R-12 replacement

[Oracle]

Took my 88 GW to a friends AC guy to have a look. He checked for leaks and filled it up with 409A, Gotta tell you, on the way home I had the AC on low fan, with the temp set in the middle of the scale, i.e right between the blue for cold and red for heat...it got so cold in the front seat I had to turn it off. Man it was COLD!!! Temp outside was high 80's.

This fellow has worked on commercial AC's all his life. According to him, 409A mixxes directly with r-12, no need to change anything. We'll see how it holds up, but MAN, it gets COLD!

[OBX-AUTOMOTIVE]

GUESS WHAT!!!! DON'T LET THE EPA SEE THIS.... CAS IT'S A NO,NO ...NOT FOR AUTOMOTIVE USE!!!!! :eek: :eek: IF THEY COME TO YOUR HOUSE AND TAKE YOU AWAY...CAN I HAVE YOUR FSJ??? :D

[Oracle]

really? LOL, time to check this out smile.gif

[Oracle]

Okey, wanna talk about stupid US govt regulations...guess why its illegal?
the manufacturer has refused to create "custom labels and fittings" ie. ones not compatible with anything else so, the epa refuses to list it, i.e. making it illegal. Hilarious. Absolutely nothing wrong with the stuff, just a "psssssng' contest between epa bureacrats and a manufacturer they want to make jump through hoops.

[Oracle]

Okey, some more info. the epa SAYS that the manufacturer "has expressed a desire to NOT have the 409a used in the auto market'. they are not clear as to how that 'desire' was expressed smile.gif reading their material indicates that the desire was expressed by failing to comply with the epa demands for unique fittings and labels. It IS possible, however, that the manufacturer doesn't want to get involved in the various lawsuits and/or become a target of the global warming psuedo science movement. sooo "officially" i guess i really didn't hear him correctly when I thought I heard what he might have not put into my system, so all that's left for me is to get into the attic and pull out a parka for driving round in my new 88 mobile icebox, er GW smile.gif
in the meantime
'shhhhhhhhhh'

[Justin Fun]

Oracle forgot to mention that we had to stop at WalMart last night and buy a couple of jackets just to sit in the front seat! :eek: Waaaaay too cold!

[Stolen76]

MP66, 404A, 409A, 502A and R22 work well in automotive systems as an R12 replacement. They are not allowed to be used by EPA regs, except in refrigeration units. Any of those work much better with the R12 expansion valve. I'm at that point now with my little rice burner. 25 years of condensation have corroded the valve onto the evaporator, everything works with no leaks but I can't replace the valve without replacing the evap too ! Sooooo.... some of one of the others might slip its way in there. MP66 kicks butt ! It's what they retrofit the ThermoKing refer units with.

[PlumCrazyChris]

Oracle, did he just top off you unit that had "some" R12 in with 409A? Or did he have to evacuate the system, clean it out, etc. before he could use the 409A? If I can top off my weak system with it, that would be great.

I just dread going in to evac. the system, and then HAVE to use R12 or convert it to 134A. Can it be done without the evac. step?

[Oracle]

there was some r-12 left in the system so he did not evac. checked all over for leaks first then started adding in, in stages. added some, checked for leaks, added some, checked for leaks etc. he did change my ac valve covers to something he said would seal the mechanics. All the time he was watching the gauge setup he had monitoring pressures etc.
Course this was in my purely "unofficial''working ac dream' you all understand...as 'Officially', he just waved his hands , said some magic words and POOF it worked smile.gif heheh

[Oracle]

bye the bye, this was the Sanden type unit on an 88 gw.