New FSJ Project Build : Guatemalan GW for Missionary

[Greg Taylor]

**** 05/27/2009 EDIT ****
Elliott recommended that I edit this first post with a need/want list for the buildup, so that we can see what's covered and what's not, and who has donated parts so far. See way below in the next **** section for the list, including the "christmas wish list" stuff.
*********************


Hey guys,
A very cool guy and long time member on the FSJ-List (who wants to remain anonymous) donated his nice '87 GW to my buddy Tim, who is a missionary in Guatemala (Central America just south of Mexico.

The GW is in nice shape and only needs the rockers replaced (new ones were included!) and the rear quarters patched up ... all which will be done in Guatemala, once it's down there (body work is rediculously cheap in Guate).

It currently has a tad over 100,000 on the odometer, with a remanned 360 from another Jeep installed, which runs fine, other than the 2-bbl Holley giving fits at cold-start with the choke settings.

It sports a 3" lift and 31" Perelli tires. Other than that, it's stock. 360 V8, 727 auto and NP229 t-case. I don't know if it has a rear Trac-lok or not.

My buddy Tim currently has a Dodge Dakota in Guatemala, which is getting the SNOT beat out of it, on the mountain "roads" which he has to travel to get to some pretty remote mountain villages. Driving in Guatemala's mountains is well ... more like serious offroading ... sometimes the paved roads even become CRAZY really fast, due to rain storms washing out hugh sections of roads, which don't get repaired for weeks or months.

Suffice to say, we want to build up Tim's new GW so that it is READY for the trip down and it's new life off-roading thru Guatemala. So, I'm starting this thread to get input and build interest in the project.

We need your tried-n-true expertise in building up this GW to last. We already know from seeing how the Dakota (2" body lift and 31" tires) is getting beat up bad, that we need to higher ground clearance with the GW to clear some of the rocks Tim will be dealing with on the mountain "roads".

Here are some of the ideas we have been tossing around ...

1) 6" lift
2) 2" body lift
3) 33-35" tires (currently has F/R Dana 44's 3.31 gears)
4) Holley Street Dominator intake
5) Holley or Howell TBI system (sea level to 10,000 feet driving)
7) Shackle Flip (instead of #1)

Now I know that some of you guys have built some serious off-roading rigs. What are you thoughts on getting this GW set up right for "wheeling"? What SHOULD we focus on and what should we IGNORE? As always, money IS an issue, since this is missionary work we're talking about.

Lastly, if anyone has parts that they would like to donate towards this build up, they would be tax deductible. Tim's organization www.hopefortomorrow.org (http://www.hopefortomorrow.org) is non-profit (501c3).

Thanks for the feedback on this, guys!

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Feed_Me.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Guatemalan_GW_01.jpg

************* HERE'S THE LIST ***************

1) Hydroboost : DONATED by Elliott (thanks!)
2) 4-bbl Holley Street Dominator Intake Manifold : DONATED by Greg Taylor
3) 4" Lift Springs : DONATED by Greg Taylor
4) Drop Pitman Arm
5) Extended brake lines
6) 4" lift shocks
7) D44HD/D60 FSJ Axles or equivalent (DSD) : DONATED (J20 Donor)
8) Locker/Torque-sensing differentials (for stock D44's or D44HD/D60 combo)
9) Rear Tailgate access panel (missing from GW)
10) Big front bumper
11) Big rear bumper : Possibly use the J20 Donor rear bumper
12) Winch
13) Howell or Holley TBI system ... OR ... Off-road 4-bbl carburetor (holley flange pattern)
14) FSJ NP208 23-spline T-case/shifters : DONATED (J20 Donor)
15) Aux. Fuel Tank
16) Good FSJ York A/C compressor and related parts (Tim's is leaking)
17) Safari Rack
18) Rear disc brakes
19) FSJ DSD T18/NP208 combo (instead of # 14) (again a want, not a need)
20) CB Radio & antenna
21) Heddman Headers : DONATED by Greg Taylor
22) Off-road lights
23) Driver-side front fender for NT
24) Rear Window actuator assembly (Tim's is worn out and clunking)
25) Rear driveshaft for NP208 in a GW
26) Bushwacker XJ Pocket Flares for a 4-door
27) HEI dist. for AMC V8 : DONATED by Greg Taylor

************* END OF THE LIST ***************

[Elliott]

I think you should get this moved to the offroad section.

H1 rims/recentered so they can do thier own field swaps/repair

OBA to run tools

Tad rack for packing a load on long hauls

Aux tank

Winch/bumper

Detroit in the rear, Dodge D60 SRW and disc brakes

SRW D60 up front with high steer and high tierod

Swap the auto/229 out for a late model T18/NP208

Power steering cooler and hydroboost

[Greg Taylor]

Hi Elliot,
Thanks for the feedback & input. How do I move it to the Offroad forum and "why"? :)

I was working on an Aux tank in SoCal, but it's used. I'm thinking about calling up Aero Tanks and/or NWMP to see about one.

[Elliott]

You don't have to move it (would need the mods to do that anyway) it's just that this is great offroad build project here and many of the guys that frequent the offroad section don't spend much time over here in the general tech.

[Greg Taylor]

Hi Elliot,
OK, now I understand WHY it should be moved to the Off-Road forum. I'll ask a moderator about doing that. :thumbsup:

[Greg Taylor]

Thanks goes out to the moderator that moved this over from the General Tech forum. :thumbsup:

[Dan Stewart]

I am wondering if you should put a small deisel in it. Just because isnt Diesel the fuel of choice down there? Or am I totally ignorant and Gas is available just as easily as Diesel. I would install a gear Tcase, just to simply things, a chain case with vacuum stuff is kind of complex for that type of operation. Sounds like a great build.

[Greg Taylor]

Dan,
Thanks for the input.

A 4BT from a bread-box truck would be great. Dean Jorgensen from the FSJ-List has one in his GW with a NV4500.

Both Gas and Diesel are available in Guatemala. Diesel is preferred probably because its cheaper and nets more MPGs.

Are you thinking a Dana 300 or Dana 20 or NP205 for gear-driven?

[ob1jeeper]

Guatemala has it's fair share of poor quality roads for sure...

To keep ANY vehicle that runs this type of surfaces, from being shook apart from the high-frequency inputs caused by significant amounts of pot-holes and washboard, you will want the total effective spring rate as low as practical, while still being able to handle whatever loads it must carry.

THE most cost effective thing that can be done to accomplish this goal, is to increase the volume of air in the tires (IE as large a diameter and section as is practical to fit), and lower the tire pressures. This combination will help lower the tires spring rate.

NOTE: Just don't lower the pressures so far that you run the risk of over-heating the side-walls due to deflection.

Also, I would caution you to not get over-the-top with lift springs, as nearly all of them have in the ballpark of DOUBLE the OEM suspension spring rates. While this is good from a load capacity standpoint, the problem is that rather than absorb the shock loading of the road inputs, it transmits those shock loads directly into the chassis, causing shortened life of ALL the vehicles systems and components.

If I were building a FSJ for that part of Central America, I'd have a set of springs built with approx 1.5-2" higher loaded camber, but retain the OEM leafe count and thickness. This will give you room to fit larger tires, while providing the lowest practical spring rate.

I would also have built, or fab up a set of bump stops that are approx 3/4" taller than the originals, but made of the same durometer (stiffness) Rubber ( a material that is MUCH more easily obtainable for replacements as needed in Central America). It should be tapered to approximate the original's shape with "pointy" side facing the axle, to provide a progressive softening of the impact when bottomed on un-expected pot-holes, etc.

I would also use either use 32x11.50 or 32x12.50 12.50 tires, and set tire pressures to the neighborhood of 18-25 psi, depending on loads carried, and average speeds.

Obviously higher pressures for higher loads and speeds averaging 50 +, and lower pressures for lighter loads and rougher roads where average speeds are under 50.

HTH... Good Luck

BTW: similar things could be done to his current vehicle to provide improvements to it's lifespan...;)

[Dan Stewart]

Also think about military wrap springs. This would give you the ability to limp home if the main eye breaks. Just a little backup to keep the truck stranded.

[Elliott]

If you run a shackle inversion in the rear and a D60 up front you'll have your 6" of lift running stock springs and won't have to worry about the increased arch/higher rates.

[Greg Taylor]

If you run a shackle inversion in the rear and a D60 up front you'll have your 6" of lift running stock springs and won't have to worry about the increased arch/higher rates.

If we go with the shackle flip and use the 3" springs, for a total of 10" lift ... what all will we need to do with the steering linkages to get the geometry "right"?

Thanks!

[JPSwapMohn]

I have spent a little time on some of those back mountain roads in NE Guat, and they turn to pure goo when the rains come.

I would not go too high with the lift (I think 10" is too high, but that's just me) as you will loose handling, etc.

I would recommend REALLY good brakes, disc front and back. Very good shocks and well-thought out tire selection (or one set for drier periods and one set for the mud..). You will absolutely need a locker in the rear, and maybe limited slip in the front (others with more mud experience would know better than I).

If keeping the NP229, just put it in 4Hi and forget about it..until you need 4Lo.

I have not experience the hydro-assist steering mods that some here have, but it sounds like a real good idea when you are trying to move 12.5" wide meats through 8" deep white goo..

You also want to think about putting a roll-cage of some sort in there. I don't think the waggy will fair too well if it goes upside down. The great view from all the windows comes with a price..

If you are putting a rack on it, go with gutter mount to help stiffen the body a little.

Winch/bumper as mentioned and a swing-out tire mount on the back if you go with an axillary tank and don't want the spare taking up cargo space.

Put some additional lights on it even if you decide not to put a rack up there. And put relays on the headlights to brighten them up some. He will thank you for it!

Those roads are dangerous as h3ll and they drive 'em like they are on I-95..

And I guess you can ship him parts as stuff breaks, cause he is not likely to find many AMC engines and such out there.

Wasn't there a brown cherokee on here somewhere that had a rather solid sort of exo-skeleton on it with bumpers and all the trimmings? Maybe just go buy it? He will have a heck of a rig if able to fit it out with everything folks have recommended here.

(an internal lockable hatch cut into the roof might be a good idea as well, depending on where he roams, and a pintle mount..)

There are some beautiful beautiful places out there that most folks will never be able to get to, but I think I would have chosen Belize if I were going to that part of the world for missionary work.. *^)

[JPSwapMohn]

Oh, and don't make it too pretty or too "bad ***" looking outwardly or he will not have it for long..

[Elliott]

If we go with the shackle flip and use the 3" springs, for a total of 10" lift ... what all will we need to do with the steering linkages to get the geometry "right"?

Thanks!

High steer and a drop pitman.

[ob1jeeper]

High steer and a drop pitman.
But that's just gettin' WAY too tall to be safely operated on those types of road and speeds...;)

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I've been getting more feedback also that going 10" tall is too high, over on the FSJ-List.

What about us just adding in a 2" body lift on top of the current 3" springs? And perhaps using BJ's 1" lift shackles and a 1" lift block in the rear? That would give us 5" - 6" of total lift, and they we could cut out the fenders for 33"-35" tires.

Or, how much lift would be needed to clear 35" tires, IF, we just hog out the fenders? And how much can the GW rear wheel opening be cut, since it's near the doors?

[FSJ Guy]

RE fuel, I'd go with the Edelbrock MPFI. Howell may or may not be able to customize their chip for a non-OEM intake. You don't want to find out the hard way that they can't.

A guy here in Denver had the Edelbrock on a Jasper rebuilt motor and it had gobs of power. Even at this altitude.

[Greg Taylor]

RE fuel, I'd go with the Edelbrock MPFI. Howell may or may not be able to customize their chip for a non-OEM intake. You don't want to find out the hard way that they can't.


$2800 for the MPFI is way out of the Mi$$ionary Budget and I know that Edlebrock won't donate it. I could probably get it at jobber price from them, based on past discussions with them.

At least since Howell is local to us, I could sit down with them and/or take the FSJ to their shop for tuning/ PROM burns/install.

If anything the Holley Street Dominator intake I'll be installing for Tim will flow the TBI more uniformly than a stock intake. The Holley is single plane, divided plenum with equal length runners. It should distribute fuel much more uniformly.

I'm also going to try swapping one of my extra Fish Carbs onto the FSJ, to see how it performs for Tim. It's pretty simple to operate, once it's dialed in and adjusted for Air/Fuel. It also can run at various angles.

[El_Diablo]

there was a guy around here that had some pretty large tires, i want to say atleast 37's on a stock suspension, no lift anywhere with just the fenders trimmed

go stick your head under the rear wheel well, theres a TON of room

[Elliott]

I think 35's clear NT fenders without trimming, on a 6" lift. I'm pretty sure that's the size Clay was running on his '80 wag that he brought over to my WOT last year. They might have been 36's.

[rustywagoneers_com]

This is an 89 that I originally bought with the intent of replacing the engine, fixing the interior, and giving it to my wife for a DD. Wound up adding some more dents to the flaking-off paint and it has become the weekend-warrior rig while I am re-doing the ugly old black turbo-waggy. It will be my oldest son's truck when he is able to handle the responsibility.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/DrSide1.jpg
2 inch lift springs in the front (on their 3rd or 4th truck), 2 inch blocks in back (yeah, I know), and 2 inch BL (steel square tubing - much like Tad's BL blocks). Front fenders trimmed up to 1/2" from the woodgrain, and then the 1/2" lip was 'hemmed' back on itself. Rear wheelwells - I drew the line from the door opening back, and followed the profile of the old wheel opening, cut about 1/2" short of that line, and bent the lip back at a 90* angle (in most areas). I also had left enough of the inner wheelwell to bend it toward the quarter panel, laying the 2 surfaces on top of each other. Stitched the inner and outer back together, caulked and foamed the inside masked and undercoated the outside. Just cut the 'dogleg' section under the rear door off, below the spot welded seam (it leaves that area a little stiffer that way).
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/DrRear1.jpg
I have been running Q78-15 TSL's (and now that they are worn out, I am running mix-n-match 35's) on the 3.31's with zero complaints.
Truck can sometimes still manage 13 or 14 mpg with a Qjet. (on an adapter - I know I know I know - hasn't ever been a problem for me, it is not like my heads or manifold flow enough to care if there is an adapter between the carb and manifold)
It flexes 'OK enough' for what I do with it (I drive it to and from Tuttle Creek Kansas - so I stay out of the rock garden).
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/Poser1.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/Poser2.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/Poser3.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/Poser4.jpg
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/Poser5.jpg
Add a couple pipe bumpers and weld the rear (at a minimum)
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/RrBump1.jpg
It will definitely go like stink.
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/gray/100_0635.jpg
And remember to clean up after yourself and others!
http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg150/rustywagoneers_com/tuttle%204-4-09/IMAG0006.jpg
There is simply no way to build a vehicle this capable for less money. This truck has less than 500 dollars added to it compared to when it was bone stock.

[Xenolithic]

But that's just gettin' WAY too tall to be safely operated on those types of road and speeds...;)

I just wanted to add to not go ridiculous with the lift size. I'm not an offroading expert, but bear in mind much of the mountain roads south of the border are probably 1.3 car widths wide and no guardrail on the drop side with cliff/ditch/rain gulley on the other side.

[rustywagoneers_com]

Get manual window lift assemblies for it!

[Elliott]

Greg, I will donate a hydroboost and master cylinder for this rig, set it to bolt in and also provide a mounting assembly for it. Possibly somebody will spring for some hoses for it or donate some other parts you could use in the build so it would at least offset the cost of the hoses. Maybe you can make a list of what folks contribute and what you need and then edit it here. There are prolly a lot of Jeep parts kicking around that our members would part with to help out on this project. Certainly I've been on the receiving end of a lot of free or very low cost parts from our members. There's lots of great folks here and when I finish it I'll be starting a thread to show how I built a 360 from mostly parts given to me by our great membership.:thumbsup:


I guess another way I could work it is if I can get another two members to buy a hydroboost from me this month I will also pay for the hoses and bend them up to include for a complete bolt in installation for you.

[Greg Taylor]

Greg, I will donate a hydroboost and master cylinder for this rig, :thumbsup:

Hey Elliot,
THANKS for offering to donate this for the build ... WAY COOL! :D Now Tim will be able to stop on a dime with the Waggy. Also, thanks for the possiblity of offering the pre-bent lines, pending more HB sales to other IFSJA members.

[Greg Taylor]

This is an 89 that I originally bought with the intent of replacing the engine, fixing the interior, and giving it to my wife for a DD ...

Thanks so much for posting this up, WITH pics. I'm glad to see that we could in essence trim up the fenders on Tim's jeep to get 33"-35" tires to clear. He currently has a 3" spring lift and we know a handful of body guys that could probably assist us with the fender mods.

Since you're running the 3.31 geared Dana 44's ... any issues with the 35" tires on D44's with off-roading?

[Elliott]

Hey Elliot,
THANKS for offering to donate this for the build ... WAY COOL! :D Now Tim will be able to stop on a dime with the Waggy. Also, thanks for the possiblity of offering the pre-bent lines, pending more HB sales to other IFSJA members.

Yeah, might have that covered already with some help from our M715 brothers. Will know soon...:thumbsup:

[rustywagoneers_com]

Thanks so much for posting this up, WITH pics. I'm glad to see that we could in essence trim up the fenders on Tim's jeep to get 33"-35" tires to clear. He currently has a 3" spring lift and we know a handful of body guys that could probably assist us with the fender mods.

Since you're running the 3.31 geared Dana 44's ... any issues with the 35" tires on D44's with off-roading?

Low range all the time (it's the only way I would take that t-case 'wheeling' anyway - since 4-hi is using the viscous coupler, and low-range actually locks the front and rear together).

If I had to negotiate a man-made rock garden type obstacle, I am pretty sure I would have the automatic tranny pretty warm by the time I made it (or got winched out). But for travelling (mobility) in bad conditions, it is no problem at all. Trail riding, a rock here, a rock there, muddy creek beds, logs, etc - that is how this thing gets wheeled.


Less than 3.31's would probably be a very bad idea, but 35's and 3.31's is not bad.

[Billygoat]

I guess another way I could work it is if I can get another two members to buy a hydroboost from me this month I will also pay for the hoses and bend them up to include for a complete bolt in installation for you.

So do I count towards that? MO will be in the mail shortly.
Probably just slip a little extra in to cover a hose too....

[Elliott]

Yes you do and thank you very much! :thumbsup:

[Greg Taylor]

Thanks a lot, guys! :thumbsup:

[mrtazwrench]

Low range all the time (it's the only way I would take that t-case 'wheeling' anyway - since 4-hi is using the viscous coupler, and low-range actually locks the front and rear together).

If I had to negotiate a man-made rock garden type obstacle, I am pretty sure I would have the automatic tranny pretty warm by the time I made it (or got winched out). But for travelling (mobility) in bad conditions, it is no problem at all. Trail riding, a rock here, a rock there, muddy creek beds, logs, etc - that is how this thing gets wheeled.


Less than 3.31's would probably be a very bad idea, but 35's and 3.31's is not bad.

A 208 conversion may be a good idea to elminate viscous couppler failure.

[rustywagoneers_com]

And for the truck going to Guatemala, I would highly recommend it.

Me, I have spares, and no 'standard' 23 spline FSJ NP208's in stock - so I make sure I never stress the VC....

peace
Dave

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
Just a quick update. I'm starting to get some more feedback regarding donations ... I'm checking with some of the larger companies and magazines out there, to see about any help they can provide. I'll post up as I know more and can give credit to those off the forum.

[Elliott]

Good deal Greg! Let us know how that goes and maybe if you have specific things you need you could edit your first post to list what is being requested/donated. One of my bud's is out of town so next week I'll order the HB mounting assembly and then get this sent out, should have cleared my other sale by then as I have two folks looking to get set up right now.

[El_Diablo]

deffinetly add a heavy duty trans cooler (high grades are a pain) and oil cooler (both thermostatically controlled)

you may want to consider a dual oil filter aswell, something like this perhaps-
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/bf.aspx

maybe even an additional and easy to replace trans filter located near the oil filter setup... to take this even further i would add a clear fuel filter before the stocker with replaceable elements for ease of use and cleaning just in case

a junkyard fuel injection system would definitely go a long way in drive-ability and save you the money of a pre-made kit, and all you need is someone who can run wires and then a flash tune to get it dead on, just make sure to include and extra computer as a spare part because they're hard enough to get around here

[Greg Taylor]

Good deal Greg! Let us know how that goes and maybe if you have specific things you need you could edit your first post to list what is being requested/donated. One of my bud's is out of town so next week I'll order the HB mounting assembly and then get this sent out, should have cleared my other sale by then as I have two folks looking to get set up right now.

Hi Elliott,
Thanks for the suggestion about editing the 1st post about what's needed vs. what's been donated. I'll do that on Monday, after the Memorial Day weekend is over. :thumbsup:

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I have a possible Aerotank donation in Victorville, California, which I'm looking to see if someone could pick up and FEDEX to us for Tim's Waggy. If anyone in that area of CA can help out, please let me know. Thanks!

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I was discussing the fender trimming with Tim, to clear 35" tires. He would like to put some sort of fender flare on to deal with slinging Guatemalan mud, so I discussed the XJ Bushwacker flares with him, from BJ's Offroad ... http://www.bjsoffroad.com/cartgenie/prodInfo.asp?pid=755&cid=8

Does anyone know how large of a tire these Bushwacker flares will clear with a 4" lift? I know, Tim has a 3" lift installed ... I'm thinking that I'll give him my 4" BJ's springs for his GW build up.

Thanks for the input, guys!

[Greg Taylor]

maybe if you have specific things you need you could edit your first post to list what is being requested/donated


Hey guys,
Finally got the first post edited. Thanks!

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I have a possible Aerotank donation in Victorville, California

Hey guys, just an update that it looks like we should be getting this 29-gallon Aerotank from Jeremy Goodman in CA. We're working out the pick-up details with an LA friend of my buddy Tim.

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
Got really good news! A fellow Michigander is donating a J20 truck for the build-up project. We are planning to swap the axles and NP208 t-case from it, under the waggy, making it a widetrack.

We are considering swapping the WT fenders and rear flares as well, since Tim would like some flares to keep from slinging mud so much.

How big of a tire could we clear with WT fenders and a 4" spring lift?

Or, how big of a tire could we clear with trimmed NT fenders and the Bushwacker XJ Flare kit installed (from BJ's) & a 3" spring lift?

On the "flip side" would it be more beneficial to swap the J20 axles AND stock springs to the Waggy and do a shackle flip instead? Would this be stable enough for wheeling? Wouldn't it in essence provide us with a complete 3/4-ton suspension as well (for added load capacities)? If we did a shackle flip with the WT axles, what are all the details needed for this to "work"?

Thanks so much guys for the feedback!

[Elliott]

Got the hydroboost mounting assembly on order. Should be able to get the HB and bits to you before long.

If you do a shackle flip it gives you ~4.5", a shackle inversion kit gives you ~6". If you go to a 6" lift you need to lengthen at least the front driveshaft, change your shock mounts, add longer brake lines, and build a high steer... or at least run a drop pitman and put up with some bump steer.

[Greg Taylor]

Got the hydroboost mounting assembly on order. Should be able to get the HB and bits to you before long.

If you do a shackle flip it gives you ~4.5", a shackle inversion kit gives you ~6". If you go to a 6" lift you need to lengthen at least the front driveshaft, change your shock mounts, add longer brake lines, and build a high steer... or at least run a drop pitman and put up with some bump steer.

Elliott,
Thanks for the update on the HB unit and shackle flip. So, the SOA flip is a lot more detailed as to mods needed. Are there any good threads (with pics) to see what the high-steer and shock mount mods look like?

So guys, could we just clear a 35" tire with a 4" lift and WT flares .... or the 3" lift and Bushwacker XJ flares?

[rustywagoneers_com]

I am gonna vote, in this case, to run the 36 inch Military tire noting the J20 axles. Cheapest tire of it's size, and (hopefully?) easier / cheaper to get in S.A. (but I might be off-base on that). Obviously it will not handle mud like a 'bogger' but it will be better than a lot of others. Most of the 36 inch Goodyear OZ's that I have seen measure a hair north of 34 inches.

[EDIT: Idea being that you can just squeeze the military 36's onto the J20 original wheels and 'viola'. Good chance that the original J20 wheels are 'safety bead' style.]

Of course, if expensive wheels and tires are in the budget for this thing - then I would suggest 'Simex Extreme Trekkers'. They are not DOT approved - so when you buy them in the USA they are for 'agricultural use only' but they are road legal (or road-less legal) down there.

They (simex) make 35 and 36 inch 16's.

Of course, straight up boggers will be the best for the job, and easier to source.

[El_Diablo]

bushwacker flares would be better than the widetracks IMO, it would be a lot more body damage friendly since they're plastic but would still deflect mud dirt and rocks

[El_Diablo]

I am gonna vote, in this case, to run the 36 inch Military tire noting the J20 axles. Cheapest tire of it's size, and (hopefully?) easier / cheaper to get in S.A. (but I might be off-base on that). Obviously it will not handle mud like a 'bogger' but it will be better than a lot of others. Most of the 36 inch Goodyear OZ's that I have seen measure a hair north of 34 inches.

[EDIT: Idea being that you can just squeeze the military 36's onto the J20 original wheels and 'viola'. Good chance that the original J20 wheels are 'safety bead' style.]

Of course, if expensive wheels and tires are in the budget for this thing - then I would suggest 'Simex Extreme Trekkers'. They are not DOT approved - so when you buy them in the USA they are for 'agricultural use only' but they are road legal (or road-less legal) down there.

They (simex) make 35 and 36 inch 16's.

Of course, straight up boggers will be the best for the job, and easier to source.forgot to add earlier, the military 36's used on hummers (the goodyears you mention) require a 16.5 inch wheel

[rustywagoneers_com]

forgot to add earlier, the military 36's used on hummers (the goodyears you mention) require a 16.5 inch wheel

Yes, I suppose I should have been more clear on that.

Chances are the wheels on the later-model J20 donor truck will be 16.5's WITH safety bead, making the combination of those wheels, and H1 tires into about the cheapest and most durable way to get the job done.

[Greg Taylor]

Guys,
Thanks for the heads up on the J20 Dana 60 rear axle being even wider than the Cherokee WT Dana 44 axle ... I was not aware of that.

I have started searching for a Ford Dana 60 axle around Detroit and have a few leads.

So, suffice to say, we could run the J20 Dana 44HD front with a Ford Dana 60 Rear, right? We could also run the J20 NP208 t-case with this setup, also.

On the flip side, I started researching the H1 rims/tires you guys are talking about. I found H1's with 7" of back-spacing on a 8.5" wide rim. Would these "work" with the J20 rear Dana 60, on the Waggy, since there is so much back spacing to "tuck" the wide axle back under the Waggy? http://cleveland.craigslist.org/pts/1176005663.html (http://cleveland.craigslist.org/pts/1176005663.html) is the link for the H1 rims/tires.

Thanks again, all, for the continued feedback.

[sappy76]

Guys,
Thanks for the heads up on the J20 Dana 60 rear axle being even wider than the Cherokee WT Dana 44 axle ... I was not aware of that.

I have started searching for a Ford Dana 60 axle around Detroit and have a few leads.

So, suffice to say, we could run the J20 Dana 44HD front with a Ford Dana 60 Rear, right? We could also run the J20 NP208 t-case with this setup, also.

On the flip side, I started researching the H1 rims/tires you guys are talking about. I found H1's with 7" of back-spacing on a 8.5" wide rim. Would these "work" with the J20 rear Dana 60, on the Waggy, since there is so much back spacing to "tuck" the wide axle back under the Waggy?


Greg,
I'm getting ready to swap my D44 Wide track to the HD44/D60 I pulled from my J20. What information on the axle width did you receive to push you away from the D60? I'd like to understand this before I start my swap. (I haven't been able to find the information I'm looking for yet.)

Thanks

[Greg Taylor]

Greg,
I'm getting ready to swap my D44 Wide track to the HD44/D60 I pulled from my J20. What information on the axle width did you receive to push you away from the D60? I'd like to understand this before I start my swap. (I haven't been able to find the information I'm looking for yet.)

Thanks

Here's what Zach @ Z&M Jeeps had to say over on the FSJ-List ... I was thinking that he had responded here on the forum, so I see the reason for the big "Huh?"

Re: [FSJ-List] Guatemalan Missionary FSJ - Update

Tuesday, June 2, 2009 1:01 PM

From: "Zachary M. Heisey" zmjeeps@desupernet.net



To: FSJ-List@yahoogroups.com




Greg,
The rear wide trac axle is going to be way to wide to work in your Wagoneer. Wide trac chero axles are a good width, but the J-truck axles are more that 4" wider. If you want a rear Dana 60, use one from a Ford truck. They bolt right in and are the right width for the wags and cheros.

Zack Heisey
Z&M Jeeps Ltd.
zack@zmjeeps.com (http://us.mc517.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=zack@zmjeeps.com)
www.zmjeeps.com (http://www.zmjeeps.com/)
419.893.4JEEP (4533)

[Elliott]

I think you are only talking 2" difference between the WT and the J20 axle... so that would be 1" per side wider... correct me if I'm wrong... this isn't like going from a 61" NT to a J20 axle and I think the J20 is 65-67" WMS in the back.

[Greg Taylor]

I think you are only talking 2" difference between the WT and the J20 axle... so that would be 1" per side wider... correct me if I'm wrong... this isn't like going from a 61" NT to a J20 axle and I think the J20 is 65-67" WMS in the back.

Hi Elliott,
So you're saying that it would still fit under the NT Waggy, then?

[Elliott]

Dayum... I'm thinking you were building a WT Chero, my bad... if you run the bushwacker flares it might... work. The spring pad centers are much wider... listen to Zack. ;)

[Greg Taylor]

Dayum... I'm thinking you were building a WT Chero, my bad... if you run the bushwacker flares it might... work. The spring pad centers are much wider... listen to Zack. ;)

Hey Elliott,
Thanks for the confirmation. I was aware of the spring pad issue, just not the added width over WT axles. I guess we could always mock it up, along with the Bushwacker flares and see how it "looks" and would theoretically perform. I'm already persuing the Ford Dana 60 rear that Zack recommends.

[Elliott]

Ok, now I think RiverBeast ran a SRW C14 which is about the same width as the J20 D60 and he used Bushwackers....

[Greg Taylor]

Ok, now I think RiverBeast ran a SRW C14 which is about the same width as the J20 D60 and he used Bushwackers....

So, it could possibly work. What about my question (above) about using the 7" back-spacing H1 rims at http://cleveland.craigslist.org/pts/1176005663.html (http://cleveland.craigslist.org/pts/1176005663.html) ??? Wouldn't that in essence "tuck" the tires more under the NT fenders than the typical 4.25" back-spacing on 8.5"-10" rims?

[Elliott]

While I could see that potentially working in the rear I don't think it would work up front and you do want to be able to exchange tires front to rear. Up front I think that would put the tires into the springs most likely...

I prolly have pics of the bushwackers on Riverbeast.... You could run WT fenders up front.

[Greg Taylor]

While I could see that potentially working in the rear ... Up front I think that would put the tires into the springs most likely...


Hi Elliott,
What is the WMS width for the J20 front WT axle? I am going to measure the NT axle on my Waggy for comparision and compare the back spacing on my stock Waggy vs. aftermarket rims, to see how close to the springs the H1 rims would be on Tim's Waggy. Thanks.

[Elliott]

Here's Tad's chart for WMS specs:

http://members.cox.net/tadsal/WMS.html

[Greg Taylor]

Here's Tad's chart for WMS specs:

http://members.cox.net/tadsal/WMS.html

Elliott,
THANKS! This helps A LOT! It looks like the D44HD front is 67" and the rear D60 is 67.5" on the J20. Compare this to the D44 NT front at 59" and that would be 4" wider each side up front. Likewise, compare this to the D44NT rear at 58.5" and the D60 is basically 4.5" wider each side out back.

So, it would appear that we could run the J20 axles AND use the H1 rims to offset the tires back inboard about 3.5-4" and be OK both front and rear.

[Stuka]

OK, a bit late here. A J-Truck rear axle is about 67" WMS. A WT Cherokee rear axle is about 62" or so (front is about 1.5" wider per side). A ford axle is not going to be narrower. They are also 67" wide. Actually, just about every single SRW rear D60 is 67ish wide. Van axles are much wider however. But with the bushwhacker flares, you should be fine with the extra width. You will have to move the spring perches however.

H1 wheels are not going to work unless they are recentered. In stock form with there ~7" of backspacing, they would work in back. However, not up front. As they would hit the TRE.

[rustywagoneers_com]

Unmodified H1 wheels are a good choice if you have a dually front axle.

However, they will not clear the tie-rod end on your stock D44 (waggy or J20) without some amount of wheel spacer.

Personally, I would just use the stock J20 wheels. If the J20 has 16's (unlikely?) select tires accordingly. If the J20 has 16.5's then check to see if they are safety bead style wheels. If they are safety bead wheels, then you are in there like swimwear for the H1 tires. If they are not, re-group and proceed accordingly.

If you were dead set on running H1 wheels, then you need to decide if you are comfortable with running spacers in order to get a more reasonable 'effective backspacing' (and to clear the tie rod end) or if you want the hassle and expense of re-centering the wheels.

If it were my truck, I would have NO qualms about running the J20 axles as a set (they are already geared alike) and rearranging the sheetmetal as necessary.

EDIT: Stuka and I were typing at the same time.

[Heimeken]

SOA,Shackle inversion kit, and 3" body lift, with wide track cherokee axles, 35" tires.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v112/heimeken/Ouray2002/Pics_Ouray_Up01.jpg

Same setup with bushwackers
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v112/heimeken/Install-Flares/Pics_Bushwacker06_high.jpg

Same setup with D60 rear and 36" military tires.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v112/heimeken/Ouray2003/Ouray2003-13.jpg

[Greg Taylor]

SOA,Shackle inversion kit, and 3" body lift, with wide track cherokee axles, 35" tires.

Same setup with bushwackers

Same setup with D60 rear and 36" military tires.



Thanks for the pics! Would you have any shots from the rear, showing where the axles are in relation to the Bushwacker flares? Also, how does it handle off-road? Thanks!

[Elliott]

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/th_XJBushwacker1.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/?action=view&current=XJBushwacker1.jpg)

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/th_XJBushwacker2.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/?action=view&current=XJBushwacker2.jpg)

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/th_XJBushwacker3.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/?action=view&current=XJBushwacker3.jpg)

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/th_XJBushwacker4.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/?action=view&current=XJBushwacker4.jpg)

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/th_XJBushwacker5.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/Miscellaneous/?action=view&current=XJBushwacker5.jpg)

[Heimeken]

Nice pics Elliott!:thumbsup:

All of those pics, except the last one, are with the D60 rear. The last pic still had the wide-track AMC 20. As you can see the front is wider than the back(as intended), the D60 looks much better.

[Elliott]

Yep, gotta brag your stuff up for you. ;) For whatever reason the links I had from your site didn't open here... coulda been my browser, so I loaded them into my photobucket. Nice job on that rig!

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
We got the Donor J20 home on Thursday. Here are a few pics of it. It has a factory limited slip in the rear ... need to clean up the diff cover tag to see about gearing. Not too bad a truck ... I've seen way worse here in Michigan! We will start parting it soon, for the parts we want to use, and then the rest will be up for sale.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000030.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000030.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000033.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000033.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000034.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000034.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000035.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000035.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000036.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000036.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000039.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000039.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000041.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000041.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000040.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000040.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000038.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000038.jpg) http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000037.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000037.jpg)

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/th_IM000039.jpg (http://s246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/Donor%20J20/?action=view&current=IM000039.jpg)

[mrtazwrench]

That one looks clean enough to fix up by my standards, If you were closer I'd grab that bed for my plow truck.

[Greg Taylor]

That one looks clean enough to fix up by my standards, If you were closer I'd grab that bed for my plow truck.

Yeah, by Michigan standards, it's in "great" shape for a J-truck. The floor pan needs a lot of TLC for the cab area, however, the bed floor appears to be very solid. I may torch the bed off and sell that to help fund the project for Tim.

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I have updated the donation list in the first post. Thanks.

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I swapped in my Optima battery and got it to crank over .. that is ... after I vacuumed the gobs of squirrel nuts off the intake and inner fenders. I couldn't get it started with starting fluid, so a quick dribble of E85 down the carb throat and it started up! I'll be disconnecting the gas lines to the tank, since it has 3 year old gas in it.

[Elliott]

This ships tomorrow, comes with the attached mounting assembly, bushed for your brake pedal rod and includes hoses plus the 3/8" return T-fitting. The mounting assembly replaces your aluminum firewall booster block. (your hoses are in the box also)

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/HB/th_GregsHB.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/HB/?action=view&current=GregsHB.jpg)

Might want to head to the Ford dealer and ask for one of these also, it mounts in front of the radiator. The return from the box runs in to it and then the out line goes to the T-fitting:

http://i361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/HB/th_PSCooler-F250-350.jpg (http://s361.photobucket.com/albums/oo53/65Gladiator/HB/?action=view&current=PSCooler-F250-350.jpg)

[Greg Taylor]

Hey Elliott,
THANKS ... YOU DA MAN!

Hey, I have a Grand Cherokee Diesel cooler (export only) that looks a lot like that, would that work as a PS cooler? It's actually a bit larger in size than what you show. I'll have to dig it out and shoot you a pic.

Thanks so much for hooking Tim up with the HB and hoses. So, I just need to remove EVERYTHING from the firewall and bolt up your HB, then, right?

[Elliott]

Correct, if you remove the nut and then the bolt holding the brake pedal in the pedal assembly it's easier to get on the nuts for that aluminum firewall block. ;) :thumbsup:

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
The Waggy got stranded last night, on my buddy's son, and could barely get it started ... enough to limp it home.

Today, I ended up swapping out the stock Motorcraft distributor (TFI conversion) for the new HEI slated for my 304 stroker. Turns out the wiring connector between the engine harness and the distributor was really, really, really corroded BAD. Now it fires up and runs fine.

I wired the HEI into a larger ORANGE wire in the engine harness that has 12.5V ignition on, FOR NOW. Where does everyone usually wire the HEI power lead wire into ? I was going to use the RED wire on the fender Ign. Module, but it only had about 9.5V. The stock YELLOW coil wire has 12.5V, but it is very thin gauge and I did not want to use that. Any pointers on where to wire the HEI into permanently? Thanks!

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I've been messing with this thing off-n-on since we dragged it home, but couldn't get it to fire unless gas was poured down the carburetor.

Tonight I pulled the fuel filter off and it was BONE DRY. The fuel pump is bad on the truck.

So, I wired in the electric Airtek pump slated for my GW build and got it up and running. For having sat for at least 3 years and not running, it's decent.

Now that its up and running, I'll throw the rear drive shaft back into it and take it for a few spins before the part-out begins.

For those of you that have been asking about parts off the J20 ... we're getting closer to pulling them for you, so hang tight. Thanks!

[Elliott]

I haven't wired it yet and I know there are several ways to do an HEI but here is one article on it... for discussion if nothing else but you can also search up some stuff here as there have been plenty of diagrams tossed around here.

http://www.bronco.com/cms/node/25

or

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=66547

or

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=54970

[Dmntxn77]

It would be much cheaper to source TJ flares. They will fit well. Here are some pics from when I sized them up for my build.

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=88477&highlight=tj+flare

Also, you can probably make a little money for the build off of me if you want to part with that J20 tailgate... Well, depending on shipping... PM me if interested.

[BIGYELLOW78J10]

Not be negative at all, but would it be sensible to build it mildly, get it in great cosmetic condition and sell it in country with the proceeds buying a nissan or toyota 4 door 4wd diesel?

I've worked in rural Honduras for the last 15 years and while I have seen at least one FSJ on every trip, only a handful have been runners.

If the guy is mechanically inclined and you/we can provide enough parts in a timely fashion, all may be well forever.

But there is always a market for american iron and a "common" vehicle that can "borrow" parts on the wrong side of the mountain can be a plus.

Will Guatemala allow the import of a vehicle of this age? From recent discussions with other board members on the nonprofit I work with, we can't import a bus over 10 years old, but I believe buses are treated differently than passenger vehicles - and Honduras and Guatemala are very different countries, but it is worth a hard look.

Drive down through Mexico or ship? We have had good luck shipping on empty banana boats headed south to pick up their loads.

Anyway, good luck. I have mulled this same idea over and over, a fleet of FSJ's would stand out against any and everything currently in use down there.


One of the first WT cherokees I ever got a good look at was rotting away in a field, 3 hours up a dirt track off the main road.

Thanks for your efforts and committment to those working to improve the lives of others!

Daniel

[Greg Taylor]

It would be much cheaper to source TJ flares. They will fit well. Here are some pics from when I sized them up for my build.

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=88477&highlight=tj+flare

Also, you can probably make a little money for the build off of me if you want to part with that J20 tailgate... Well, depending on shipping... PM me if interested.

Hey Robert,
Thanks for the TJ flare suggestion. My only question is how to deal with the rear doors on the Waggy, with the TJ flares ... if they would clear it or not.

The tailgate is already spoken for, along with the truck bed/box. If that changes, I'll let you know.

[Greg Taylor]

Not be negative at all, but would it be sensible to build it mildly, get it in great cosmetic condition and sell it in country with the proceeds buying a nissan or toyota 4 door 4wd diesel?

Will Guatemala allow the import of a vehicle of this age? From recent discussions with other board members on the nonprofit I work with, we can't import a bus over 10 years old, but I believe buses are treated differently than passenger vehicles - and Honduras and Guatemala are very different countries, but it is worth a hard look.

Drive down through Mexico or ship? We have had good luck shipping on empty banana boats headed south to pick up their loads.

Daniel

Hi Daniel,
Thanks for the comments. It wouldn't make sense to sell the GW for a Yota 4x4 ... they are the "hot ticket" down there and are often stolen. Another missionary had 2 of them ... both got stolen, one even had a kill switch on it (thief held his wife at gun point until she showed him where the switch was).

There are some issues with importing a vehicle 10 years or older ... it just costs more $$$ ... we're currently working on those details. My parents had donated their 1978 Coachman RV to Tim a few years back and it was imported OK, just costs a bit more than a newer car.

We will probably end up driving the GW down, but they have also shipped cars in the empty cargo boxes, like you suggest.

[Dmntxn77]

Hey Robert,
Thanks for the TJ flare suggestion. My only question is how to deal with the rear doors on the Waggy, with the TJ flares ... if they would clear it or not.

The tailgate is already spoken for, along with the truck bed/box. If that changes, I'll let you know.

I am sure that you could just mount the flare to both the side panel and door then make a cut along the door seam. I am sure it wouldnt even be noticeable with the door closed. However, I dont have a waggy here to size it up, that is just a guess.

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
Now that I have the J20 running, what are your guys thoughts on selling it vs. parting it out?

If we sold it, we could put the $$ towards simply buying the parts we were interested in for the Grand Wagoneer, in the first place, and save the time involved with parting out a decent J20.

So, what are your thoughts? What would it be worth and would anyone be interested in buying it?

[Elliott]

Part it 'cause you get more and you know what I'll buy from you.:D

[rustywagoneers_com]

I vote sell it whole.

Not enough of them left in the world, and that truck is nicer than any around here.

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
We have posted the J20 up for sale at http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?p=951208#post951208 ... to see if there's any interest in buying it first, before we go ahead and part it out.

[Greg Taylor]

Hmm ... here's the corrected link to the J20 for sale post ...

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=105536

[Greg Taylor]

OK guys. We're going to go ahead with the part-out. Those of you that inquired about parts, I'll get back with you shortly ... and ... THANKS for your patience while we decided what to do with the J20.

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
The Guatemalan GW rig may be heading down to Guatemala in about 10 days, so we're trying to get everything in order for the trip down.

A couple of the aluminum rims on the GW are bent, causing a wobble/vibration. I loaned my GW's rims/tires to Tim for driving it around for the time being.

We're looking to put steel rims under it and I was thinking about the 15x8 WT Jeep 6-lug rims. I know they're 1" wider than GW rims ... what about the back spacing? Are they both the same back spacing?

Tim is wanting around a 34" tire, but from what I can see 34s are not too common. So, it may be 33s.

[Elliott]

bump for you on the question and I'm glad you are parting with the aluminum rims.:thumbsup:

[Greg Taylor]

bump for you on the question and I'm glad you are parting with the aluminum rims.:thumbsup:


Hey, I owe you some pedal pics with dimensions, don't I? :eek:

[Elliott]

Just the measurement, center to center works for me. How about some pics of this wag? :thumbsup:

[j20brett]

Tim is wanting around a 34" tire, but from what I can see 34s are not too common. So, it may be 33s.

34x10.5x15 super swamper LTBs. Excellent tires and very reasonably priced.

[Greg Taylor]

Just the measurement, center to center works for me. How about some pics of this wag? :thumbsup:

OK, I'll get that and post up a pic of the measurement on the rod.

I'll be over at Tim's place on Wednesday and will get some more pics of the Waggy.

At this point, he won't be heading down to Guatemala with it on Saturday. Too much to do and not enough time.

We do have the slotted/vented rotors and new calipers/pads installed on the front now. On to the HB next and trying to get a TBI sytem donated for it from Howell (they're somewhat "local" to us ... about 45 miles from my house).

We now have 5 15x8 FSJ steel rims donated, thanks to Dave Schultz in Livonia, MI. Now to get the 33" tires for it and the Bushwacker pocket flares.

[Elliott]

Good progress sir!:)

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
I started blasting the stock WT rims today, which were donated for the GW build. Here's the pics ... more to come.

I'll be powdercoating them once they are cleaned up good.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0258.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0261.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0620.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0622.jpg

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
Tim and I have been discussing the issue of how far apart gas stations are in areas of Mexico he will have to drive through, as compared to how for the stock 21-gallon tank will take him ... not enough with typical Waggy MPG's.

So, the 33-gallon Aerotank I scored a while back will be going on his rig. Should get him about 430-miles at 13-MPG.

Here's a pic ...

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0631.jpg

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
Got two of the 15x8 widetrack rims powdercoated today, for the Guatemalan GW build we're doing. Here is ar pics from today's fun in the garage.










http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/005.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/006.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/007.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/008.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/009.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/010.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/011.jpg







http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/015.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/016.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Eastwood%20HotCoat%20System/017.jpg

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
We bought a set of the XJ Bushwacker flairs from BJsOffroad.com and their old link to the detailed installation instructions is No longer Available. Ryan at BJs was able to point me towards the old 2007 article in Jeep Junkies magazine, which I acquired a digital download of from their website yesterday, but it's not detailed enough to satisfy the installer who will be putting these flairs on the Guatemalan GW build (http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=103008).

We are going to have to make a decision asap on to what we're going to do ... install or not install.

Can all of you guys with the XJ flairs installed, please post up BIG pics of how they're installed on your FSJ? We're looking for outside, inside, pics and as much detail as you can share regarding the modifications needed to trim the fenders/rockers and trim/form the flairs to fit the body side.

BTW, we were planning to run these flairs with a 3" suspension lift and 33x9.50x15 BFG AT's on the '87 Waggy NT axles.

Thanks all for your help, guys!

[Greg Taylor]

OK guys, I think we have the Bushwacker flair issue under control now. A local body shop guy is taking a look at them and may start installing them on monday afternoon.

Yesterday, I made an hour trip to Port Huron, MI, to pick up some 33x9.50x15 tires for the Waggy (which I didn't get ... starting to crack). I did drive by Marine City, MI, on the way home ... that's where Howell EFI is located. Suffice to say, we placed our order and the owner gave us a nice discount towards the project ... a really cool guy! TBI will be installed Monday during the day.

We also recently picked up the Killer32 front bumper that Cartman was selling ... it now resides on the front of the Waggy.

Here are the latest pics, guys!

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0805.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0806.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0807.jpg

[El_Diablo]

with the bushwackers a larger tire really would be best, 32's fit on mine with a 2 inch lift and VERY minimal rubbing under aggressive driving... i have yet to fully flex it out but im willing to bet that it wont need to be modified much to clear the tires

[Greg Taylor]

I need one Wide Track center cap for the steel 15x8 wagon wheels. I'm powdercoating them for the Guatemalan GW build and messed one of mine up beyond repair.

Eventually, I'd like to get another set of these for front and rear, since mine are going to Guatemala with my buddy's GW.

Thanks for the help, guys!

Here's a pic of what I need ... it's a rear center cap.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/100_0852.jpg

[Greg Taylor]

Got a center cap on the way, thanks!

We still need to find a good useable INNER SWIPE for the rear tailgate window .... BJ's won't have the reproduction ones in time ... Tim will be on the road to Guatemala by then.

I was going to try and take mine off, but I currently have now power to it from the front clip being off ... and hooking power to the harness for some reason the window won't go down (other stuff works ... hmmmm).

So, if anyone has an inner swipe, please let us know. Thanks guys!

[Greg Taylor]

Got the sweet $400 Champion winch (from TSC) installed ... it's on a removable receiver hitch plate.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/TimsGWwithnewWinch.jpg

[Greg Taylor]

Hey everyone,
We need the bushings for the tranny kickdown linkage on a V8/727 combo. These are for the Guatemalan GW build ... the Jeep is heading south on Sunday, so we need these like yesterday. Thanks for the help!

[Greg Taylor]

Quick update ... the Howell EFI setup was fired up today and sounds great. :thumbsup:

[j20brett]

help section at auto parts store. There are like 4 different packs for different things, get on of each and find stuff that works.

[Greg Taylor]

help section at auto parts store. There are like 4 different packs for different things, get on of each and find stuff that works.

Ok, thanks. I'll check there.

[El_Diablo]

Pictures of the fender flare install and efi?

[Greg Taylor]

Pictures of the fender flare install and efi?

Flares should be going on soon ... had to get the TBI done and next are the rear springs being re-arched and an add-a-leaf installed ... then the flares. Pics will come soon.

[Greg Taylor]

Well guys, the GW left for Guatemala last night. Today it is dead-in-the-water around Nashville. :( Not sure what's going on right now but the engine made a terrible noise and we don't have any feedback yet as to what's going on.

Is there anyone around the Nashville area that might be able to lend a hand with checking out the Waggy?

Thanks.

[Greg Taylor]

Well ... they have changed a few spark plugs that had been slammed shut by the up-hill detonation that was going on, checked everything out (looks clean), readjusted the timing and it is running GREAT. I repeat, GREAT. Apparently no piston damage ... wild.

So, they are back on the road tomorrow.

[El_Diablo]

good to hear!! pictures???

[Greg Taylor]

Hey Guys,
It took a while for them to get down there, but the GW has been in Guatemala now for over a week.

Other than the detonation/spark plug issues in Tennessee, they had to put in a new radiator in Texas. Border customs had them wait 3 days in Texas to run a back ground on the vehicle, to make sure it wasn't stolen (My buddy Tim wasn't driving it down).

In Texas, Greg (the driver ... not me), met up with another buddy and they drove the Waggy and a Toyota Tacoma down together. If they drove the Waggy conservatively, it got better mileage than the Tacoma did.

It cost $900 to import the Waggy into Guatemala ... the customs agents were pulling up Wagonmaster-like pricing to use for their "value" on the "classic vehicle" Waggy ... they were aparently looking for a bribe to get a better "value".

So, it is now in Guatemala and running fine ... it could use a new hood latch cable, though ... does anyone have one?

[Greg Taylor]

ttt

[Greg Taylor]

Hey guys,
My buddy Tim is heading to Guatemala, from MI, on 7/25. He needs to take down a fan shroud with him, since they busted a DS engine mount and the motor torqued up, busting the fan shroud.

If anyone has one, please let me know. The Guatemalan GW is a 1986. Thanks! :thumbsup:

[shimniok]

Failing a new one... if they still have the old one, you might be able to repair the damaged circular part of it (which is what usually goes) with some sheet aluminum, careful drilling, and pop rivets...

[Greg Taylor]

Failing a new one... if they still have the old one, you might be able to repair the damaged circular part of it (which is what usually goes) with some sheet aluminum, careful drilling, and pop rivets...

It sounds like it's pretty much toasted now, otherwise repairing it would be done.

[austinaubinoe]

Any update on this?

[CutterN55]

^^^
What he said! I was wondering what happened with this one!

[Greg Taylor]

Any update on this?

Tim's crew is still running the Wagoneer all over Guatemala. It's had a new paint job and running strong. Currently, he's having issues with gas coming out of the gas cap, when on steep grades....

My buddy Tim says that when they're going up steep grades in Guatemala, gas will squirt out around the gas cap, when the tank is full. It looks like the weight of the fuel is causing enough pressure to push the gas back up the filler hose, to the filler neck. Since the cap is vented ... gas spurts out.

Please note that this is the 33 gallon steel main tank, made by Aerotanks.com

Is anyone who has one of these tanks, and wheels in the mountains, experiencing the same issues? Does anyone have any suggestions or FIXES for this?

Thanks for the input everyone!

[Metal Twister]

:worthless:

[Greg Taylor]

Here are a couple of pics of the Wagoneer in Guatemala.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/WaggyinGuatemala01.jpg

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg116/amundaza/Guatemalan%20GW%20Build/WaggyinGuatemala02.jpg

[Stuka]

Cool photos!

Sounds like the seal on the cap is bad. They are vented, but the holw is very very small. On my cherokee it was the rubber around the cap that was bad.

[austinaubinoe]

Thats FREAKING AWSOME!!!! Just noticed the updated thread in a search.