T18 Wide Or Close?

[Tubro]

I am looking at a 79 J10 with a four speed. This would have to be a t18 right? Were they all Wide ratios or are there Wide and Close. My scout has a close ratio T18-C and the reverse is over and up. This one is over and down. I have heard this is a way to tell close from wide. If it is a T18A I am swapping it into my CJ and putting my T150 into the J10, then its going to my brother. I don't need another J10.

Plus what about a T5 swap from a later CJ or Cherokee into my J10. It is just for the street really and I want to be able to cruise down the interstate without the engine screaming. I have a 79 J10 with 258/D20 xfer. The t5 bolts to a Dana 300 right? Can I buy an adapter?

Thanks
Brian Renfro

------------------
79 Wagoneer 360,TH400,QT,D44,AMC20 Never have I driven yet 79 J-10,258,T150,D20,D44 79 CJ5,258,T150,2 1/2" Superlift, 33"BFG AT/TA
63 IHC Scout

[scotty]

yes,it should be a t18a in 79.the reverse position has nothing to do with the ratio.my 82 t18a had reverse over and down.my 77 t18a has reverse over and up.both are wide ratio,6.39 first.to my knowledge a FSJ never got the close ratio version,only cjs got that one. what engine is in the parst truck? if its a v8 the tranny will have a big spacer between the bellhousing and tranny to make up for the v8s forward position in the engine compt. installing this long tranny in a cj is gonna make for some real short driveshafts. you can put a 6 cyl version into a cj since it is a good 8 inches or so shorter,but even that is longer than what is normally installed in a cj.the cjs got a real short belhousing.

the cj and fsj have different dana 20 shifters. youll need to use the cj dana 20 with the fsj tranny in a cj and vice versa. installing a short t150 into a j10 with a v8 will prolly put the shifters under the firewall,since it is so much shorter.

last and not least,later cjs came with a t5 and dana 300.if the t5 comes from an xj,im not real sure if its any different,lengthwise,but it will prolly have a 231 xfer attaced,which uses the same 23 spline output and circular mountig pattern as the d300.no adapters neccessary.again,length differences may cause shifter placement problems,but i dont think so,especially behind a six. a t5/208 was available in the 82-83 fsjs,so hopefully it would work. the stock d300 shifter will prolly be real close to the seats,tho,if you get the curry twin stick kit,you can move the shifters out to the furthest forward position,which should make it ok.

the t5/d300 would be a neat combo,IMO,especially since the twin stick will give you a rwd and fwd low range.however,the t5 is a light duty tranny,but in a street driven truck,should last awhaile,if youre nice to it,and the 5th will help if youve got some really low axle gears http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

hope this helps.

------------------
scott
85 grand wagoneer
258 with motorcraft 2bbl/904/twin stick dana 300/dana 44/welded amc 20
38x15.5 gumbo mudders
snorkel/dual batteries/onboard air/"custom" convertable
3 inch body lift/mostly stock suspension/"modified" fender openings
custom front/rear bumpers and brushgaurd

T18/dana-spicer 18 with drum E brake and PTO swap very soon
searching for offset QT rear and PTO winch

[This message has been edited by scotty (edited November 25, 2000).]

[joe]

Brian, assuming it's stock it will be the T18A (wide ratio). The T18 close ratio trans was never used in FSJ's(Cheros and trucks).

------------------
Regards,
-joe
63 2-dr Wag, 73 J-4000, 82 CJ-8

[Tubro]

The donor is a six and so is my CJ. My CJ bellhousing is already drilled for the T18, so it should be just a bolt on, along with the J10

On the T5 swap, I want to keep my dana 20 if possible. I don't want to have to buy a dana 300. If I did go with a 300 how would the mounting be? Actually I will just take the Tranny/bellousing/xfer to the tranny shop and let them worry with it.

[scotty]

it is not possible. if youve ever had a dana 20 off of a tranny,you know that it has a texas shaped mounting pattern,and its input gear remains bolted to the tailshaft of the tranny once the xfer is removed.

the dana 300 has a circular mounting pattern and a 23 spline female input. the price of whatever adapters(if one exists) to use a 20 with a t5 are not worth it,even if the t5 was a strong,heavy duty tranny worth spending it on. given the marginal strength of the t5,and the fact that the d300 is a much nicer xfer that can be used in other combinations make this money not well spent IMO.

are you sure that your present bellhosuing is the same length,even if it will bolt on? there are several different lengts of input shafts used in varitions of the t18,and it is very important that the input shaft matches the bellhousing.

since you cant buy anyhting from AA for less that $450,for the price of conversion parts for a t5/dana 20 combo you should easily be able to buy a d300,a curry twin stick kit,a gasket and seal kit for the xfer,and prolly still have some left over to go buy some ice cream http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

with the d300 you have an extra .61 of low range,twin stickability,the ability to bolt a Klune v crawler box directly to it,and an xfer that will bolt to a t176,or a 904,as well as the t5 and the even lesser duty t4,sr4,and possibly some other manuals used in later xj/tj/yj jeeps.

maybe the low range,twin sticks,aftermarket 4 to 1 low range gear sets,or a Klune V dont interest you in a street driven truck,and i cant blame you,i dont really care about any of it in my j20,either,but youll still come off cheaper buying a d300 and leaving it bone stock than trying to adapt the d20.

any more ques?these are my favorite oes to answer http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/biggrin.gif



------------------
scott
85 grand wagoneer
258 with motorcraft 2bbl/904/twin stick dana 300/dana 44/welded amc 20
38x15.5 gumbo mudders
snorkel/dual batteries/onboard air/"custom" convertable
3 inch body lift/mostly stock suspension/"modified" fender openings
custom front/rear bumpers and brushgaurd

T18/dana-spicer 18 with drum E brake and PTO swap very soon
searching for offset QT rear and PTO winch

[Tubro]

The whole putting the t18 into the CJ length doesn't matter a WHOLE lot. If its only a few inches longer I can shorter the rear driveshaft, and the shifter being back some doesn't matter. I mean I will just swap bellhouseing and all. I have plenty experience with the Dana 20 (including taking it off and haveing the guts of the tranny falling out the back). I Will just swap a 300 in. More than likely when I find the T5 from a CJ it will have the 300 behind it anyway. But back to the t-18 swap. I have a three speed J10 of course, I will measure the bellhousings on my CJ and J10 when I get the J10 back from the shop. If they and up being the same then the four speed bellhousing is probally the same length. I can't see them setting the larger 4 speed back farther from trhe engine than a 3. What I'm dsaying is, if a three speed belhousing is the same in a FSJ and a CJ then the four speed should sit the same or closer to the engine. Agree or not? It just seems to make sense to me the way I am thinking of it.

------------------
79 Wagoneer 360,TH400,QT,D44,AMC20 Never have I driven yet 79 J-10,258,T150,D20,D44 79 CJ5,258,T150,2 1/2" Superlift, 33"BFG AT/TA
63 IHC Scout

[scotty]

yeah,it should be fine.if the truck the t18 comes from is a 6 cyl,the t150 should be ok.it is a couple of inches shorter,but the levers should still come out in a workable spot. not knowing this info in the first response,i was just speculating.if you put the short t150 into a truck with a 360 youd have trouble.

the bellhousings will be close,but the t150 one is alittle shorter,if i remember correctly. the trannies themselves are very different in size.once you look at them next to one another,youll wonder how the t150 never broke.it looks like something youd find in a go cart,or a kids toy in comparison to the massive truck 4 speed. so your tranny shifer should be close to the spot of the original shifer,but your xfer case shifter will still move,and you will need new driveshafts for each vehicle-shorter front and longer rear for the t150 j10,and the opposite for the t18 cj5.

just swap the whole trannies,bellhosuing and all,and youll be fine.the 3 speed belhousing is alittle shorter,not sure how much.

we swapped a 6 cyl t18 into my friends cj5.it is from a 70-something cherokee with a 258. it looks just like my t18,which is from a 77j20 with a 360 excpet that the 6 cyl version has a plate between the tranny and bellhousing thats only about an inch thick.my v8 version has an 8 inch or so spacer betwen the tranny and bellhousing.the bellhousings look the same. if the t18 actually comes from a cj,it will have a completely different bellhousing that is quite a bit shorter.ive seen this version in the jeeps of alot of guys at the local club here.

anyway,we put the 6cyl t18 from a 258 FSJ into my friends cj5.his rear driveshaft is 14 inches long.yours will prolly be shorter,since his is sprung over. his rear u joint angles are horrible,despite severe angling of both the tranny and the rear pinion. he snaps u joints like crazy. it is so bad that hell prolly swap the axles back on top of the springs and run less lift.he wont run bigger than 33s,and you dont need a springover to fit 33s on a cj,so i think it will work out better for him to lower it some.

in his case,we had to cut out alot of floor for the cj shifter to work.but this is prolly since its pointed downward so much.in his case it would have been better to use the FSJ dana 20 and shifter. since you only have a 2 1/2 inch lift,it will prolly not be near so much trouble for you.you can keep the transmission at or near its original location so youll prolly just have to cut back a few inches for the shifter.your driveshaft will be short,but im sure youre angles will be ALOT better. http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

you will love the t18 in your cj. the granny gear is over twice the first in your t150.youll go places with so much more control and less throttle,and much less clutch slipping.the same guy just got a cj7 with a t150/dana 20 and its a night/day difference.

now just hope your brother doesnt have to pull anything much heavier than the truck itself with the 2.99 t150 first gear http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/smile.gif

happy wheelin'


------------------
scott
85 grand wagoneer
258 with motorcraft 2bbl/904/twin stick dana 300/dana 44/welded amc 20
38x15.5 gumbo mudders
snorkel/dual batteries/onboard air/"custom" convertable
3 inch body lift/mostly stock suspension/"modified" fender openings
custom front/rear bumpers and brushgaurd

T18/dana-spicer 18 with drum E brake and PTO swap very soon
searching for offset QT rear and PTO winch


[This message has been edited by scotty (edited November 26, 2000).]