Welded front=no turning w/Jeep, ok w/Ford??

[jtr]

CJ-7 36" swampers welded front
Waggy 35" Buckshots welded front
79 Bronco 33" Toyos welded front
79 F250 35" BFGs MT welded front

The Jeeps cannot turn with ONE hub locked in, but both Fords can turn with BOTH hubs locked in. Ford guys claim that there is very little difference from an open diff....but it is night and day for us Jeep guys.

Is it something to do with the steering gears? Are the Ford units stronger?

All were welded the same by filling in the valleys of the spiders thus letting the tires roll about a full roatation before they "lock"

Here is some pics for the hell of it.....

http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i137/justinroose/Eldoradoandjeepfrontend034.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i137/justinroose/Spring07031.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i137/justinroose/Spring07046.jpg
http://i71.photobucket.com/albums/i137/justinroose/100_0071.jpg

[JoshH]

Mine turns and it's welded solid. It's a little tough if I'm not moving and my tires are on a hard surface with lots of traction, but I have no problem if I'm rolling even just a little or if the tires are in dirt.

[grand_wag_85]

I see that you're from Nevada, by any chance are you running a power steering cooler? Made a night and day difference on a buddy's CJ-7.

[jtr]

No steering coolers on any of the rigs, mine is sooo bad that I had one hub in, went from gravel to pavement to make a 70 degree turn and it was like the tire was against a huge rock....hope the hydro assist will help.


Really don't want to go back to open diff.....:banghead:

[BassnTruck]

Mine is locked in the front. Turns fine.

[Slick Willie]

What axles are you talking about? My Waggy D44 welded turned fine. Not as good as an open diff, but it still turned ok.

[jtr]

Fords have Dana 44s, the CJ-7 has a wide track Dana 44, and my Waggy has a Ford Dana 60.

Maybe the pumps on the Jeeps are on the way out?

[LTS06]

I have waggy 44's in my '98 XJ with full spools front and rear on 33's. Somewhat tough when sitting still BUT turns just fine otherwise with both hubs locked in. Of course I bent the tie rod and drag link...both also waggy parts. But it goes down the road straighter now believe it or not.

[scotty]

All were welded the same by filling in the valleys of the spiders thus letting the tires roll about a full roatation before they "lock"



you have made the spiders very brittle by doing it this way. im surprised they havent shattered on you allready. most reports i hear of doing this in itty bitty 44 spiders results in an internal explosion of spider gear the first time you put any real stress on em :eek:

even in bigger axles like the 14 bolt it doesnt last. longest report ive heard is one guy who ran it like that for almost 2 years,but they eventually shattered just the same.

as for your fords turning any easier,i couldnt imagine it. the steering box is prolly not any different,but i guess the pump could be. it would be easy enuff to swap one of them onto a jeep and check that out :)

any of you guys claiming that your welded fronts turn ok,i have trouble imagining that,too unless its muddy or youve got small tires. i couldnt hardly turn my 38s with a welded front while sitting still on hardpack dirt,let alone anything with traction :eek: it was ok in the mud,but really sucked everywhere else without a ram assist.

[Slick Willie]

Well, to clarify, I had 34" Swampers with full tread, a W/T D44, and it turned fine while moving. Turning sitting still was difficult for me open or welded. Even turning while moving was not as easy as stock, but it wasn't that bad IMO. The turning radius was much worse. But when moving over ~3 mph, locked in 4wd, trying to turn wasn't that bad. Hard dirt, soft dirt, solid rock, etc.

[jeepbob]

When welding spider gears, they become brittle, however if you also weld the side gears to the diff carrier then they ahey the whole asm is much stronger. As far as turning goes, are you sure the welds have not broken or the hubs are working. I have seen welded spiders actually mash a soft weld over and act just like an open diff. Welding the spiders is called a 1 tooth rock and even wih light cars running slicks will break those. If you really want to have extra traction in the front, spend the bucks and get a Detriot locker or other device for job. Weld jobs work well for the rear unless you are on ice and I have used them on race and demo cars for years, Ieven have one that has been in 15 or 16 demo cars because it has been stress tested and it's easier to change out than to do up another one. I would never put onr in the front as you put an undue strain on the whole drivetrain. Just try to drive an old Wag with a D20 on dry pavement with every thing locked up. They will go about 25 in low range, but if you drop 2 tires onto a gravel shoulderthey will run about 30 mph and will actullay turn. Of couse there are a couple of FSJers that know my driving style is no lockers, just an ancient power lock posi with a couple extra clutch plates and a heavy foot. My CJ has only open diffs and people swear it has lockers. Of course the secret weapon there is a weak frame from good old Mi salt so the tires mostly stay on the ground and the loud pedal over comes the open diffs. Whell that is my $2 bucks worth and I will shut up.

[Sambo]

was this on "both" jeeps or just the cj?

i was thinking wheelbase might come into play,but if it was both then my idea
was like a fart in a dust storm!

btw my d44's were both welded for 3 yrs before they exploded running 38's:thumbsup: