1977 Wagoneer Mostly Off Road Rig

[Mahamotorworks]

That plans for my 77 waggy are to make it a mostly off road rig. I have knuckles and high steer arms on the way. I know I want to change the tranny and get a Dana 300 twin stick T-Case to go behind it. The interior consists of the dash, front seat and door panels. There isnt much else interior wise in it. I am in the process on getting a SOA/RSF kit for it. That will be going on when I get my 89 running correctly and can drive it to and from work.

I know I want to make it push button start and change to MSD Ignition on it. Since I am replacing the Tranny and T-Case I might as well get a better motor. I could go with a 401.

I know that when I am done I want it to be street legal. My question is how far should I go?

Input is appericated, I woud like to see what others have done to their mostly off road rigs.

MAHA

[shadowjeep]

is something wrong with the 360? if not i would hold off on taking it out and putting a 401 in until you find one. 360's will surprise you. it may difficult to keep it street legal for long. it sounds like you got a good rig to start with and have some good plans. just remember to take plenty of pics.:thumbsup:

[Mahamotorworks]

Ok I am in the process of getting the parts I need to lift my 77 Waggy. I am going to hold off on starting the build till I have most of the parts that I need.

Here is the plan.

I am going to do a SF and SOA lift for 7 inches of lift then I will probably add a 2" all spring lift kit on top of it. The springs that are on it now are in bad shape the dirvers front is flat. I want to run 35 inch tires on it but probably wont be able to with out adding more lift or cutting fenders. I will end up with 33X12.50R15 tire on stock 5 slot rims. For now I am going to pass on looking for a 401 for it and stick with the 360. Tranny and T-Case will stay till I brake them and desire/have to upgrade them to something else.

Talking about the parts needed to complete the lift I just wanted to make sure that I have a good list of what is needed.

I have the following either in my living room or on its way:
SOA/SF Kit from TT Fabworks, Thanks Again TAD!!
Crossover steering set up from Harsh Terrain
Extra Flat Top Dana 44 Knuckles

I have the plan to buy the following:
2 or 4 inch lift springs. I havent decided how high I want to go.
Longer Brake lines
33X12.50R15 BFGoodrich M/T or Firestone Destination M/T
Shocks

Am I missing any thing else major?

The list is in the order that I plan to purchase everything.

Thanks for the input.

MAHA

[tylerd13]

SOA 2" or 4" spring might look funny with 33's

[Slick Willie]

SOA with SFK will give you at least 6", probably close to 8", depending on what axles and springs you use. That much lift with 33's would be silly on a GW. But like you said, if this is an offroad vehicle only, lower with bigger tires is better.

[shimniok]

I know that when I am done I want it to be street legal. My question is how far should I go?

As far as you want, can afford, and need to, in order to achieve whatever sort of goals you've set for the truck... What kind of trails do you want to run? You want it street legal... how much does ride comfort matter? Do you need cargo room? Protection from elements? Want it quiet or does that not matter? Think through all those kinds of questions, and rank them. If you don't know what your goals are, and what features you want, how can you build a rig that fits what you really want, right? This sounds like what I posted elsewhere, but anyway...

Think about the modifications you have in mind and options available, and figure out what combination of parts / mods fit the overall goals. Put together some of the more likely candidate combinations and figure out which offers the best fit to what you want to achieve... it's all about tradeoffs, so try to find the mods that gets you closest to the most important features without giving up too much...

Michael

[Slim]

Im running a 77 with a SOA in the front ,,, shackle flip in the rear ,,stock springs ,, frt and rear and 3" body and am running 38.5 with No problems ,,, Im sure u will find 33's way to small

Mine is mostly trail only and only drive it to and from the trail ,,,

[Mahamotorworks]

I am sure that I will end up with 35's or bigger. I havnt looked at anything bigger then 35's. I guess I will have to take a look at bigger tire now.

MAHA

[Mahamotorworks]

I ordered a SOA/SF kit from Tad. I got it today I am really impressed, River Beast and Tad put a lot of work into this kit. I cant wait to start installing this.

I just really wanted to say Thanks to Tad and Riverbeast for taking the time to creat this kit.

I will take a lot of photos when I start to install it. It will be a long process but it will be worth it.

MAHA

[Tad]

MAHA,
I really want to thank you for mentioning RiverBeast (Todd).
Many newer members think I actually designed that rear kit, I did not.
As nice as it would be to take credit for the rear SF KIt, I never had anything to do with making it happen.
I have made some changes to keep costs down and yes, I am the one that makes them now, but that rear SF kit is very much the brain work of Todd, not me.
Thank You,

[Slim]

MAHA,
I really want to thank you for mentioning RiverBeast (Todd).
Many newer members think I actually designed that rear kit, I did not.


I think many of the newer member forget alot of influence that RiverBeast had on alot of the tech and designing we all use on our FSJ;s now a days .. truely one of the Ones who shows use others how its done ...I remeber using His tech builds alot to help Me with Mine :thumbsup:

[Mahamotorworks]

Ok I have been looking at my Lift and Tire options. I have been doing a lot of reasearch trying to see if my plan are going to work out at planned.

This is the plan:
(subject to change with out notice)

I am going to go with 35X12.5R15 BFGoodrich MT's on a set of 15X8 AR 767 Rims.

I am going with the SOA/SF kit from Tad. This should get me 7 or more inches of lift. I am planning to add a 2 inch lift spring on top of the SOA/SF Kit to get me 9 inches of Lift.

Looking at this page http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=44404

This should work. If you look under the 35X12.5 section it lists a 6 inch Spring lift and 3 inch body lift giving 9 inches of lift.

I just I am just wanting other peoples imput and what worked for them on a set up like this. I was also wondering ifa 6 inch DPA will work with my 9 inches of lift. I am going with cross over steering.

Thanks In Advance

MAHA

[Dmntxn77]

A DPA with cross over steering will be fine. Why not high steer?

[Mahamotorworks]

I Ordered everything to go high steer I called the company and told them what I was doing to make sure that the parts would work. They messed my order up amd sent me 2 pass side steering arms when I called them to see if I could swap the wrong arm out they said they dont make the driver side arms. I told them that I talked with one of their customer support people there they said that what I was doing would work out with the parts I ordered. They told me that that guy I talked to there didnt know what he was talking about and that they were sorry there was nothing that they could do. They wouldnt even take the whole order back. I know some one with a water jet so I just need to find matching steel stock and have one cut out. It will go to high steer but to get it on the road cross over will work.

MAHA

[Mud Buzzard]

is something wrong with the 360? if not i would hold off on taking it out and putting a 401 in until you find one. 360's will surprise you. it may difficult to keep it street legal for long. it sounds like you got a good rig to start with and have some good plans. just remember to take plenty of pics.:thumbsup: In Florida, anything with a plate on it is street legal. ;) :D

[Mud Buzzard]

I Ordered everything to go high steer I called the company and told them what I was doing to make sure that the parts would work. They messed my order up amd sent me 2 pass side steering arms when I called them to see if I could swap the wrong arm out they said they dont make the driver side arms. I told them that I talked with one of their customer support people there they said that what I was doing would work out with the parts I ordered. They told me that that guy I talked to there didnt know what he was talking about and that they were sorry there was nothing that they could do. They wouldnt even take the whole order back. I know some one with a water jet so I just need to find matching steel stock and have one cut out. It will go to high steer but to get it on the road cross over will work.

MAHA That's ridiculous. Send me the name of the company in a private message if you please (I won't tell anyone--I understand libel). I refuse to do business with people who put policy over customer satisfaction. In business, you've gotta have sufficient reserve capital to "eat" your own mistakes and keep your customers happy. Otherwise you need to be in a different business. Just my opinion, but that's what I believe...

[Mahamotorworks]

It's got plates on it. Code Enforcement cant bother me any more. :D

MAHA

[skeletor]

where are the pictures in this thread:huh:

anyway, 9" of lift and 35s would be small in my opinion, a regular soa and a sawzall would be better and could run much bigger tires. i'm guessing you dont want to change the axles thats why your sticking with the 35s. but good luck on the build.:thumbsup:

[Mahamotorworks]

Ya I know about the pics. I really havnt done any thing with it yet.

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k158/Mahamotorworks/FSJ/Waggy24.jpg

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k158/Mahamotorworks/FSJ/Wagoneers2.jpg

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k158/Mahamotorworks/FSJ/Wagoneers1.jpg

Here are the pics. Any way. I will be taking a lot of them when I get all the parts in to do the lift.

MAHA

[rockingon24_7]

quote "Am I missing any thing else major?"
Has anyone mentioned he needs new driveshafts?
thats a pricey issue for some

[Mahamotorworks]

I totally spaced the drive shafts. Thanks for mentioning it. I would have gotten the lift on and would not be able to drive it around.

How do you measure for new drive shafts?

MAHA

[Mahamotorworks]

I want to replace the grill I have I would like to go with a Rhino but cant find any locally. Either way I want to get rid of the one that is on there now. I like the round head light look and would like to conver tover to them and do the Headlight conversion. I am looking for all the hardware and lamps need to do the dual round headlight from the Rhino Grill front end. Anyone have some they want to sell? Is this something that I can buy new?

Still wondering about the Drive shaft Question from previous post. Current Grill pics on Page 1

Thanks

MAHA

[Tad]

Still wondering about the Drive shaft Question from previous post
Drive shafts will need to be measured when you are done.
Center of yoke to center of yoke.
Any good driveline shop can assist you with both the measuring and choice of yokes. along with whether or not you want to move up to high-angle drive shafts (there's also Jesse at www.highangledriveline.com, many folks here have used and respect his work).
Some of the options are determined by what transfer case you use (I read D300 from page 1, I'm not specifically sure what is available for that case) and the output spline counts.

I'm running a Dodge 208 that already had 32 spline outputs.
For the rear I was able to go with a 1410 rear yoke along with a long travel slip joint in the rear mated to a 1410 at the 14-Bolt rear axle. 3" x .1875 wall tube, balanced to 3K rpm. I got that all done locally for under $275 including the u-joints except for the 1410 yokes which came from Randy's Off-Road http://www.randysoffroad.com/ (in hindsight I could have got the 1410 yokes locally for the same price, so check first if you go that route).
For the front I got lucky and found a Chevy guy selling his high angle front shaft from a 10" spring lift he junked :eek:
It bolted right up, but I needed to have it shortened to work properly, my total cost was about $80, including having it inspected and shortened (1350's at the case IIRC and a 1310 at the diff).
So far this has all worked fine for me although I expect the 1310 to not last (I carry spare joints for everything).

In my experience local is usually always easier and cheaper to deal with. I'd check around, talk with local driveline builders, see what they can and are willing to do with your setup. Several folks here have also built their own setups but from what I read that was out of my technical range of ability, hopefully they will chime in.

[rockingon24_7]

I have a razor grill from my 74 J-10 it has the round headlight buckets. I have all the parts for it. If your interested I will post a pic.

[Mahamotorworks]

I have a razor grill from my 74 J-10 it has the round headlight buckets. I have all the parts for it. If your interested I will post a pic.

I am interested.

Thanks

MAHA

[Mahamotorworks]

I took the 77 to and from Family dinner no more then a total of 5 Miles. It Almost dies when you floor it so I will be doing a Tune up and seting the timming. It smokes worse then thought but that I can live with until I rebuild the motor. Other then that it drove really well. I will be turning my focus to my 89 so I can find the ticking in the Vavle area and fix it before I start on the lift and everything for the 77.

MAHA

[Mahamotorworks]

I just ordered the stuff for a H4 lamp comversion. I have the headlight hardware on its way. Now I get it closer to a real Jeep, Round Headlights. I am heading out side now to remove the plastic POS grill that is on it now. After that I will be getting ready for a tune up.

MAHA

[Mahamotorworks]

I got the correct head lights. I am picking up a Razor grill at the Bama Get Together I will post a complete write up then. I tested on of hte head lights tonight. There is a Major Differance. I will get some pics after I rearrange the jeeps so I dont have to shine the headlights at the neighbors house.

MAHA

[Dmntxn77]

Where did you get the H4 conversion stuff?

[Mahamotorworks]

JC Whitney. I will post a list when I do my write up. If you want the list before let me know.

MAHA

[Dmntxn77]

Thanks, but I am in no rush.. I have about 20 projects to finish at the moment anyway.. Plus, my razor and light buckets are in TX.. I wont be back for 3 more months.. One little fact that I forgot when I sold my other round buckets to you.. :rolleyes:

[Casey]

After I did my SOA/SF and a couple of trans/t-c swaps. I went through a pile of driveshafts I have (from parts rigs..FSJ..XJ..CJ..ZJ..Chevy etc...) and found shafts longer than what I needed and had them cut down by a local shop. Some had the correct splined yokes and some with the correct length tubes. They were able to mix and match parts to build a set. I have very little invested. Which is good 'cause I've dented two and twisted one.
Junkyard/net searching will turn up more than what you'll need for not too much $$$.

What trans are you going to run, TH400?

[Mahamotorworks]

I will run the TH400. I know a couple of people here that would be willing to help me with drive shafts. I just need to get parts here and start working.

MAHA