air cleaner...housing and element.

[Kenall]

iv seen KN filters and how great they are, but iv also seen many 360 degree open element housings being used under the hood.

is the increased amount of hot air that this type of housing injest offset by the increased air flow to the carb?

im using the OE AMC housing but the element is very small compared to the OE unit used by GM on SBCs, and AMC engines have more CI!!

what housings do uall use?
what 'other make' housing fits well over MC 2bbls??

[River Beast]

Ken,

I completely understand your train of thought here.... never really thought about it til now. I do run the OE housing for a very good reason.... protection from water when "swimming: in the rivers! :D I will agree that the K&N filter elements are much better (more CFM flow) than the OE replacements but how much more with the OE housing I don't know.

[ October 04, 2001: Message edited by: River Beast ]

[porkchop]

I use an open element. I have used the same one for a long time. I like they way it looks and I like the extra air flow I get when I need it. You ccan use a K&N with an open air filter also. I am not worried about water getting in the carb. If I am ever in the water that deep then I have a problem :D :D :D

[Veepster]

if you do some searching on the web you will find a formula for motor size x max rpm's will require X amount of square inches of air cleaner surface...or you can call K&N and they will give you the formula.......I personall would leave the stock housing and fresh air snorkle and use a K&N.........kind alike getting the best of both worlds............there is some backyard formula that says every 10 degrees of increase in intake air charge equals a reduction of 1% horsepower

[River Beast]

Just thought of this... what if we can use the dual snorkel housings that I've seen around on some cars....would that make a big difference in flow? Just curious....

[67Gladiator]

The two things I've been wondering about are:
- What happens with ram air induction, particularly with hood scoops, when it rains?
building a ram air system for my next motor has been appealing to me lately, but
I can't figure that one out.
- Also, WRT snorkels for deep water crossings, why not run the intake thruough the firewall and into the cab where there ought to be no splashing, etc ?

The people at Edelbrock say that the carb throat diameter determines the CFM, which should to be tailored to CI,but it seems like air speed (as in intake hose, 360^ intake or ram air would make a vast difference.
Any thoughts?

[Veepster]

I don't think they drive them in the rain!!..

I think Edelbrock is making the assumption that all air cleaner pieces are adequate for the application

dual snorkles would be helpful if they are needed....

the way to check for adequate air box flow is to plumb a vacuum guage into the air cleaner housing(inside the element) and read the guage.there should be no vacuum readings, if there are any reading that means some area of the air cleaner housing is inadequate..........if the reading is zero no matter what you do will improve anything! it has all it needs...

[Bob Barry]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 67Gladiator:
The two things I've been wondering about are:
- What happens with ram air induction, particularly with hood scoops, when it rains?
building a ram air system for my next motor has been appealing to me lately, but
I can't figure that one out. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The factory-engineered setups use some sort of drain, and often have a flapper that only opens under full-throttle, so that it is usually sealed from the elements. The scoops are usually used for auxilliary induction; I can't think of many non-race setups that drew air ONLY through the scoop.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>- Also, WRT snorkels for deep water crossings, why not run the intake thruough the firewall and into the cab where there ought to be no splashing, etc ?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

some have done that; on an FSJ, though, you'd have to cut a hole under the cowl vent box in order to get into the passenger-compartment.

One serious drawback is gasoline fumes from normal evaportation making their way into the passenger compartment, making the truck go KABOOM!!! if there was a spark from static electricity or an electrical switch (like the door-jamb pin switch).

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>The people at Edelbrock say that the carb throat diameter determines the CFM, which should to be tailored to CI,but it seems like air speed (as in intake hose, 360^ intake or ram air would make a vast difference.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

CFM is always given at a certain standard atmospheric pressure; a true ram-air (and not just outside air induction) system does cause the intake pressure to rise, resulting in more air moving through the carb. This, of course, only usually happens at higher speeds, which our FSJ's don't often see.

When it does occur, the carburetor needs to be calibrated to provide additional fuel for burning with the additional cold and dense air, or else it would lean out.

In fact, the reason that the Trans Am shaker hood-scoops from the 1970's faced backwards was that they were TOO effective when facing forward (as they were originally designed to do, like the scoops from the old Super Dutys), causing the fuel mixture to lean out at high speeds. There was some ram effect from the high-pressure that builds up in the cowl area, but not nearly as much.

As cool as a shaker scoop would be on an FSJ, it probably wouldn't be very useful... smile.gif

[J20fan]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>In fact, the reason that the Trans Am shaker hood-scoops from the 1970's faced backwards was that they were TOO effective when facing forward (as they were originally designed to do, like the scoops from the old Super Dutys), causing the fuel mixture to lean out at high speeds. There was some ram effect from the high-pressure that builds up in the cowl area, but not nearly as much. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bob is there not an increased velocity from the deflected air flow in the high pressure area?

[Unknown Jeep]

Ken,
I use a Stock GM setup, (the Later year snorkle from a 80's camaro.... Breaths nice) Since most of my Driving is under 3000 RPM's and the Air cleaner is build to reach in the stock car up to 5600-6000 RPM, then why get more.... and you can duct it to the frontend for a nice cool clean airflow.

Troy / Papa Tonka
Elf in Tampa tongue.gif

[Bob Barry]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by J20fan:

Bob is there not an increased velocity from the deflected air flow in the high pressure area?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Not really, since it is diffused by the air filter and it has to make some tortuous bends to get into the venturis. What happens is that the air-pressure in the air-cleaner housing is raised above atmospheric pressure, providing a minor supercharging effect.

Even if there was a straight-shot, the velocity would be based more on the intake pulses than the velocity of incoming air, as far as I can understand it.

Somebody taking a fluid dynamics course could probably give you the straight answer here.

[Dive 30]

The two front facing scoops that I have seen/participated in were positioned so that they were slightly behind the open conical filter. This was not a true 'ram air' system as it simply creates an area of cold fresh air behind the filter (which is mostly pushing warm engine comp. air down and away. The benefit of this setup is that rain/snow is directed behind the filter while still creating an area of fresh cold air.

[67Gladiator]

Am I following the general tenor here if I extrapolate from y'all that a bit of induction -as offered by an induction cowl- would be a good thing, but that anything else would be ineffectual or counterproductive?
If so, are there alternatives to the actual cowl? Performance is paramount, but looks are important, too...

As far as the dual air cleaner snorkels go, I've considered connecting them to the mock auxiliary light grilles (it's a real Gladiator), but don't know about the fluid bypass systems that come stock on other vehicles.
Thoughts?

[Lindel]

I'm using the Edelbrock "Pro-Flow" triangular filter on mine. Flows more than I'll ever need, the filter is washable,with soap and water, and a replacement is only $8.99, if necessary.