T176 Troubles

[Stuka]

Hey all, I am trying to get info on what this problem could be. Let me know what ya guys think.

Its an 81 J10, with a 258, T176, NP208. It runs and rives fine, but get stuck in gear at times. And will kinda grind a bit going into reverse at times as well. If it gets stuck in a gear, and it cant be jerked out, then turning off the engine will free it most the time. Except this morning when it got stuck in 1st. It required taking the shifter off, which then freed it up and it shifted fine. With the shifter off the shift rails move fine with a screw driver.

Unfortunately I cant physically look at the jeep myself, as it is not mine and not located here at my house, or any where closse. It is one I am looking at to possibly buy. The whole jeep is great, minus this shifter issue.

What I amm wanting to know is if the shifter is known to wear out or not? The clutch is new, and moves freely, and it grabs about 3/4 of the way up, so the clutch is disenguaging all the way, so it isnt that. I can drive it home like this (be about a 6 hour drive) but I would rather find out the problem before making up my mind.

Thanks.

[TimK]

Of course someone else will be here soon to tell you whats wrong with the tranny... I'll just say, WOW Stuka! Congrats on the find!

Get him to drop the price for the dumpy tranny and snag it. If it fixes cheap, your ahead of the game! Glad to see you found something, even if it'll be something to compare to a better find! Best Luck!

[madogswagon]

I had a CJ-5 with a T-176 tranny in it and similar problems. The first thing I found out was that the the brass shifter fork in the shifter tower was worn ($50) for a rebuilt one. The shifter was also worn/rounded at the bottom: fixed it by welding it. It was still touchy, and disassembled to find that the synchronyzers and blocking assemblies were fried. At the same time I put in a new throw out bearing. So after a couple of hundred $, I have a working tranny.
It could be a bunch of things. Good Luck.

[83cherokee]

ok, I had the same problem with my 83 Cherokee, I also have the 258, T-176, and NP208, I spent nearly 2 years trying to figure out what was causing my tranny to get hung in gear, it always seemed to do it when I parked the vehical, and shut it off, the next day or when ever I drove it next, I would climb in, push the clutch in, hit the key, crank the 258, grab the stick shift and pull it out of first, but the stick shift would feel kinda wierd, and even though the stick shift would move, the tranny would be hung in first gear, the only real place that I could move the shifter was in reverse, but the tranny would still be hung in first, and it would always require me to pull the shifter out, and manually place the forks in neutral, heck I pulled the tranny and the transfer case out, rebuilt the tranny, put everything back in, drove it 3 times and it did it again, then I took my shifter out, welded on the end of it then ground the weld back down to what I thought to be the correct shape, but a tad on the large side, then re-installed it, it took me 2 tries of installing/removing to grind/shape the shifter to get it to feel good and tight in the gates, and so far....many, many miles later, it has never hung in first gear again. It now really feels right going thru the gears, I knew before the shifter was so easy going thru the gates, but never thought that this was causing my problem, but now I am 100% sure the problem has been corrected. If you have no way of welding and shaping it, I saw the gear shifter at wilsons 4X4 dot com or mikes jeep parts dot com (can't remember for sure), for $64.00 just yeasterday. Hope this helps you out......as I rub my bald spot from what this problem put me thru !

[ March 14, 2003, 08:09 AM: Message edited by: 83cherokee ]

[FSJeeper]

The T-176 is marginal for a FSJ even when behind the excellent AMC 258.

I have owned 2 FSJ's in past years with the T-176 and had nothing but problems.

I would suggest going to a real truck transmission like the Dodge NP435 which would be a simple swap and you would retain the good NP208.

[The Anti-Chrysler]

What does the NP435 come in?? Late models?? Will it bolt to the existing bellhousing?

I have had similar problems with every T-176 tranny I ever had. Garbage. Way too light duty.

[FSJeeper]

An 80 up Dodge 4x4 truck with NP435 will work. AA makes a bellhousing adapter for around $200 last time I checked and the Jeep 23 spline NP208 will bolt up to the Dodge NP435.

Or you could swap the Dodge NP435 input shaft for a Ford one and drill and tap the bellhousing for the Dodge bolt pattern.

I happen to have a low mileage Dodge NP435 out of an 80 military 1.25 ton truck and also some Ford NP435's if someone is interested.

[Sycho15]

An AX-15 from a later-model Jeep is another way to go This also get's you an over-drive as well (which allows you to gear lower, or go faster- your choice!)

However, they are more expensive, lighter duty, and have a higher first gear than the NP435

[RustyJeep]

aren't ax-15's light/medium duty trannies, that really shouldn't be put in anything bigger than an XJ?

[Cecil14]

Originally posted by RustyJeep:
aren't ax-15's light/medium duty trannies, that really shouldn't be put in anything bigger than an XJ?Yup. But so was the T-176 and the T-5 but AMC used them anyway! ;) If you're easy on it it'd do just as well as either of the other light duties.

Anthony

[Sycho15]

I think the AX-15 is a much tougher box than the T-176. I'm not saying I'd feel confident running it behind a V-8, but I rarely hear of one getting messed up by a I-6. Even stroked or super-charged I-6s with horsepower and torque numbers that give some V-8s a run for their money.

There have been quite a few competitors in the rock-crawling circle that used/use AX-15s, but I've never heard of anyone running a T-176.

If I ever find a good AX-15 for less than $400 I might just do this swap myself.

[Zorm]

lets bring up this dead thread
so, FSJeeper, the Dodge tranny, is it also a 4 speed?
As far as the AX-15, would the NP-208 bolt up to the end of it?

[Capt murph]

Well, time to add my T-176 troubles, even though I was giving Jason D a hard time on this tranny topic.

Stuka, When you have this problem, you must shift with precision - putting the shifter in the right location, and not just moving it and letting it fall where it wants to. AND MOST IMPORTANT, when going into reverse, you must push the spring loaded shifter over to the right, and back, AND use the same for getting out of reverse, that is, push it over to the right, and then up, as opposed to just pushing it up (fwd) to come out of reverse.

83Cherokee: Excellent description and repair. I might just buy a new shifter. Thanks