1 Ton GM Question

[1977Waggy]

What did GM put in the front of their 1 Ton trucks prior to 1977? All the information I have found is that they put a Dana 60 in in 1977, so what did they use prior to that?

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/60_front/

Charles

[FSJeeper]

What did GM put in the front of their 1 Ton trucks prior to 1977? All the information I have found is that they put a Dana 60 in in 1977, so what did they use prior to that?

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/60_front/

Charles

A HD dually version of the Dana 44. Axle tube was 1/2" thick, hubs had bigger bearings and it had much larger brakes than a standard Dana 44.

[1977Waggy]

Could a HD D44 that had a flange on it be converted to lock out hubs?

I will take a picture this afternoon.

Charles

[1977Waggy]

Here is what I have, Can I put a lock out hub on it?

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h258/1981cj7/HD44DFront.jpg

Charles

[Crazy_Jeepman]

Yes you can, it will be an external style hub. I consider them Junk but they will do in a pinch. I probally have a few around here.

[1977Waggy]

Junk huh, that sucks. When I went out to see this, I was misled into thinking it was one ton stuff. He made me a good deal so I went ahead and picked this up with a 14 Bolt. Oh well, I will make due.

Let me know if you have a set and would be willing to part with the junk cheap.

Charles

[1977Waggy]

If I was running a D300, could I just leave it flanged?

Charles

[Crazy_Jeepman]

Probally could leave it flanged if you are not driving it lots of miles, even then you could, it would be just wear and tear on everything for no reason. You can swap the whole hub ASSY on that axle and go internal style. I believe the Hubs on your 77 will be small bearing but if you were to get a set of hubs off a newer Chevy or FSJ they would swap.

[KaiserMan]

I have to say that Pete is exaggerating a little bit. External hubs aren't junk. They just aren't as strong as internal hubs. They will hold up okay. I'd just go with a good quality set. If you can get some Spicer hubs, I doubt they will ever break.

[1977Waggy]

Thanks KaiserMan. I will have to look into that.

Charles

[1977Waggy]

Here are some tags:

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h258/1981cj7/14BoltHD44/HD44Ratio.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h258/1981cj7/14BoltHD44/HD44.jpg

It sure is wide enough.

Charles

[Brad W.]

if you swap that rear end to SRW hubs, go to a yard and get some non-dually spindles/hubs/rotors from a J-20, or a 3/4 ton chevy. both the D44 and 10-bolt hubs will work, just make sure it's non-dually and 8-lug.

When you get parts, you basically want everything from the knuckle out. Spindle, hub assembly, rotors (you can of course get new rotors at parts store), lockout hubs, etc. You may also want to get the axle stub shaft, i'm not sure if they are different length/splines. If you do not have flat-top knuckles, and your donor axle has them, you may want to snag them and have them machined and tapped for high steer.

You should be able to buy all of this new as well, just expect it to be expensive. you are seeking 80-86 GM 3/4 tons, or 70's & 80's J-20's. Also, do yourself a favor and upgrade the u-joints to the spicers with the bushings inside, they are far nicer than the old needle bearing joints.

[1977Waggy]

Brad, that is the information I was looking for. I truly appreciate your input.

Charles

[Brad W.]

FYI- use these to get new rotors, hubs, and save some money. Looks like they might even include the studs and be pressed together already.

This is a great deal over used crap:
hub/rotor assembly:
http://www.partsamerica.com/ProductDetail.aspx?mfrcode=RAY&mfrpartnumber=56287&parttype=221&ptset=A

spindles are harder to find, but I know they are out there, try napa. You can also pull any late 70's or 80's 4wd chevy or j-truck/cherokee/wagoneer spindle and use that (from a truck with internal hubs).

you can use standard 1/2 and 3/4 ton truck lockout hubs. Warn are the most prevalent in the market, but any will do.

[Crazy_Jeepman]

I have to say that Pete is exaggerating a little bit. External hubs aren't junk. They just aren't as strong as internal hubs. They will hold up okay. I'd just go with a good quality set. If you can get some Spicer hubs, I doubt they will ever break.

I have Coffee Cans full of broken ones........... I ran enough of them to know............YUP they are JUNK ;)

[welchct]

I reasently started at Skidz off road. We curently are working on a 1/2 ton chevy short wide for a customer I beleve it is a 79. Any way the guy wanted us to put a 205 in place of the 203 and put in a set of "one tons" he had at his house out of an old farm truck. He brought them in, and I was like Great Googley MoogleyGreat Googley MoogleyGreat Googley Moogley is that? so to find out its a HD44 out of a pre 77 one tone 4x4. We were able to find some warn premiam hubs for it but I think Skid had a hell of time finding them.

Any way I beleve that just about all the parts on thouse axle is hard to find and in my opinion it would be better to sell it and get a KP dana 60... you will be time and money a head.

If you need me too I can get you a part # for the hubs.

[1977Waggy]

Is this D44 set up for a dually truck?

Charles

[Crazy_Jeepman]

Is this D44 set up for a dually truck?

Charles

Don't look like it to me.
These are Dana 60 Hubs, but I would suspect the 44 would need to be similar
http://www.crazy-jeepman.com/Tech/DuallySingleHub.JPG

[Bama Burden]

Don't look like it to me.
There are Dana 60 Hubs, but I would suspect the 44 would need to be similar

You are correct

[Crazy_Jeepman]

You are correct
http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/60_front/DRW_hub_mounted_small.jpg (http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/60_front/DRW%20hub%20mounted.jpg)

Well that is just another Pic of a Dana 60 Hub, I am not sure the 44 is setup the same as that.

[Bama Burden]

sorry, missed the KP when I posted that pic. Pic from Elliot's DRW Jeep page shows an adapter:
http://www.ee.nmt.edu/%7Eoffroad/tech/images/7/72/D44DRWAdaptor-2.jpg

[Brad W.]

FYI-- The GM non-dually front dana 60's measure 69.5" WMS to WMS, so i'm guessing that the D44 is a single wheel because the WMS is so close. Those brakes/hubs don't look dually to me either (look like the new rotors in my link, but with internal hubs), leading me to think the rear end has dually wheel plates from some other axle, which don't really go to it. Throw them on the shelf and forget them.

Honestly, just get 80's spindles (big bearing) and the hubs/rotors I linked, and use the waggy calipers you already have. You may want to check the caliper mounting bracket on the 80's donor truck against yours, they may or may not be the same. If they are not, you will need to use the 80's brackets to match the new hubs. I'm betting they are the same though, but check it anyway.

[1977Waggy]

Well, I am very glad these axles are for a SRW vehicle. I can't wait to get them under my ride. The D44 will do for now until I find that magical D60 everyone is looking for.

Thanks for all the input.

I will post up pics once I have the freshened up a bit and under the ride.

Charles

[Brad W.]

honestly, if you're only building a mild rig, you probably dont need to get a front D60. The HD44 can take quite a bit of abuse.

[scotty]

Yes you can, it will be an external style hub. I consider them Junk .

If I was running a D300, could I just leave it flanged?

i just wanted to point out that while the external lockouts may not be so great,that the drive flanges that are on it are plenty strong,and leaving it flanged will make it no different than any newer XJ,YJ,TJ,etc. that comes with the unit bearing hubs. everything in the front axle,including the front driveshaft,spins on these vehicles all the time. its also the same as any 80+ FSJ thats got the 229. they have factory drive flanges and everything spinning in 2wd.

while there may be a slight amount of extra wear,or drop in mileage,its really an insignificant amount,and youd prolly barely notice the difference in mileage,and it would take many thousands of miles to wear it out if you keep it greased and lubed the way it should be.

definately no harm in runnin it with the flanges indefinately,or until you come across a set of internal mount hugs to swap on :)

[Elliott]

sorry, missed the KP when I posted that pic. Pic from Elliot's DRW Jeep page shows an adapter:
http://www.ee.nmt.edu/%7Eoffroad/tech/images/7/72/D44DRWAdaptor-2.jpg

That site has been terminated.:( I can add another link here in a bit.


http://www.fullsizejeeps.com/gallery/albums/userpics/10016/D44DRWAdaptor-2.jpg

[KaiserMan]

That site has been terminated.:( I can add another link here in a bit.

:( What happend?

[Bama Burden]

http://i.imdb.com/Photos/Ss/0088247/th-Terminator_PUB01.jpg (http://us.imdb.com/gallery/ss/0088247/Ss/0088247/Terminator_PUB01.jpg.html?hint=group)

He did it

[Elliott]

:( What happend?
I couldn't tell you exactly... but the entire site is gone. I do have everything saved from the Dually Registry, so when I find a new home for it I'll put it back together.

[1977Waggy]

while there may be a slight amount of extra wear,or drop in mileage,its really an insignificant amount

definately no harm in runnin it with the flanges indefinately,or until you come across a set of internal mount hugs to swap on :)

So the D300 would not experience extra wear with the front driveshaft constantly spinning? If that's the case, I will probably do that.

That said I found a 10 bolt under a 3/4 ton suburban today. I asked the mechanic if he would part with the components from the knuckles out. I told him I would give him my parts and some money so someone could still use the axle if he sold the vehicle. He said he would think about it.

Charles

[scotty]

So the D300 would not experience extra wear with the front driveshaft constantly spinning?

maybe slightly faster wear,not enuff to worry about IMO. just make sure you keep the oil full

[1977Waggy]

Well, I think I am going to try and make a trade with the mechanic. I am going to see if he will trade me the outers from his 3/4 ton 10 bolt for my outers and a 9" from a gran torino. I think I would rather have lock-outs than drive with the flange. However, if he will not trade with me, I will just run the drive flange until I work something out. I have two D300 so if one wears out I can use the other. Thanks again for all the input.

Charles