Ideas, pics or suggestions for non-chop top cage?

[BigRedChief]

After seeing the aftermath of Orangecherokee's rollover and others' flops, I'm concerned about the structural integrity of the top of my Jeep. It's relatively low compared to others with only a 4" lift and 33's, but I've had it in tippy feeling situations already and been nervous (apparently for good reason!). I've been poking around here and elsewhere for ideas, but I'm not having a lot of luck yet. I'll probably find exactly what I'm looking for right after I post this. :rolleyes:

I want to install a cage that will help retain the interior volume of the main cab of the Jeep in the event of a rollover, but I don't want to chop the top. I want to have access to the rear seats for passengers. I'd like to have four point harnesses for the driver and passenger and possibly for the rear bench too. Are there existing designs out there that would acompish this, or am I on my own?

[orangecherokee]

Killer32Fab used to make interior cages and I've heard of people adapting XJ cages. I think for the best results you'll need to design your own. I would definitely go with a 6 point or better. When it comes to safety overkill can't hurt.

[FSJeeper]

Killer32Fab used to make interior cages and I've heard of people adapting XJ cages. I think for the best results you'll need to design your own. I would definitely go with a 6 point or better. When it comes to safety overkill can't hurt.

Speaking of course from the voice of direct hands on roll over experience!

[83waggy]

i would definitely suggest a cage if you wheel much, the roof may be strong but these things are heavy as ****, mine fell on its side (maybe a 2-3 foot fall) and it pushed the whole thing over a few inches, no telling what it would do if i rolled all the way. Ill be going chop-top with a cage but i know that isnt for everyone. Good luck with yours.

here is some info i found on here http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=53220&page=2&highlight=roll+cage
the 6 point there seems to be a good design but you'd have to stretch it if you still want to use the back seat.

[Merc69]

There are no commercial cages for our rigs. The link on the cages were designed by me for fun. I have not had time to complete my cage but have worked out a design that I really like and have had it checked out by a local SCCA tech official and he approves.

You can look at materials including DOM (expensive) or HERW (welded seam and less expensive) 1.75" diameter tube with .120 wall thickness appears to be the most common and with a proper design plenty strong.

Also look at having the seats tied into the cage with the harness attached to the cage.

[BigRedChief]

I'm starting to see a lot of dilemas and potential compromises...

I'd like to retain as much utility and interrior space as possible and still have a functional 6 point cage. I don't want to make this thing a buggy, but I want good rollover protection.

I don't really want to remove ALL of my interior, including the dash, but I might have to if I want to be able to work on it later (and if I want to keep from burning holes in my new ProComp seats). If I don't remove the dash I might have problems if I ever do have to remove it later. If I do remove it I might take an idea I've seen in prerunner trucks and weld plate between the cage and a-pillars.

Something like this (sorry for the huge pic -it's not mine):
http://www.desertrides.com/forum/files/chevy_010.jpg

[BigRedChief]

I forgot to mention... I have a buddy who owns a bender and a 1.5" round tube die (and a 1" square die). If I want to do any other tube size I'd have to put in some extra cash to get the die or buy my own bender. He also has a tig welder and a 220V Mig which could come in handy.

[etjeep]

Big Red,
A buddy of mine did the fab work on the cage I have in my rig. Its .120 wall DOM tubing 1.75" diam, 8 point tied to the frame. Here are the pics. http://rides.webshots.com/album/463736354rVDTIE

I decided to trash the headliner because it was ratty. Also I am 6'-6" so I picked up a little room to push the cage up. A new headliner will not make my top 10 list of to dos this year as I have a few other things I want to get done.

I have padding that will go on later. I just use the stock shoulder harness in the front and the lap belt in the rear. I may do something with the rear belts so my kid can use a shoulder harness with his car seat. I don't know how you would do a four point harness, I suppose you could add more bars. This will give you a better (IMO) starting point.

I have no regrets but I will mention that I do have to open the door slightly to get my hand fully on the window crank, but its no big deal to me.

[BigRedChief]

What's the advantage to tying to the frame? It seems like it defeats the purpose of having body mounts. Do you feel a lot more vibration and/or hear more engine noise? It's not like these things are quiet in the first place, I guess...

Heh... My headliner is falling down, so removing it has been on my list of things to do. I don't know if I'll put up another one or just leave it. Depends on what's underneath, I guess.

Part of my thinking on the 4-points comes from my dad. He did some rollover crash testing with military vehicles that have 3-point belts. Basically, they did nothing to keep the passengers in place during the roll. I guess that's pretty standard findings for those types of belts.

I like the perimeter cage like that. I was starting to envision all these bars going through my cab like a little boxed in jungle-gym.

[etjeep]

What's the advantage to tying to the frame? It seems like it defeats the purpose of having body mounts. Do you feel a lot more vibration and/or hear more engine noise? It's not like these things are quiet in the first place, I guess....

Safety....The frame becomes the bottom part of the cage. You can't rely on anything bolted to the body for protection. Theoretically, tying the cage into the frame limits flex by making everything more rigid but I did not do a before and after flex test...I did not notice any difference in flex or more noise or vibration.

Heh... My headliner is falling down, so removing it has been on my list of things to do. I don't know if I'll put up another one or just leave it. Depends on what's underneath, I guess.....

Function before beauty....

Part of my thinking on the 4-points comes from my dad. He did some rollover crash testing with military vehicles that have 3-point belts. Basically, they did nothing to keep the passengers in place during the roll. I guess that's pretty standard findings for those types of belts. .....

I am sure they are better as your data suggests, I just have not done anything with the belts.

I like the perimeter cage like that. I was starting to envision all these bars going through my cab like a little boxed in jungle-gym.
You need some triangulation to provide lateral support to the cage to prevent it from collapsing in a rollover. Others I have seen have more triangulation and this is a case where more is probably better, but I have no idea how much is ideal. I have a cross bar at the dash and angled bars in the rear compartment....and I feel this is adequate for my intended use. You may plan to use it differently and require more (such as in a race car application).

[jode]

Big Red,
A buddy of mine did the fab work on the cage I have in my rig. Its .120 wall DOM tubing 1.75" diam, 8 point tied to the frame. Here are the pics. http://rides.webshots.com/album/463736354rVDTIE


Sweet rig and nice cage - was it welded up in place? How did you get to the tops of the tubes to weld them?

[etjeep]

Thanks. As I said, my buddy did the fabrication. He just cut round holes in the floor where the tubes pass thru, let it drop down where he could weld the top. After the cage was welded, it was raised up and the outriggers tying the cage to the frame were done last.

[jode]

Ahhh - good thinking. ;)

[FSJeep80]

Eric,nice cage. Looks well thought out.
Big Red,one thing to think about is that you probably won`t be wearing a helmet when you`re wheeling or driving it on the street. Depending on your height this may be more or less of an issue but make sure you have PLENTY of room between the cage and your noggin. A friend of mine was parylized from just hitting his head hard against the side window in an accident. That made me a little paranoid about it. It`s one reason I went with an exo on the truggy. My head gets close enough to the top of the door frame I occasionally hit it. If there was a tube there I`d be hitting my head on it all the time. If you don`t wheel it really hardcore a good sturdy 4pt. roll bar welded to the frame with a rear X or diagonal may be all you really need. If you do you might be better served by an exo (unless you don`t care much about the body). Glad we had the exo and no sheetmetal for this one. :) It stood almost straight up on it`s nose before it flopped back down like you see it. If it had gone all the way over it`s about 30ft. more to the bottom... FSJeep80

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v705/MarcusUSA1/pictures002.jpg

[BigRedChief]

I've been looking into designs and options and I'm starting to wonder if I might just be being paranoid. I'm not planning on getting this thing any higher. The 33's and 4-inch lift have gotten me anywhere I've wanted to go so far. It got exciting a couple of times, but for the most part the jeep has felt very stable on the trails. I might just stay away from the trails where there's major rollover risk unless or until I'm in a fully caged rock buggy. I've got a couple of mountain bikes, KTM520SX and an XR600 to go on the really crazy trails. :thumbsup:

[AlsChopShop]

i'm going with a cage at some point, already had my bud that does race car cages take a look. basically he suggested a front hoop along a-pilliars with a bar accross the top of the dash, second hoop is just in front of the rear wheel well, third hoop angled along the back. all tied in on top and a tie in bar for the c and b hoops horizontal just on top the wheel well. he said it would be good to do door bars but i don't want the hassel of climbing in and out around them.

also i'll have a few grab handles around like on the a-pillars and in back, don't want the passangers grabbing the main roll bars and getting their fingers removed on a rollover.

Al