Jeep runs way too rich and misses...won't stay running

[Chiefly77]

Ok this is the second day I've spent working on this....heres the deal:

It will crank but only with the pedal pressed down all the way...then it will stall if I take my foot off the pedal all the way. It will run with the pedal pressed down about halfway. I've messed with the mixture pins but nothings changes...it still runs rich. I turned the screws all the way in and then only about half a turn out just to TRY to get it to run lean....I have the butterfly value open all the way. I just can't figure this out. What am I missing? Could I be off in thinking its the carb...is it timing? Any help will be greatly appreciated....this is driving me nuts...I NEED this fixed I'm running out of friends to give me rides places.

Thanks in advance

------------------
http://www.virtue.nu/yazahx/rand/chiefly77.jpg

Charlie Nimitz
'77 Cherokee Chief W/T
360/TH-400,
QT w/low range
31" x 10.50" General Grabbers

My FSJ page (http://www.angelfire.com/nc2/chesterspage)

[Snakeyes_Tx]

Do you have a fuel filter on there?

When it does run with the accelerator pressed a little, is it smooth or does it hesitate like crazy too?

Do you have a catalytic converter?
(I ask this one because it could be clogged, I had this happen once and I replaced the carb before figuring it out. Easy way to check is to loosen the Y-pipe a little bit and see if it runs with the extra openings to let the exhaust escape.

Ignition box? Broken wire? fouled plugs? Check em!

------------------
http://www.virtue.nu/yazahx/rand/sig.jpg
Land of the Dinosaurs (http://www.geocities.com/Snakeyes_Tx/rusty.htm)
Snakeyes_Tx
86 J-20 "The Rusty Dinosaur"
360/727/208/44HD/60 <- 2nd of all of them.
"If you don't know what the numbers mean, you don't need to be here!"

[Jowersgd]

When I blew a power valve I had similar symptoms. It is my understanding that a blown power valve will cause it to run way too rich. Maybe holding down the accelerator is getting just enough air in there to start it but when you let off its flooding itself. That's what mine was doing. Just a thought

Jerry

[millerlo]

The last two post seem close. If the float is stuck or a particle is lodged in the needle valve it will sputter and flood causing a soot to be emmitted, and of coarse this will clog the cat. converter. This is something I had about a year ago. I ended up taking the particle out but the cat. was still clogged, replaced it and it ran smooth.

The chance of a particle is likely...and if it is, there's your cheap fix.
Mike

[Chiefly77]

Thanks for the suggestions...

as for the plugs, wires, and ignition box...all were replaced about 6 months ago. I know that they could still have gone bad in that time but I really think its something else.

about the power value, how do I check/fix that?

I don't have a cat. '78 was the first year for cheros. I lucked out http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

when I press the accelerator down it runs a little better but deffinately not normal...its sputtering bad.

There was lots of black smoke when I first started working on it...now theres not hardly any....

My question is...if I made it too lean would it run the same way?

If so than thats what I probably did...I opened the mixture pins about 1.5 turns....no effect too much gas...RICH

then I turned them back in and out 1 turn

no smoke but runs just as bad...timing?

oh yeah about the particle...how do I fix that...take the mixture pins out?

thanks

------------------
http://www.virtue.nu/yazahx/rand/chiefly77.jpg

Charlie Nimitz
'77 Cherokee Chief W/T
360/TH-400,
QT w/low range
31" x 10.50" General Grabbers

My FSJ page (http://www.angelfire.com/nc2/chesterspage)

[Jowersgd]

To get to the power valve you take the carb off the manifold. The P.V. is on the bottom of the carb. It just screws in. A rebuild kit will have a picture and a new one. I'm not sure if there's any way to check the P.V. other than to replace it when you have symptoms of a leaky one. Replacing it is easy.

[Jowersgd]

I believe that black smok is usually associated with too much choke.

Jerry

[GaWd]

I vote for a carb/timing combo.

Sam

[andy d]

how is the coil?

[Stuka]

The black smoke is raw partial burnt fuel. Make sure there isnt a open flame near that, it will ignite.

As for the leaning it out with the idle ixture screws, if that doesnt help...then I say check the guts of the carb. Didnt you say it was rebuilt cheif? If so, it may not have been done correctly (please dont take it the wrong way if it was you ;p, thhey are easy to screw up if its your first time) Check the power valve like mentioned above, and all the venturies (little passage ways), as well as the float level, like I mentioned last night on irc.

------------------
<UL TYPE=SQUARE>
1975 Cherokee
360 w/ Edelbrock Performer Intake and Carb
T18a
Spicer 20 T-Case
Dana44 w/3.54 Gears
[/list]

[David Simon]

I was thinking float level too. When I rebuilt mine I set the float level dry and when I fired it up it ran too rich and sputtered. I unscrewed the top and adjusted the float and it's been good since.
Someone here recently posted about a float breaking, maybe that could be it.
Good luck.
David


------------------
98 Cherokee (wife's)
97 TJ with all the goodies
88 GW
NP229/TF727/D44s
TFI Upgrade
Free-flow cat, Flowmaster 70, 2 1/2" exhaust
Visit my site: http://home.att.net/~simon3494

[Chiefly77]

well I tried adjusting the choke....I think it helped with the rich problem a little....I really can't keep it running long enough to trouble shoot. I need one of my buddies to help me out or maybe I'll bypass the solinoid and keep it running from under the hood. I found a wire that wasn't connected all the way but I couldn't tell if that was the cause of the missing because my battery is dead from all the starting stalling all day. I'm charging it over night and I'll see then.

I'm scared that if that was the problem, I'm gonna have a bigger problem on my hands with all the stuff I "adjusted" http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

Umm..about the rebuild part. I got it from AutoZone, Holley rebuilt it and its ran fine for the past 7 months. Can the float level jump off? If its anything that confused me more, its carbs, never liked them much....and they don't like me http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

I'll keep you posted....

Thanks again.



------------------
http://www.virtue.nu/yazahx/rand/chiefly77.jpg

Charlie Nimitz
'77 Cherokee Chief W/T
360/TH-400,
QT w/low range
31" x 10.50" General Grabbers

My FSJ page (http://www.angelfire.com/nc2/chesterspage)

[Chiefly77]

I forgot to reply about the coil..

I just bought it about three weeks ago. Its an Accel super stock. Worked fine when I got it...I don't think its the problem.

[jeepguzzi]

maybe your carb gasket is cracked by one of the mounting bolts??

[jeepbob]

you are running too rich possible causes are blown power valve, crud in the needle and seat holding it open, and a sinking float. Some floats are nitrile and after a while will pick up fuel and get heavy and sink. If it started happening all of a sudden I would check the needle and seat first as this is prolly the problem, next would be the power valve although it normally takes a back fire thru the carb to take one out. If it started slowly then I would suspect the float.

------------------
65 wag. 360/edelbrock rb4/t400/20 t-case/4:10 d27/d44 broken power lok/onboard air/onboard 110v power(no inverter)/1999 Lincoln t.c.leather buckets/Lincoln ctr console/winch/33x12.50/tunes/water proof door pads
soon to have new motor/d44frt/d60r(4:10)welded diff/custom bumpers
see ya in da mud

[Chiefly77]

Thanks for the help guys...well as a matter of fact http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif jeepguzzi you're right....I'm working on it again tomarrow so I'll see what happens....

If the gasket doesn't fix the problem...I'll try the neddles.

Thanks again,

Charlie

[reddog]

Check that power valve. Blown power valves are a common problem on the 2150. There is a vacuum hose that connects to a nipple on the front center of the carb on the bottom. If you pull that hose off and see any wet fuel the valve is blown. Pull the carb. Where that hose attaches to the carb is a cover held on by 4 screws. The power valve is under there.

------------------
87 GW - Stock (but it looks like RiverBeast when I'm sleeping)
TFI upgrade
360,727,NP229

[Chiefly77]

well I pulled the carb....a few minutes ago and checked the gasket....its real dirty but where it matters it looks good....I cleaned the surface of the intake where the carb sits, as well as the carb...in more resent news, what I thought was a dead battery yesterday from trying to crank it may be the ignition module....I charged it all night and its just as dead (sounding) as it was yesterday. It reads about 13 volts so I guess my module is bad now too....great that makes about five things wrong with it. I'm sick of this ignition...it is the crappiest mess I've ever seen...if the ignition module is bad that will be the third one in just over a year. I don't have the stock box the PO put one of the inside distributor ones on it....

Well I guess I'll have to get it towed now....I know nothing about the ignition thing. I could handle it if it was a box, but the one in the distributor scares me.... http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

man this sucks....I was suposed to go to the beach this weekend...so much for that.

------------------
http://www.virtue.nu/yazahx/rand/chiefly77.jpg

Charlie Nimitz
'77 Cherokee Chief W/T
360/TH-400,
QT w/low range
31" x 10.50" General Grabbers

My FSJ page (http://www.angelfire.com/nc2/chesterspage)