Extended Brakelines

[Manhattan]

From another discussion here (Whats in the Rough Country Lift?) I'm thinking that I'm going to be needing extended brakelines - I've got 3" springs and I'm about put on quick disconnects.

So - Can anyone suggest what lines to buy and where to buy them?

Thanks.

[River Beast]

www.bjsoffroad.com (http://www.bjsoffroad.com)

[Damage, Inc.]

Don't see anything about extended brake lines there...

Try www.rustysoffroad.com--I (http://www.rustysoffroad.com--I) know they have them.

[tjosha]

I read somewhere that front lines for an '82 Chevy 1 ton 2 wheel drive will get you about 6 exta inches. I have bought them but haven't put them on yet. I'm not 100% sure that this works, but sure enough that I spent my own money on them. Hope this helps.

[ May 14, 2003, 01:34 PM: Message edited by: tjosha ]

[orangecherokee]

i think Andrew said the same thing about Chevy van lines or something to that nature. i had a set of skyjacker steel braided jobs but i broke one :mad: anyway, i think i'll go the cheap route next time.

[River Beast]

GM lines work up front... I bought a rear line from Brent at BJ's Offroad

[dnixon]

I bought my SS ones from www.crawltech.com (http://www.crawltech.com) but I believe they just got them from rusty's.. ONLY problem that i had with them is that in the rear they gave me the wrong size fitting... so i had to go and buy an adapter at a local speed shop. The normal parts houses just didn't have them. I don't recall how much they were but they weren't too much.

[tuck]

I don't remember what application mine came off.. .but they're super long rubber lines from napa.. seems like they were a 1 ton 2wd truck or something like that... if you take your line into napa and let them know what you're looking for a lot of the time they can find one that will fit...

[Sitting Bull]

Originally posted by tuck:
[QB]I don't remember what application mine came off.. .but they're super long rubber lines from napa...QB]-----------------------
I'd be careful with the longer rubber lines. The more rubber, the more expansion you will have, therefore the less braking power. Probably not noticable when new, but after a few years they may be undesirable. There is a 4wd place in Roswell that can get the stainless braided brake lines (Turner 4wd) at a good price. I'd still call Brent first, I could have sworn BJ's carried them.

[ May 14, 2003, 05:08 PM: Message edited by: Sitting Bull ]

[robselina]

I got the ones from Rusty for the Wag. They're made by Goodrich and are pretty cheap, like $60 for all three I think. No problems with them. Heck of a lot cheaper than the superlift ones I put on my CJ. They ran like $150 front, $150 rear!

[Manhattan]

I got the price from Brent for the front lines - $110.00. I'm sure they're good but they may be overkill for me. I just want to add a bit of length the lines.

The GM replacement lines seem like a good option. I think I'll take a line off and match it at NAPA.

Thanks for the ideas!

[tuck]

Originally posted by Sitting Bull:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by tuck:
[QB]I don't remember what application mine came off.. .but they're super long rubber lines from napa...QB]-----------------------
I'd be careful with the longer rubber lines. The more rubber, the more expansion you will have, therefore the less braking power. Probably not noticable when new, but after a few years they may be undesirable. There is a 4wd place in Roswell that can get the stainless braided brake lines (Turner 4wd) at a good price. I'd still call Brent first, I could have sworn BJ's carried them.</font>[/QUOTE]I looked into the stainless lines a lot... I decided to go with rubber because I would rather deal with expanding brake lines than broken brake lines. The construction of stainless steel lines is great for street use, and racing, but doesn't hold up so well to twigs, rocks and other trail debris. And for me, it's more cost effective to replace rubber lines than stainless lines.

[Sitting Bull]

Ummm...I think the steel flex lines are still rubber inside with a stainless sheath. The sheath only keeps the rubber inside from bulging. I don't see how having a flexing metal sheath would make them more vulnerable to damage, if anything, they should be much more resistant.

[bvibert]

Originally posted by Sitting Bull:
Ummm...I think the steel flex lines are still rubber inside with a stainless sheath. The sheath only keeps the rubber inside from bulging. I don't see how having a flexing metal sheath would make them more vulnerable to damage, if anything, they should be much more resistant.I agree, I don't see how the sheath could make them worse... Its still the same rubber line, just with the protective, bulge resistant outer stainless steel sheath

[The Anti-Chrysler]

I got a good deal on Pro-comp 3-piece set of lines from Summit for about $90. I could tell that they were a cross reference to fullsize GM.

[blt2krl]

Originally posted by tuck:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Sitting Bull:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by tuck:
[QB]I don't remember what application mine came off.. .but they're super long rubber lines from napa...QB]-----------------------
I'd be careful with the longer rubber lines. The more rubber, the more expansion you will have, therefore the less braking power. Probably not noticable when new, but after a few years they may be undesirable. There is a 4wd place in Roswell that can get the stainless braided brake lines (Turner 4wd) at a good price. I'd still call Brent first, I could have sworn BJ's carried them.</font>[/QUOTE]I looked into the stainless lines a lot... I decided to go with rubber because I would rather deal with expanding brake lines than broken brake lines. The construction of stainless steel lines is great for street use, and racing, but doesn't hold up so well to twigs, rocks and other trail debris. And for me, it's more cost effective to replace rubber lines than stainless lines.</font>[/QUOTE]I'm sorry Tuck you are way out in right feild on tis one. Stainless steel lines are far superior to the factory rubber ones.

[Damage, Inc.]

I've got a question...has anyone here had a brake line break?
I've been driving and racing various vehicles for well over 20 years now and have never, ever had a broken brake line.
If rubber ones were so bad, I doubt they'd be factory on so many vehicles...

[tuck]

I happen to like right field. :D

Seriously, I know you all think I'm an idiot... and you're probably right. However, I think y'all should do some research.

Stainless steel lines aren't just regular rubber lines with stainless on the outside. They are usually (I say usually because I'm sure there's an exception somewhere) plastic/teflon hose wrapped with stainless steel.

IIRC, there are two major faults with their construction and wheelin'.

1. Many of the fittings aren't very secure on the hose. You'll have to research this because it's foggy in my mind. I think some companies like Earl's have better fittings, which of course come at a price. But the general consensus is that you can often pull a stainless line apart from its fittings with your bare hands... Big problem if you have more suspension travel than brake line, or if you snag the line on something.

2. Braided stainless steel is abrasive, and can easily rub through the plastic/teflon hose it surrounds. This could potentially be a problem.

side note- many stainless steel lines aren't DOT approved, for you law abiders. :D

Anyway, the above mentioned problems could be imaginary, or rare cases, and my facts could be wrong. I'm really not sure. But I would certainly like to see a little more research done before someone else tells me to sit on the bench. (continuing the baseball analogy ;) )

My $.02, I built a rig that rarely see streets, and is built for off road use. Rubber seemed to be more forgiving, cheaper and close to the same in performance, until the rubber gets stretched. If my pedal gets really soft, I suppose I could get some new lines.. but since the factory rubber lines lasted 30 years without killing me, I think my current rubber lines will probably last quite a while. $.02

[rockjeep44]

I run rubber, they are cheap and seem to be strong. I let my calipers dangle from them when I do my brakes. I'm not gonna get into which is better because I honestly don't know, all I can say is that I run rubber and I like them.

Originally posted by Damage, Inc.:
I've got a question...has anyone here had a brake line break?
I've been driving and racing various vehicles for well over 20 years now and have never, ever had a broken brake line.
If rubber ones were so bad, I doubt they'd be factory on so many vehicles...I've never had one break but I've seen it several times. A 50,000 scrambler buggy at tellico snagged one on a rock and broke it at Tellico one weekend and looked like a total idiot because all the reds had just run that section with no problems. Also, I've seen a lot of standard factory parts that sucked balls so thats no way to guage anything parts wise.
-Andrew

[Damage, Inc.]

Well you can snag any brake line and break it off. I'm just not buying this 'oh you have to have stainless cuz your rubber ones will swell and break on the trail', and it sounds like bunk to me. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, someone tell me. I have to order extended lines here soon so I want to make an informed decision!! smile.gif
Thanks!!

[Manhattan]

While "the factory", which for the sake of our discussion encompasses all auto manufacturers, does make or use some components that aren't the best of the best available. I've gotta agree with Damage Inc. on this one - if rubber lines were so bad, or prone to excessive stretching, I bet they'd just use the braided steel and pass the cost on to us. Brakes usually aren't the place these guys cut corners - try to find a new car today without disc brakes and ABS.

The steel could be better, but until I enter Bushwood in the Dakar rally or start autocrossing him, it just seems that a new set of longer rubber lines will be a huge improvement over the (now functioning) 15 year-old 138,000 mile lines I'm using.

Anyone know the year and model full-size GM to buy? ... the lines, not the whole truck ;)

[blt2krl]

You guys are missing the point and going off on a tangent about ripping brakelines off. The bottom line is big tires and stock rubber type lines don't like each other. The bradied lines are better because they won't bulge when braking. You can tell an night and day difference between braided and factory at the pedal. I don't know of any Stainless steel lines that aren't DOT approved. The type you describe Tuck sound like the worlds ****tiset braklines ever created. Except maybe some made be someone who is not certified to do so. Rubber lines are great for stock applications but we are not talking stock applications here. he type you describe Tuck sound like the worlds ****tiset braklines ever created.

[blt2krl]

Another thing with longer brakelines the rubber isn't as strong as a shorter piece. Add big tires to that add you will get bulge. That is the major reason the briaded lines are around..

[tuck]

I think this is the page that I remember reading... for anyone who cares..

http://www.shotimes.com/SHO4steelbrakelines.html

[Frankenstien]

Look now with all the talk about upgrading brakes around im here to tell you that if you rebuild your stock set up with quality parts and stainless lines it is awsome. My truck will try and throw you threw the windsheild the brakes are so good. Just replaced all the factory parts. IE Drums, shoes, High performance pads on the front, new booster and stainless lines. Veryy Veryy nice. Oh and Rustys lines are the same as Skyjacker. I did some major research while locating my back fitting they sent me that was wrong. Some trucks have a large nipple in back and some have a small.

[Damage, Inc.]

But it still doesn't answer the question of failing rubber lines. A bulging line does not equal a failed line.
Actually, now that I think about it, it's pretty much a moot point; I don't think they make aftermarket extended rubber lines, do they?

[tuck]

Damage,

I am using rubber lines from Napa. I'm not sure how long they are, but it seems like 26" or so... I guess you could call them extended lines... but they're really just a factory part for a different vehicle.

[blt2krl]

Originally posted by Damage, Inc.:
But it still doesn't answer the question of failing rubber lines. A bulging line does not equal a failed line.
Actually, now that I think about it, it's pretty much a moot point; I don't think they make aftermarket extended rubber lines, do they?It isn't a failer, it is more a overall diminished effectiveness of braking power.

[blt2krl]

Originally posted by tuck:
I think this is the page that I remember reading... for anyone who cares..

http://www.shotimes.com/SHO4steelbrakelines.htmlIneresting article, I don't know if I buy all the info.

[kong]

While we're on the topic of extended lines, Paul you have Revolvers on your rig? With a stainless extended replacement and the axle drop, do you ever run out of brakeline?
I saw on 4wheelparts.com they have FSJ extended brakelines and they also have the 1-ton Chebby extended brakelines. The Chebby is longer, but the same price. I'm wondering if it is overkill.

Thanks,
Kong

[tuck]

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=1108146&highlight=stainless#post1108146

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=85838&highlight=stainless

Here are a couple threads on POR... I guess you believe what you want to believe... I don't think stainless lines are crappy, but if I had them I would definitely keep an eye on them.

[curt]

I've never used braided lines on a 4x4, but have on many street and (road) track cars. major difference at the pedal. Over kill for a car driven to the store and back, major improvement for a race car. I would think that they would be much more durable, as far as damage from obsticals, than rubber.

And no, I have never seen a brake line of any type fail under normal operation. Even the 33 year old ones on my j3000 still work fine. I don't think pulling one off is quite "normal operation". I don't care what you make them out of, hooking them on a rock and trying to drive away is going to mess them up.

My $.02

[Damage, Inc.]

Why is there never an EASY decision?!?!?! :D :D

[blt2krl]

Originally posted by tuck:
http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=1108146&highlight=s tainless#post1108146 (http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=1108146&highlight=stainless#post1108146)

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=85838&highlight=stainless

Here are a couple threads on POR... I guess you believe what you want to believe... I don't think stainless lines are crappy, but if I had them I would definitely keep an eye on them.I see a reacuring theme in tose threads, " snagged on a limb or rock or something else and it ripped the line apart. If it is braided or not no brake line is going to handle that. The SS line pictrued looks nothing like the Rusty's lines I have. Those pictured on POR are cheap version of SS lines.

[blt2krl]

Originally posted by kong:
While we're on the topic of extended lines, Paul you have Revolvers on your rig? With a stainless extended replacement and the axle drop, do you ever run out of brakeline?
I saw on 4wheelparts.com they have FSJ extended brakelines and they also have the 1-ton Chebby extended brakelines. The Chebby is longer, but the same price. I'm wondering if it is overkill.

Thanks,
KongThe Rusty's lines I have for the 6in kit are long. I have no problems at all. My guess is the Chevy ones are real close to the SJ's.

[FYR WOOD]

I know the guy who posted that thread on Pirate. He's a big whiner. My impression of Pirate is that they all like to talk, spend money, and complain. Thats why I'm here and not there. I have Rusty's lines and have NEVER had a problem. And whats funny is I wheel with some of those guys on Pirate who are constantly complaining. My rig comes back in one piece.

Scott

And tuck, what are you doing reading in the Toyota section of Pirate? j/k

[tuck]

Originally posted by FYR WOOD:

And tuck, what are you doing reading in the Toyota section of Pirate? j/kahh shucks.. you caught me. :D

[greasyjeep]

http://www.foothilloffroad.com/fo_products.jsp

These are stainless, but they come in any length you want up to 36" and can have the ends customized. The prices looked pretty fair.

Just for info.

Nave no opinion on the ss vs rubber discussion.

[shimniok]

Thought I'd dig up this old thread and add another data point from a personal real world experience.

I agree, the theme I saw was "tore my SS braided line off with X" whether rock, branch, etc.

I was running Iron Chest and Tin Cup Pass on Saturday with another bbs'er and a rock ripped my RF stainless line off.

It broke at the weakest point (where I had previously broken a line by hand) -- at the point where the line enters the brass banjo fitting. It is basically a super small, delicate brass tube.

I have been researching other options and I notice most of the Chevy lines I have looked at (and the ones that are used on C528/529 calipers that are also found in 80's FSJs) seem to have a lenth of steel(?) tube coming off the banjo. Perhaps the Chevy hoses simply use sturdier material.

http://www.partsamerica.com/product_images/img/ray/bh38059-1.jpg

Also consider that since rubber stretches at least a little, and because the crimps on the rubber lines are quite strong looking (compared to the stainless) perhaps they can indeed withstand a rock hit without being torn loose.

Anyway, my Jeep is now sitting at a hotel in a small town waiting for me to come rescue it. :mad:

Incidentally this is the 3rd brake line I've seen go out this year. The first was in Moab when a tow strap wrapped around Jason's tire and ripped out his line (don't recall if it was stainless but I think so -- not sure anything would withstand that kind of force).

Second was my left front after it wore down from tire contact--- once the stainless braid is no longer in place, the teflon/whatever tube underneath couldn't take the pressure. My fault for not properly retaining the brake lines I guess. Still, seems like they are not very abuse friendly.

So... not a big fan of stainless line anymore, despite the firmer pedal feel. And the $100+ / set is not worth it especially with all the comments about (and now my experience with) durability.

Soon as I find the right hose to use on my 86, I will get rid of the stainless front hoses & also will carry a spare set of hoses at all times.

Michael

[uplandhawaii]

Since this came back up, I'm using chevy lines from Napa, here's some pn's that you can reference. These are mid 80-90's chevy extended brake lines. My lines are the 38872's and are almost 26" long.

NAPA PN's for 10bolt(metric, can be made to fit D44)
Front's 38872(L) 38873(R)-25.875" Square banjo
38622(L) 38623(R)-25.875 Round banjo
31761 -19.875" longer hard line
Rear 38068 -18.00"

[shimniok]

Since this came back up, I'm using chevy lines from Napa, here's some pn's that you can reference. These are mid 80-90's chevy extended brake lines. My lines are the 38872's and are almost 26" long.

NAPA PN's for 10bolt(metric, can be made to fit D44)
Front's 38872(L) 38873(R)-25.875" Square banjo
38622(L) 38623(R)-25.875 Round banjo
31761 -19.875" longer hard line
Rear 38068 -18.00"

Sounds like there are several options for hoses.

The banjo with the 'ears' work too-- as on the 86 Blazer hoses P/N 38059/38061 (19" long) which is what I ended up installing. Only problem with these is clearance at full lock (mentioned above I think).

The G30 hoses would've worked (it has ears on the square banjo) but are a little too long for only 4" lift (they are about 22" long)

Thanks for the additional numbers. Hopefully all this will help the next person that decides to go this route.

Michael