[ April 06, 2002: Message edited by: JeepFreak ]</p>

[cywagoneer]

Just skip the sealant when using a cork gasket. Put it where the cork and rubber gaskets meet and you should have no problem with the gasket slipping out.

[jeepbob]

If you want to use a sealant with the cork side rails use aviation form-a-gasket (the brush on stuff) on the block, let it tack up then put the gasket on. The only problems with this stuff is that it makes the gasket a pain to remove 10 years down the road.

[Crazy_Jeepman]

I use a spray called HIGH TACK 90 by permatex spray the gaskets let sit a few minutes use a little BLACK RTV Silicone at the rubber to cork joints (wonder why I always see blue, red, orange, clear, none of these colors are meant for resisting oil) The High Tack 90 sprayed cork gaskets will stay where you put em. Have fun!! ;)

[Lugnut]

Is the gasket mushing out near the bolt holes or the area away from the bolt holes?
If you're having to continue to tighten the bolts to a point where the gasket is mushing out at the bolts to keep the gasket from leaking, then chances are very good that the pan has been overtighened and the area of the pan flange surrounding the bolt holes has been pulled up much farther than the rest of the pan flange.
You gonna have to rest the underside of the pan flange on a piece of wood just wide enough to fit in this area without any sticking out onto the rounded edge of the flange, and sit a piece of wood on the gasket surface of the pan and rap it with a hammer to get these areas back in alignment with each other. I just use wood cause it won't dent the pan like using just a hammer would. Use a straight-edge to compare the high and low places on the gasket surface of the pan to see what places are standing up higher than the rest of the surface.
When replacing the pan, I'd use any good adhesive on the pan only, not on the block.
Using spray brake parts cleaner on these surfaces to remove all oil before replacing is a good idea.

[81wag phil]

I ahve a buddy that works at a Toyota dealership as a Tec. He get's this stuff, F.I.P.G. Only draw back is it costs $17 a tube. ( He gets it free though). Well on oil pans we use just the FIP. Works on all the pans we've installed. Even on my '64 Nova. I was having the same problems with that devil I-6. I wonder if the "over-the-counter" sealers could be used the same way.