New to IFSJA - 86 J20 Help

[86BigUgly]

I have an 86 J20. I cannot get the transfer case to stay in 4-wheel drive. The vacuum motor is in 4-wheel and I have verified that the mode lever is in 4-wheel drive position and cannot get the range lever to stay in 4-wheel position. It pops out and soon as I increase RPM's. The truck does have an NP228 transfer case.

Reading through the forums, am I correct to assume that a 208 transfer is a better option - if so, has anyone done this swap before? What was required for shaft lengths, etc.

Any directional help/assistance would be greatly appreciated.

[joe]

Check the trans/tcase mounts. If they're shot it'll pop out of gear. Bad motor mounts can also cause this.
And yes the 208 is a good tcase but that's probably not the problem.
On a side note the 208 is a mechanical shift tcase. There is no vacuum motor operating it. It's all done with mechanical linkage no vacuum.

[jaber]

IIRC, the shifter is vacuum and "when you give it gas it pops out" sounds like you might have a vacuum leak or bad modual on t-case, ie, loss of vacuum to hold it....

[joe]

IIRC, the shifter is vacuum and "when you give it gas it pops out" sounds like you might have a vacuum leak or bad modual on t-case, ie, loss of vacuum to hold it....
No not on an 86 J20. The only tcase available was the 208 regardless of MT or AT and it's 100% mechanical. Lever operated on top of the trans tunnel. It's possible someone swapped in a 229 tcase if it's an AT truck but the symptoms still point to bad trans/tcase/motor mounts.

[86BigUgly]

Check the trans/tcase mounts. If they're shot it'll pop out of gear. Bad motor mounts can also cause this.
And yes the 208 is a good tcase but that's probably not the problem.
On a side note the 208 is a mechanical shift tcase. There is no vacuum motor operating it. It's all done with mechanical linkage no vacuum.
Appreciate the reply - today when in 4-wheel "mode" the truck would move forward in drive and not pop out of gear. When trying to move in reverse - a lot of "grinding" noise. The t-case is not even going in to 4-wheel drive in reverse.

I moved mode lever back to 2-wheel drive and the range lever to 2-wheel and the truck runs fine in reverse or forward.

Any other thoughts would be appreciated - the mounts for the t-case/tranny are very worn.

Thanks

[j20brett]

so you are saying that you havce 2 levers you are moving? in that case its not an np208, i think some j20s had the np219 case, which would be vacuum operated, correct?

[joe]

Nah the 219 is also a fully manual tcase no vacuum.

Maybe there's a typo here and it's an 86 J-10 and not a J-20? An 86 J10 could have the vacuum operated 228 in it but the 86 J-20 only came with the 208 and it's a single lever operation for 4L-N-4H-2H. If the 208 came behind an AT the single shifter is a flag lever down in front of the seat off the side of the tunnel. If it came behind a manual trans it's a conventional floor lever on the tunnel with a conventional round shift knob. The vacuum operated tcase used in FSJ's were the 228/229 and neither came stock in an 86 J-20.

If you have a separate dash lever/switch (vacuum) for 2WD/4WD and a separated flag style lever drive side tunnel in front of the seat for Low/High range someone's swapped in a 228/229.

[jaber]

Joe, thanks for setting me straight.

I guess now the magic question is what t-case does he have?????

[86BigUgly]

I have the NP228 t-case - from what I have read this is unique to the 1986 FSJ. The mode lever is vacuum operated.

[The PIG Smith]

I have the NP228 t-case - from what I have read this is unique to the 1986 FSJ. The mode lever is vacuum operated.
First, let me be the first to say: WELCOME!

Sorry, for I'll bet you are confused, maybe even frustrated some.
I ask that you be patient with us.
You are new to us, but we are a super friendly bunch here and would be more than happy to help a fellow FSJ owner!

You have thrown us for a loop, as what you are describing is something no one here has seen, thus all the hub-bub about the transfercase.

You are correct, the NP228 is a one year, 1986 only, transfercase.
But, the 228 was only installed into Grand Wagoneers.
As far as I know, the 228 is not strong enough handle the service it would/could see in a 3/4 ton pickup truck.

It would help if we cleared up what transfercase you have.
If you could post the VIN number, found on the dash, this would tell us what transfercase was installed at the factory.

Second, if you could take some pics and post them, detailed pics of the round tag on the back of the transfercase, that would help a lot.
I would be willing to upload the pics and post them if you email them to me.

Once we are past this transfercase ID hangup, then I am sure, there are many gurus here that would be more than willing to help with your problem.

[86BigUgly]

Thanks for the Welcome - it was great to find this association.

The vehicle is a stolen state of Rhode Island truck and the VIN was removed - it now has a stolen VIN.

The repair manual I have describes the vacuum motor attached to mode lever and the range lever is the mechanical below the right leg of the driver.

Here is a photo of the t-case tag - a little grainy. It is a 228.

The truck has a J20 tag on the front right quarter - if this was incorrect, what would identify the truck as 10 or 20? Leaf springs?

Thanks again for all the help.

Jim

[j20brett]

on the driver side door jamb there is an id tag that will tell you the gvwr of the truck.

[FSJ Guy]

Regardless of what the badging or the VIN says, that's definitely a 228 case.

Those Mode and Range levers MUST be aligned correctly or you will get incomplete engagement of the internal gears. That's what is going on with your case. Actually, the Chilton's manual has a great picture of how the mode and range levers should line up. That's about all it's good for. :lol:

What is happening is that your mode lever is engaging too deep for 2WD and therefore is not engaging ENOUGH for 4WD.

DO NOT drive it in this condition, as the grinding of the gears will make it harder to engage, and then you will be looking at a very expensive rebuild/replacement of some gears and collars. Leave it in 2WD if you need to drive it around before you get the mode rod adjusted.

[joe]

Most obvious way to spot a J20 from a J10 is the 20 will have 8 lugs on the wheels and the rear hub will stick through the rim. A J10 will have 6 lugs on the wheels and the rear axle/drum will be flush with the back of the rim. Also the rear differential (D60) on a J20 is a lot bigger than the front D44. If it's a J10 that would explain the 228 in it.

[86BigUgly]

Regardless of what the badging or the VIN says, that's definitely a 228 case.

Those Mode and Range levers MUST be aligned correctly or you will get incomplete engagement of the internal gears. That's what is going on with your case. Actually, the Chilton's manual has a great picture of how the mode and range levers should line up. That's about all it's good for. :lol:

What is happening is that your mode lever is engaging too deep for 2WD and therefore is not engaging ENOUGH for 4WD.

DO NOT drive it in this condition, as the grinding of the gears will make it harder to engage, and then you will be looking at a very expensive rebuild/replacement of some gears and collars. Leave it in 2WD if you need to drive it around before you get the mode rod adjusted.
Ethan - I disconnected the mode lever from the vacuum motor and moved it as far as possible to the 4-wheel drive position and the vehicle will not go into 4-wheel drive when pulling up on the range lever and then shifting into reverse. I presume that the grinding is the gears not meshing fully - does anyone have an exploded view of the this part of the 228/229 t-case that would show what is physically happening when shifted into 4-wheel drive?

Thanks again to the responses.

[86BigUgly]

Most obvious way to spot a J20 from a J10 is the 20 will have 8 lugs on the wheels and the rear hub will stick through the rim. A J10 will have 6 lugs on the wheels and the rear axle/drum will be flush with the back of the rim. Also the rear differential (D60) on a J20 is a lot bigger than the front D44. If it's a J10 that would explain the 228 in it.
It is 6 lugs - appears I have a J10!!

Thanks for all the help - I will see if adjusted the mode lever fixes the issue.

[FSJ Guy]

Ethan - I disconnected the mode lever from the vacuum motor and moved it as far as possible to the 4-wheel drive position and the vehicle will not go into 4-wheel drive when pulling up on the range lever and then shifting into reverse. I presume that the grinding is the gears not meshing fully - does anyone have an exploded view of the this part of the 228/229 t-case that would show what is physically happening when shifted into 4-wheel drive?

Thanks again to the responses.

The MODE lever controls 2WD <--> 4WD. The RANGE lever controls HIGH <--> LOW range.

When the mode lever is switched to 4WD, the range lever stays put and you should hear a hiss from the dash mounted switch and the green 4WD light should come on.

At this time, you should now be able to move the RANGE lever. (the lever on the floor) It's harder to move than the transmission gear selector, but it should not require backbreaking strength to move. Sometimes it's best to put the transmission into Neutral, STOP the truck, put the trans into PARK and then shift the range lever.

Hopefully, no one swapped in a vacuum disconnect axle on you. Look at your front diff. You should NOT have a rectangular block on the top of the diff with 3 tubes coming out of it. Just covering all angles that I can think of.

[86BigUgly]

Need to replace my 228 xfr case. Does a 229 or 208 bolt up to the tranny. Also - my truck is a J10 not a J20.

[andy d]

a 229 is a direct swap. I have one, PM me if interested. :thumbsup:

[COLOFIREMAN]

Howdy and welcome to the board. Post some pic's of the truck when you can:thumbsup: .

[jaber]

I believe the 208 is a direct swap also.

[jpcoutts]

You need to get measurements on your front and rear drive shafts. I don't think the 208 is a direct swap because the drive shafts will be different lengths for the 228. The 229 should be a direct swap. Somebody here will chime in if I'm wrong. BTW, welome!