battery dead in the mornings

[ctjeepman]

Ok-this is getting irritating. I will tell of somethings it was doing on saturday beforehand I don't know if they are relevant or not. I went on a 400 mile roundtrip ride in the beast and there were very loud squeals coming from the passenger side of the engine compartment. They were very intermittant and random but really annoying. I figured it was just the belts and would tighten them up later. Ok- sunday morning I get in and all i have is some clicking noises and battery was only showing 8.8 so I threw some jumper cables on it and charged up the battery but still wouldn't start so I tapped the starter and got it to fire up. I also noticed that the oil had gone down about 3/4 of a quart but I was towing back home a cherokee and sometimes when I tow something that heavy the oil does go down. After I got it started it was squealing for the next 3 hours louder and more frequently than it was on saturday. I came home and tightened up the belts the best I could and figured I would see how I did today on the way to work. went out and nothing-completely dead. I've got the jumpers on it now but it's not working yet and for somereason the wipers are going even though the switch is off. any suggestions let me know or what to look at to figue it out. P.S. It doesn't sound like it is the power steering pump so I've ruled that ut for the squeal I just need to know why it isn't keeping the charge?

[kyjman]

Take your alternator off and have an Auto parts store check it for you. After they tell you its bad buy a new one. I think its the alternator.

[BIG BAD JON]

One of the wires going to your wipers is grounding to the body, frame, or something. Get a wiring diagram, trace the wire, and see what you come up with.

[Nobby]

Sounds to me like you have more than one issue. The starting/charging system can have knock on effects to one another over a period of time, i.e a bad battery can hurt a starter motor or alternator, lazy starter motor can harm the battery and hence maybe the alternator, lazy alternator will effect the battery and hence maybe the starter motor. I have often found myself on older vehicles re-placing more than one thing.
Firstly though check your large wires for the starting and charging circuit make sure you have good clean well secured contacts. I secound Jon on checking your wiper circuit. You're post title is battery flat in the mornings, has this been occuring for a while? If your battery and alternator is O.K. then you have a serious voltage leakage somewhere say the wipers? however if you have a battery that is bad/not getting charged then standard shutdown/overnight battery loads such as clock, alarms etc may just make it flat by morning. Check your system in general for voltage leaks creating a flat battery overnight.
Check this post Joe gives some neat tips on checking wiring. Especially his secound one that will help you check for leaks whilst you're ignition is off. Remember though you will have a circuit or two that may well draw power when you are off a clock/radio for example.

http://www.ifsja.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=2;t=016684

If wires are good then squealing belts can be caused by
a. bad belts which will give bad charging
b. battery is bad which can cause the alternator to work at contiuous high output, couple this with bad belts and you'll get squeal.
d. flat battery which will cause the alternator to work hard initially, squeal would tend to calm down though as battery charges up.
c. alternator is siezed.
I would check your battery before I check your alternator the squeal would usually indicate that you are trying to charge.
Your starter motor sounds suspect/lazy as well, if you have to tap it. But that maybe be a loose wire.
Whatever the cure you find change your belts you will not have done them any favours with all that squeal.
Invest in a meter to check continuity voltage etc.
Check for voltage when charging to diagnose alternator.
Take voltage readings at the battery terminals.
If you have a flat battery the voltage will start of low at the battery terminals say 12.5 volts or below but should slowly rise as the battery takes a charge if the alternator is charging.
With a known good battery the alternator fairly quickly after start-up should be at a voltage of around 13.8-14.4 volts. Turn on some loads say high beams and heater fan to high, voltage should drop but should not really go below 13.0 volts of so. If not check the alternator.
(Note forgetting anyones recommended figures for a minute if you note a battery voltage before start-up then fire up if the voltage is now higher then you're alt. is working. If the voltage does not change or goes lower then you're alt. is not working.)
If with the flat battery belts are sqealing and the voltage does not slowly rise then I would say the battery is probably bad. But do not necessarily rule out the alternator. If you install a new battery and new belts just double check voltage to make sure your're alternator isn't lazy or bad.
The voltage figures I have given are to give you a feel for a range you should be looking for so use as a guide and not exactingly.

[ February 10, 2003, 06:11 AM: Message edited by: Nobby ]

[andy d]

i vote with Nobby, my 7yr old die hard died hard during the last cold snap. alt sounds like its doing its job.i'd start with a known good battery,and if the alt hasnt been taken down, you should be fine. prolly starter issue was due to low voltage

[Serious Johnson]

Yep, and to clarify one of Nobby's points; if you replace the battery and everything seems hunky-dory, don't assume that the original problem is fixed.

:-

[timmirvin]

Originally posted by Serious Johnson:
Yep, and to clarify one of Nobby's points; if you replace the battery and everything seems hunky-dory, don't assume that the original problem is fixed.

:-Yep, just went thru that, if I had read Nobby's post prior, I could have fixed it prior to battery needing to be replaced......

[mdill]

My 2 cents, the alt is likely fine, the alt belts are toast after sqeeling for any
lenght of time they get glazed. So why did the belts glaze ?? From the sounds
of it you have a current draw with the rig shut down, the alt is just trying to
recharge the system which causes the now toasted belts to squeel.
The battery is now suspect or it's life has been drasticly reduced, regular car
batterys do not like deep discharge cycles, and from the souns of it yours has seen
it's share, but if it has enough ummf left to start the rig when charged, let it go for
now.
Now for the bases of the problem (all of the above are just symtems) you have
a load either intermitant or continous that is not being shut down with the rig off.
Your wiper moter sounds like it has a short in its return to home switch, but I
would assume you would notice the wipers running all night if that was the only
problem, I have my tailgate switch semi short causing a continous load, I have had
a bad connection that would turn on my visor mirror light at times, I can only guess
where your load is but the wiper motor is a good place to start, then with the rig off
hook an amp meter between the + post of the battery and the + batt lead and start
pulling fues untill the meter reads less than 2ma of so, then start tracing the cicuits
that are cuasing the load.

Good luck they can be nasty to find.

Mike D.