JP mag and SOA nix [Archive] - International Full Size Jeep Association

J10-401

07-06-2006, 09:33 PM

Anyone see the JP article on how SOA is no good? My J-10 has SOA in the back. Are they off-base or would it be better to change over to springs under the axle when I pull the axle to build a disc-brake conversion? I know you guys take JP with a grain of salt - so what's the story?

J10Mike

07-06-2006, 09:50 PM

Like you mentioned, I take JP with a grain of salt. I would leave your SOA rear the way it is.
BTW, you will really like those rear disks.

jeepsr4ever

07-06-2006, 09:59 PM

In some applications where wheelbase, spring width and center of gravity have a key value that make for a unsafe Jeep. Their are alot of applications where spring over is not adventageous. Alot of JP mag is comprised of articles for the mainstream audience. Their are some materials in there that still are nice to read even if your hardcore.

Hey Mike pass the salt

Gambler68

07-06-2006, 10:06 PM

Their are some materials in there that still are nice to read even if your hardcore.

I make hardcore, not read it! :thumbsup:

Yeah..I buy it once or twice a year when something looks interesting, but there's nothing there for 5 bux you cant find here...besides Bree :D

Dmntxn77

07-06-2006, 10:09 PM

jusgivmesom

07-06-2006, 10:17 PM

Stuka

07-06-2006, 10:45 PM

Also keep in mind all baby jeeps (which is what JP mostly covers) are SUA front and rear from the factory.

james1414d

07-07-2006, 12:36 AM

I've spent some time in new dakotas. customers compain of a choppy/rough ride. when I called chrysler on the issue, they say there isn't a fix and that its due to the SUA. when I asked why it was engineered that way, they claimed it was due to spring wrap. bottom line is there's no action without reaction. a lot of time is spent engineering vehicles, even ours as old as they are, and I think you would be giving too much up doing a SUA on your J. to sum though, I read that article and it seemed like they were trying to sell lift kits, sort of an advertisment as much of there mag is in my opinion.

Twinpinion

07-07-2006, 06:43 AM

Blah, Blah, Blah... Thats pretty dumb to say that cut and dry... In some applications it can cause issues such as axle wrap, ect.. But to say it is just no good is retarted...

Keep your truck the way it is... Its been working for the last 22 years, I dont know why it would start causing you problems now just because JP said its no good...

More salt please...

Wow, nice that you seem to comment on a story you never even read. Try checkin' it out before making worthless comments.

Basically, the story explains many of the problems accociated with a spring over conversion (not factory setups) in the rear and one way to fix them.

orangecherokee

07-07-2006, 06:51 AM

Twinpinion

07-07-2006, 06:57 AM

John, I read it in the grocery store while my wife was shopping and what you say is true. It's not that it's claiming it's crap but once you read a few bad things in starts to put a spin on the article. that's just my thoughts.

on a side note, i thought you'd be gone by now. I figured you signed up just for HotDog when you were building it and then trying to sell it. :rolleyes: Anyway, good to see you haven't changed much either. :D

Nah, I'm around. Everywhere. I was here a year or two before I even owned the Hotdog. I still own the '87 J-20. It's lifted now. Four inches with 37s...cleanly! In the next couple issues.

I'm still looking (dreaming) for a stepside shortbed with a V-8 and a manual tranny. A smog exempt one, gawd this '87 is choked down.

Oh, and I got the ultimate FSJ now too! An M35A2!

orangecherokee

07-07-2006, 07:02 AM

nice. you know you can always post up pics here. i know that the mag might not appreciate it but after the story's out it ends up on the skin-terweb anyhow. :fsj:

will e

07-07-2006, 07:30 AM

I read the article twice. The information about the torque difference is right on. I got the impression it was for conversions too. I guess SOA is a cheap way to get lift on the smaller jeeps in the rear. Some yahoo's probably add blocks too. The stock springs on the baby jeeps isn't expecting that. I thought it was pretty good.

I thought Vern was pretty funny this month too. Something about claiming ownership of certain words. Ford is doing this with Mustang. Making all of the aftermarket companies change their name to not include Mustang or Pony. Pretty dumb.

Grimjaw

07-07-2006, 07:47 AM

I subscribe to JP magazine and like it for the most part (aside from Bree). I read the article and saw merit in what was said. Do I think my rear axle will fall off, no. On the other hand I plan on adding anti-wrap bars once I swap in the 14BFF. This will make sure I do no have any issue with axle wrap after I drop in the diesel.

So far I really like a anti-wrap, axle truss and shock relocation set up from DIY4X. Here is a link to the Wraptor.

http://coloradok5.com/forums/showthread.php?t=177780

Currently I find JP magazine more helpful than FSJ magazine....

Dmntxn77

07-07-2006, 09:22 AM

Wow, nice that you seem to comment on a story you never even read. Try checkin' it out before making worthless comments.

Basically, the story explains many of the problems accociated with a spring over conversion (not factory setups) in the rear and one way to fix them.

Yeah Cappa, I should read the article before I comment on it.. I still stand by what I said though. If the article says that they suck... cut and dry... then it is retarted. If is more like you said, then it sounds like it could be a decent read...

And, I got a question for ya.... How come you only pop up here when someone bashes on JP? I havent seen you post since you were selling the J20... :confused: It makes us feel special to chat with someone famous... :D

Kali

07-07-2006, 10:37 AM

Now im confused... arent FSJs SOA in the rear from the factory?

Twinpinion

07-07-2006, 11:00 AM

Yeah Cappa, I should read the article before I comment on it.. I still stand by what I said though. If the article says that they suck... cut and dry... then it is retarted. If is more like you said, then it sounds like it could be a decent read...

And, I got a question for ya.... How come you only pop up here when someone bashes on JP? I havent seen you post since you were selling the J20... :confused: It makes us feel special to chat with someone famous... :D

First: It doesn't say that they plain suck. It shows that for some applications they suck and that there is a better way. We've run both SOA and SUA on lots of different Jeeps, we know how to weld (so don't bother), and we have a lot of seat time in these Jeeps. A traction bar binds the suspension. I don't care what kind of wacky linkage you attach to it. Don't believe me? Try and remove your traction bar while your Jeep's suspension is articulated. The bolts ain't gonna budge. You will (eventually) break or bend a spring, traction bar, or the mounts. If you haven't, then you haven't driven it enough yet. Go out and put in some more seat time. There is one way to do it that works well without binding but it involves building a four-link to locate the axle and running shackles on both ends of the leaf springs. This is an extremely stable suspension and very predictable unlike some coil setups. The fact is that a SOA conversion is not ideal. There are a lot of compromises to get that kind of lift. That's what the story is about.

Second: I ain't famous. I don't rub elbows or another body part with people from Hollyweird and I put my pants on one leg at a time just like you.

Third: Yep, been gone fer a little while but I been on here long before I bought the Hotdog and even after I sold it. Look it up! I have a job and my own website to work on, not to mention my other hobbies...geez!

If you want something to hate me for, get mad about, or just bash on me, talk about the fact that I kill squirrels in my yard with extreme prejudice. This other stuff is just silly and unfounded.

El Jefe

07-07-2006, 11:01 AM

Now im confused... arent FSJs SOA in the rear from the factory?

all the ones i know of are.

Twinpinion

07-07-2006, 11:05 AM

all the ones i know of are.

The story is about small Jeeps and Conversions. Not so much about factory SOA but there is some good info.

funhog

07-07-2006, 11:21 AM

It's kind on funny that if they made the SOA look easy and a fix all a bunch of people on here would jump on them for that also. I read the article and it said alot of the same stuff that is posted on here when the subject comes up.

Dmntxn77

07-07-2006, 11:28 AM

First: It doesn't say that they plain suck. It shows that for some applications they suck and that there is a better way. We've run both SOA and SUA on lots of different Jeeps, we know how to weld (so don't bother), and we have a lot of seat time in these Jeeps. A traction bar binds the suspension. I don't care what kind of wacky linkage you attach to it. Don't believe me? Try and remove your traction bar while your Jeep's suspension is articulated. The bolts ain't gonna budge. You will (eventually) break or bend a spring, traction bar, or the mounts. If you haven't, then you haven't driven it enough yet. Go out and put in some more seat time. There is one way to do it that works well without binding but it involves building a four-link to locate the axle and running shackles on both ends of the leaf springs. This is an extremely stable suspension and very predictable unlike some coil setups. The fact is that a SOA conversion is not ideal. There are a lot of compromises to get that kind of lift. That's what the story is about.

Second: I ain't famous. I don't rub elbows or another body part with people from Hollyweird and I put my pants on one leg at a time just like you.

Third: Yep, been gone fer a little while but I been on here long before I bought the Hotdog and even after I sold it. Look it up! I have a job and my own website to work on, not to mention my other hobbies...geez!

If you want something to hate me for, get mad about, or just bash on me, talk about the fact that I kill squirrels in my yard with extreme prejudice. This other stuff is just silly and unfounded.

WFT man... You need to lay off the coffee... I wasnt bashing anyone.. In fact, I agreed with you that I should read the article, and maybe I will.. As far as you posting on here... Whatever... I wasnt bashing there either... I said that I havent seen you post since you were selling the J20.. Well, bud, that is a FACT... I personally dont recall seeing you since then... Maybe you have been, maybe you havent... Who really cares??? I dont, I was just posting an observation...

And yeah, I know you are not famous... Did you see the :D?? It was a joke... That is what these :D :o :eek: :( :) :rolleyes: faces are for.. So that even the most humorless can be dirrected to the humor... I guess it didnt work for you...

IMO you need to sit back, relax, and take you blood pressure pills. If you go through life like this :banghead:, you will die young.. (did you see that, it was another smilie... it adds humor...)

Slick Willie

07-07-2006, 12:19 PM

Dang, for real. The posts here were nice. Relax man. I don't like Dmntxn77 either, but I wait for better opportunities to bash him. :D

4x4fEvEr

07-07-2006, 06:20 PM

that was a good article and of course it wasnt referring to a stock vehicle having SOA just for conversions

if anyone did read the article and was open minded then they could probably concieve that hey maybe SOA isnt all its cracked up to be for my factory SUA suspension setup.

ive never really been interested in doing a SOA and that article just confirmed for me that i will never spring over any jeep i own, you shouldnt have to with all the wonderfulness of aftermarket suspension companies,but thats just me :D .

rockjeep44

07-08-2006, 10:54 AM

This thread sucks.

On another note, did y'all see that abortion that Petersen's 4Wheel put on the cover of their latest edition. That rag sucks so bad. It's a Suburban on Rockwells and 53s. Ok, cool enough. But wait, it's open front and rear, retained the rockwell drum brakes, has huge *** leaf springs front and rear, the guy still built a 4-link (if you can call it that) in the rear, and runs coilovers on the front to control axle wrap. Wow.

Cappa, whoever made the call to put that piece of **** on the cover, punch in the face for me.